[Character Graphics Update]: Second Benchmark Worries

[Plushy]

I'm not worried because we're getting a second benchmark. I'm actually just worried from the feedback they might add.

I made a post 2 days ago highlighting there are quite a lot of people happy with the character update.
But reading some people's feedback, specifically about female au ra had me worried SE might use their feedback to revert changes.(I'm not referring to bugs mind you)

For example; Me and my girlfriend are a huge fan of female au ra larger pupil changes.
It makes a already cute doll like race even more cute.
Writing this part on behalf of myself and my girlfriend because she's in love with the new look of the female au ra, the new look makes her excited to change race to au ra and play it (and me as well as one of my main is a female au ra) but the thought of that going away come either full release or the new benchmark makes her quite unsettled and myself.
I think in order to please as much people as possible I think major visual changes such as the eyes/pupils. I believe making it a select-able option is the best possible solution to make everybody happy if SE is planning to make huge changes like that.
That way the people that prefer the new update can enjoy their new look and the people that like the smaller tiny pupil can be happy.

I also like the lighter eyebrows as well and on the fourms I know that also haven't been popular.
Here is my other post that showcased some popular posts from other social media: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...itive-Feedback

Are their any worries you have SE might add to the new benchmark due to feedback? are you worried as well they might revert too many changes?

And as always.
Thank you FFXIV Development Team for all your hardwork and swift communication about the benchmark and showing everybody you care.
Take care of yourselves!

[AluneTempest]

I think they will just adjust the bugs and lightning on the character creator, i dont think they will make drastically changes in 2 months before the release date but yeah, im a bit worried because i really like how my character looks on the update and understand the people that don't like the changes.
Is better if they put more effort on remake the character creator and this way bring more options to customize our character in the future.
Make more options is the only way for both sides to be happy.

[AdlerTakamura]

Options would be the only way to keep both sides happy.

Person A: OMG I hate the new eyebrows, Square Enix better change them back
Person B: OMG I love the new eyebrows, Square Enix better keep them

Only way to make them happy is to offer both eyebrow options.
Just an example.

[Arkdra]

Options would be the only way to keep both sides happy.

Person A: OMG I hate the new eyebrows, Square Enix better change them back
Person B: OMG I love the new eyebrows, Square Enix better keep them

Only way to make them happy is to offer both eyebrow options.
Just an example.

This doesn't strike me as feasible. Admittedly, I know very little in general about this sort of thing so someone with actual experience can correct me, but they added tons of new bones to the models in the graphics update. The new bones are going to be used to animate cutscenes, emotes, etc. so if they had the old rigs and new rigs split up, they'd have to do 2 different versions of every cutscene and emote to accommodate for this difference in what can be done with the brows, eyes, face, and tongue (which previously had no bones apparently but does now).

[LordMcMutton]

This doesn't strike me as feasible. Admittedly, I know very little in general about this sort of thing so someone with actual experience can correct me, but they added tons of new bones to the models in the graphics update. The new bones are going to be used to animate cutscenes, emotes, etc. so if they had the old rigs and new rigs split up, they'd have to do 2 different versions of every cutscene and emote to accommodate for this difference in what can be done with the brows, eyes, face, and tongue (which previously had no bones apparently but does now).

From what I understand, they shifted to a method where they have a single basemesh for all heads, then use a technique called Shape Keys to 'morph' that base head into the races and their Face variations.

The benefit of this method is that they only have to rig the face once, and it then is present for all of said variations, meaning that all they have to do is edit the existing Shape Keys, or add new Shape Keys. And since the issue is that the new morphs don't follow the original models closely enough, all they need to do is finesse them a bit more.

[smashBG]

From what I understand, they shifted to a method where they have a single basemesh for all heads, then use a technique called Shape Keys to 'morph' that base head into the races and their Face variations.

The benefit of this method is that they only have to rig the face once, and it then is present for all of said variations, meaning that all they have to do is edit the existing Shape Keys, or add new Shape Keys. And since the issue is that the new morphs don't follow the original models closely enough, all they need to do is finesse them a bit more.

This... makes a lot of sense, actually. If I'm not mistaken, this is how clothing is already handled. They don't make a separate mesh for each race, they make two or three for different body types (midlander, lalafell, sometimes highlander) and then use shape keys to tailor them to each race's specific proportions.

Makes me wonder at the possibility of face sliders if/when the character creator receives an overhaul.

[LordMcMutton]

This... makes a lot of sense, actually. If I'm not mistaken, this is how clothing is already handled. They don't make a separate mesh for each race, they make two or three for different body types (midlander, lalafell, sometimes highlander) and then use shape keys to tailor them to each race's specific proportions.

Makes me wonder at the possibility of face sliders if/when the character creator receives an overhaul.

Roegadyn, too!

Face sliders are something I really hope we get at some point- basically every game with character creation face sliders in the past has been executed with Shape Keys, so the foundation is already there now

[Absurdity]

This... makes a lot of sense, actually. If I'm not mistaken, this is how clothing is already handled. They don't make a separate mesh for each race, they make two or three for different body types (midlander, lalafell, sometimes highlander) and then use shape keys to tailor them to each race's specific proportions.

Makes me wonder at the possibility of face sliders if/when the character creator receives an overhaul.

For the body and clothes they're not even using shapekeys as far as I know, female hyur, miqo'te, roegadyn, au ra, viera and elezen all just use the midlander body with different bone scaling applied.

Shapekeys morph the model itself but they need to be done for every individual model since they have different amounts of polygons and vertices and shapekeys tend to break when the amount of them changes. This is why the face shapes don't look quite the same as they did before, they needed to remake the shapekeys for the new updated head models.

Bone scaling on the other hand manipulates the skeleton underneath, it is more limited in what it can do (while still looking acceptable) but applies to all models rigged to said bones. It's how they make most races look different without having to create 17 different versions of the same armor, with bone scaling they only need to make a unique model for male roegadyn, female midlander, male midlander, male highlander (for some reason) and lalafell.

As for the sliders, in 3D modeling programs the shapekeys are already a slider. Now I have no idea how the game handles those specifically, but my assumption is that it picks a fixed point on those sliders to use as the 4-5 customization options for every part of the face.

[Loggos]

Options would be the only way to keep both sides happy.

Person A: OMG I hate the new eyebrows, Square Enix better change them back
Person B: OMG I love the new eyebrows, Square Enix better keep them

Only way to make them happy is to offer both eyebrow options.
Just an example.

Seconding this. Especially with mouth options I really think we need more variety. Right now each face basically has one type of mouth shape in the editions: thin, medium, large, slightly compressed medium.
I can really see how some people prefer the new mouth shapes because they do allow for a different type of customisation in a face.

I think if it is in any way possible players should be able to keep their current customisation options* (updated ofc) because many of us did not only choose them out of necessity but because they really resonated with us. But diversifying feature choices by adding the new ones from the current benchmark seems important to me too. They have already put in the work to create the new features after all. That doesn't need go to waste either.

(E.g., I don't think the new mounth shape on female au ra face 4 is objectively worse than the current one, nor is it better. But it's one that also happens to perfectly fit my taste. The new one just doesn't do it for me. To other people the new mouth shape may be a lot more appealing according to their personal taste.)

*(I also don't mean to say they have to delay DT for this. I don't know what the best approach would be. Whether it's doing the graphic update as planned and reintroducing the old features later, fixing everything in 2 months before the launch (not sure this is possible) or postponing the update (but not DT) and then implementing a more polished upgrade later, that hopefully caters to the wishes of those who liked the old features and those who liked the new ones? Speaking for myself, if I knew they'd reintroduce the old options in later patches then I'd be content.)

[Scintilla]

Options would be the only way to keep both sides happy.

Person A: OMG I hate the new eyebrows, Square Enix better change them back
Person B: OMG I love the new eyebrows, Square Enix better keep them

Only way to make them happy is to offer both eyebrow options.
Just an example.

More options sounds like the best outcome to better suit everyone, though, judging by other posts, it sounds like it wouldn't be a straightforward thing to do for technical reasons. In this case, I presume the same would apply to a toggle, as others have suggested in the past. I would very much hope that's not the case, but I also want to be realistic.

Even if it came to the point that completely identical features weren't able to be returned without going back to the old facial structure (which sounds like it would be problematic for various reasons, including animations), giving more available options might help everyone to find something closer to what they like/their old look. An increase in options has been long overdue anyway.

Are their any worries you have SE might add to the new benchmark due to feedback? are you worried as well they might revert too many changes?

I'm 'curious' about how these new benchmark changes will look, rather than 'worried'. For the most part, I quite liked the changes: the environment looked far, far better; hands and feet were a whole different level; and I was okay with how my Hyur and Miqote looked. My Vieras a bit less so, but a bit of adjustment to one should hopefully fix it (or maybe even that won't be needed after this benchmark change) and the other might still be changing to Elezen. But all in all, I was pleasantly surprised by the changes so I somewhat hope they don't take too much of a jump backwards following feedback.