[Dawntrail Benchmark] Feedback on eyes, eyelashes and eyelids

[Aco505]

The purpose of this thread is to provide feedback on the graphical update related to eyes but also eyelashes for male characters and eyelids.

Overall, I believe it's been an improvement even though there's plenty of players more or less dissatisfied due to different reasons such as pupil size changes for some races.

Another common complaint has been the "dead inside" look that eyes seem to have now. It's likely related to the lighting changes, since eye color brightness adjusts depending on the amount of light present.

However, eyes should have more "life" even in darker environments. The two pictures below exemplify the changes:



We can notice that the difference in brightness has modified the eye color even though in theory it's the same. There should be a way to find a middle ground but of course we'll have to see in game to be fully sure. Otherwise, it might force players to choose lighter colors to try to achieve their previous eye color.

One thing I find a bit jarring is that the sclera (white part) of the eye is perhaps too white compared to before. It should probably be milder.

The Seeker slit pupils also seem less pronounced with the change but at the same time their shape looks more natural now.

Something that disappointed me though were the eyelids. While there's been an improvement, especially for the upper eyelids, they overall look the same as before. The lower eyelids in particular still look a bit low res to me.

Additionally, there's still these weird darker spots just below the eyeliner, where the lower eyelids start on the side of the face away from the nose. The skin should just be smooth and have the same color there. You can check it in the picture below:



Finally, eyelashes on male characters (there could be specific differences in other races) are still quite tame and only present in the upper eyelids. They should appear in the lower ones and having options to choose their size or whether their color is the same as our hair's should exist.

Are you fine with the changes to eyes, eyelids or eyelashes? Which things would you like to stay and which ones would you like improved or added?

[mallleable]

Seeker, Face 2, Eye Shape 6



The tear duct area is not as pronounced in the benchmark version, and makes eyes a little less fierce, and catlike.

[Tethan]

For male viera, one of my greatest concern is the "nerf" of their unique dyeable lashes.


As seen on this pictures, the white eyelashes are not clearly visible in the character creator.


In the benchmark trailer, the lashes only appear white when exposed to direct sunlight, while the side in shadow does not appear white.


Benchmark, not visible lashes.


Live game at similar scale, lashes are still clearly visible.

[Aimed]

In the benchmark trailer, the lashes only appear white when exposed to direct sunlight, while the side in shadow does not appear white.

Huh that is actually very interesting, there's some other bug where thick lashes appear on fem characters in shadow and look normal/natural in full sunlight. It's gotta be the same core issue.

[Pip_Chick]

This is one of my retainers, his eyes definitely changed. I initially chose this option because they were the only ones to not look angry and give him a softer/gentler look, but now it seems like he is in a perpetual state of fear or shock.

Before:


After:

[AdlerTakamura]

Here's some feedback for Hyur Midlander Female FACE 1 eyebrows.
While all other 4 faces show very detailed colored eyebrows, FACE 1 only show very very minimum change in hue from face to face. Here I used dark skin and light eyebrows to illustrate how FACE 1 eyebrows only look very partially yellow and mostly just a dark blur, while FACE 5 has very clear and defined eyebrows.

Can we at least have the OPTION to have our FACE 1 eyebrows display proper colors?

[Fenefab]

Posted about my issues with F viera face 2 eyes in the viera changes thread too. In the old 6.0 version the upper eyelid crease is clearly visible, but in the 7.0 version it's not there at all/it's hidden under the black makeup, making the eye area look very flat and lacking dimension. There is also a lot of unnecessary dark black/grey shading under the eyelashes making the eye color and the eyes in general look very dark and the eyelashes look too thick.


Another comparison with eyelash and makeup facial features removed and using a lighter eye color so the shadows etc can be seen better. Note the stark difference with the upper and lower eyelid creases/highlights as well.

[Cheapshot]

Moon miqo’te face 4 got hit very very hard by this. I think it might have been done to cover what someone considered an imperfection or unusual section of the eye in this case. The lash was brought down right to the eyeball line and looks like falsies. Probably to mask that whole area? Just my guess. I’m not a fan of this change.

[Cheapshot]

I don’t know why it took me so long to try looking at my character when she closes her eyes to see what’s behind the new huge lashes…



Edit: adding some images because someone else wasn’t sure what I was pointing out specifically.

[Iscah]

However, what annoyed me the most were the eyes. When I look at my character, it feels to me like he's falling asleep now.

Moon miqo’te face 4 got hit very very hard by this. I think it might have been done to cover what someone considered an imperfection or unusual section of the eye in this case. The lash was brought down right to the eyeball line and looks like falsies. Probably to mask that whole area? Just my guess. I’m not a fan of this change.

I've been staring at the character faces a lot lately trying to make sense of it, and I'm beginning to piece it together.

Basically, all the eyes now are variations on the structure of the Moonkeeper eye shape above, with a dark flesh-coloured area inside the eyelash base line that primarily must be intended as the inner rim of the eyelid (seeing the upper eyelid is a bit odd maybe, but that's how they've done it), but gets weird when combined with some eyelash shapes.

For faces with eyelashes that angle downwards over the eye (male Miqo'te faces, for example), the distance between eyelash line and the top of the eyeball is unnaturally far, and I think in these cases it is actually being used to create the illusion of thick eyelashes obscuring or shadowing the eye, so the eye should actually be drawn bigger than it is.

However, for the benchmark, this zone between eyelashes and eye has been handled quite differently and strangely, and I think this is creating many (but not all) of the issues with eye shapes.

Generally the upper half is now being coloured in this heavy black makeup instead of skin colour, and/or the eyelash line is being moved down to meet the top of the eye - it is hard to tell without being able to zoom in closer than we are allowed.

So the eye size is nominally staying the same in most cases, but the structure of the surrounding eyelid is changing and many characters are being given heavier makeup than before. This may also be what is making male eyelashes look shorter, because now they are getting lost in the haze of the black makeup.

I have a counterintuitive and possibly controversial suspicion that the true solution for updating some characters' eyes might actually be to make their eyes bigger but have the upper part very shadowed. I think that illusion is currently being cast, and it's only this close searching that has made me notice the illusion at all.