QoL and reducing number of the buttons suggestion

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

But we're already there for most jobs if you don't include abilities that can't be bound and pure aoe skills that never get used outside dungeons.
also Bonus challenge, anyone that wants pvp combos in pve. Go hit the pvp dummies for 9~ min and tell me if you actually had fun playing with a pvp kit against a boss that can't react to your actions, can't crowd control, can't run away from you, and doesn't do anything unscripted.

Not really. Every job I play has more than 30.




And I'm not talking about gcds. I want less ogcds overall.

[ZiraZ]

this is the point of confusion im talking about when this topic gets brought up and everyone gets panties in a wad..
you dont actually have an issue with pvp combos, it's the entirety of scripted pve combat based on a gcd.

I don't have an issue with pvp combos in pvp because the pvp filler is mostly meaningless busywork to keep low pressure on the enemy, the core of the pvp kit is using cooldowns to try and burst people down or put enough pressure to outdamage their defenses while they try to do the same to you with crowd control added into the mix.
In PvE the point of the filler busywork is to make the least amount of mistakes possible while the boss throws mechanics at you, and to anyone that says the typical PvE 1-2-3 combo is impossible to ever screwup or calls it braindead is straight up LYING, specially when progging and still learning the fight. When the encounter throws a mechanic that requires spatial awareness or spinning things in your head or whatever, the very simple action of maintaining a 1-2-3 combo becomes a decent challenge when mixed with mechanics and puts pressure into the encounter as a whole. But people love to downplay this, maybe because they are all 100 parsing gods, maybe because they've cleared the fight 200 times? idk

[Mr_Gyactus]

this is the point of confusion im talking about when this topic gets brought up and everyone gets panties in a wad..
you dont actually have an issue with pvp combos, it's the entirety of scripted pve combat based on a gcd.

No, I have problem with PVP combo and abilities set, it's boring.
The fun part of pvp is the adrenaline of a fight vs someone unpredictable.
The boring part is press the same button over and over.

16-20 pvp abilities would be optimal, but it's clear that pvp is a niche and SE does not want to lose too much time thinking how to balance 21 jobs with 20 different abilities.

[Shougun]

Personally, and yes that means imo, don't agree that pressing a button in and of itself is enough to be fun / worthwhile. That is 1 2 3 is not better than 1 1 1, and if anything is more annoying as it takes up space that I would rather use for other abilities.

I like buttons that register important concepts, but I don't really appreciate buttons that are BLUE DAMAGE RED DAMAGE BLACK DAMAGE BLUE DAMAGE BUT EVEN FLASHIER. You could smash a few of these jobs down to like 12 abilities and I'd be cool with that. 1 2 3 is no better than 1 1 1 when the purpose of both is filler. That's where I like the PvP kits as there is, almost, always a reason a button is different.

To add onto that a button that is different only in "moron choice or correct choice" is also not that valuable. As we do have some of those, where it's the "you don't know how your job works" if you used it vs you do know. That said I'd also like to say that different playstyle jobs should exist, even if they are just a few deviations from the middle goal, so that you represent a larger audience. In case someone is like a nurgle bloat god that only wants buttons because buttons are pretty (even if they're essentially the same button spread across many....), and then you have smooth matter Steve. Everyone wins lol (unfortunately we don't have specs for jobs as it could be fun to see your job represented in many different styles or roles, but I assume such an idea would mean a lot less jobs released.. so you win some and lose some with that).

[Deceptus]

I think the easiest and most common sense consolidation should be:

Any skill that is a **direct** requirement for another: Should be the same dynamically changing button.

See: Dragoon High Jump - Mirage Dive

AST: Draw and Play should be the same button,

Which would include the basic 1-2-3 buttons. They do nothing but add bloat. vs a single dynamic button.

[ZiraZ]

I think the easiest and most common sense consolidation should be:

Any skill that is a **direct** requirement for another: Should be the same dynamically changing button.

See: Dragoon High Jump - Mirage Dive

AST: Draw and Play should be the same button,

Which would include the basic 1-2-3 buttons. They do nothing but add bloat. vs a single dynamic button.

You cannot do this to HJ, they tried mid EW and it was then hotfixed (twice I think?) followed by a complete reversion for a VERY good reason, if you want to consolidate skills at least know the consequences associated with it.
You are calling things bloat but don't even know the consequences it brings. HJ and Mirage are NOT bloat there is a very good reason why they are separate buttons.
I don't play enough AST but I also think you would want to be able to redraw not just blindly throw cards without being able to redraw.
Consolidating can be good (see Minor Arcana) but you have to be very sure of what you're doing or it ends up hurting the job.

[ASkellington]

You cannot do this to HJ, they tried mid EW and it was then hotfixed (twice I think?) followed by a complete reversion for a VERY good reason, if you want to consolidate skills at least know the consequences associated with it.
You are calling things bloat but don't even know the consequences it brings. HJ and Mirage are NOT bloat there is a very good reason why they are separate buttons.
I don't play enough AST but I also think you would want to be able to redraw not just blindly throw cards without being able to redraw.
Consolidating can be good (see Minor Arcana) but you have to be very sure of what you're doing or it ends up hurting the job.

Redraw is its own separate button. There's no reason why Draw/Play should be separate.

[CaptainLagbeard]

1-2-3 is objectively more fun than 1-1-1.
It's objective fact and cannot be disputed.

Now mind you the act of pressing buttons on their own isn't exactly fun. These thresholds are very very limited.

Yes, it is. But at the same time if they want to add more skills, Action Bars start getting full... So instead of using 3 buttons (or 5 in DRGs case) for a combo, they could use 1 button to make more room.

[mallleable]

Yes, it is. But at the same time if they want to add more skills, Action Bars start getting full... So instead of using 3 buttons (or 5 in DRGs case) for a combo, they could use 1 button to make more room.

Lance Charge can be a low level Dragon Sight, and later upgrade to Dragon Sight
Dragon Fire Dive can be a low level version of Stardiver, and later upgrades to Stardiver
Life Surge could probably be removed or its effect baked into an existing gcd

There are many way to consolidate skills before even touching combos.

[CidHeiral]

I love how the first page of this forum currently has threads complaining that the game is too dumbed down and threads asking for the game to be dumbed down. Hats off to the devs that have to make sense of it all.