Cure and it's Equivalents need to be axed

[Mimilu]

The game doesn't really teach people how healing "works" in XIV (i.e. healing being more focused on special mechanics and/or oGCD heals vs being based more on vanilla GCD heals and oGCDs and special mechanics being used more strategically). (＃￣A￣)

[TaleraRistain]

The problem with saying those should be axed is that the examples you gave have charges. Cure spam is bad but I'm not sure this solution would be much better because they would spam one of those and run out of charges and since they don't touch the other healing abilities they wouldn't be healing at all.

I do think the game could try to offer some more guidance on this though not sure what. The sage instance that you go through as part of the sage quests was pretty good. If they could use that idea and extend on it, that might be one way the game could help outline how these abilities work together effectively.

[finalchlomega]

That would be great - ineffective healing should result in zero MP!!!,
There should be consequences to bad/poor play! Maybe they will learn for once LOL

I think this is a good thing to consider as well. At the moment in the game's Job design, there is no failure state where not playing properly results in a punishment (except for wiping or being defeated). Back in Shadowbringers, Black Mage in particular had their failure state of dropping Astral Fire or Umbral Ice multiple times in a row being that they couldn't activate Enochian and lose the ability to use Fire IV, and Blizzard IV, while being unable to charge Polyglot stacks. In Endwalker, the action Enochian was removed and turned into a trait, and because of that aside from losing your current charge time of Polyglot and losing out on DPS, there is no punishment for dropping Astral Fire or Umbral Ice.

[Solakor]

The game doesn't really teach people how healing "works" in XIV (i.e. healing being more focused on special mechanics and/or oGCD heals vs being based more on vanilla GCD heals and oGCDs and special mechanics being used more strategically). (＃￣A￣)

You literally have other buttons that come automatically on your hotbar. Ppl won't learn if they don't want to no matter what kinda system you put there to help them. If ppl were more inquisitive and tried things out this wouldn't be an issue. It's not that hard to actually just try stuff.

[Jeeqbit]

The truth is, it is very difficult to give advice to a stranger in a dungeon. You don't know them and they don't know you, so their automatic assumption is that someone blurting out "advice" is being rude, demanding or elitist. Often, the people giving advice don't realize that, to everyone else, it looks like they are "blurting it out aggressively", regardless of their actual intent. How aggressive it looks does depend a lot on if you've had a long prior conversation before it where you've become their friend, which there isn't usually time for in a dungeon unless the tank says brb.

It is easier to give advice like this in an environment where you have established trust, such as in a Free Company chat, Novice Network chat or while waiting for a party to fill in Party Finder.

Anyway, I don't care if a healer does this. Their job is to keep us alive and as long as they do that, I'm happy. Almost any button on their hotbar achieves "keeping us alive" because almost all of them heal us.

If they ever do high-end content, it is very likely someone will point out to them that they aren't doing it well. When you join a High-End party, you know you are subjecting yourself to a higher level of scrutiny and that is why a lot of people never get into High-End content. They know that in that content they are being judged far more and that makes some people too anxious to even get into it.

[finalchlomega]

The problem with saying those should be axed is that the examples you gave have charges. Cure spam is bad but I'm not sure this solution would be much better because they would spam one of those and run out of charges and since they don't touch the other healing abilities they wouldn't be healing at all.

I do think the game could try to offer some more guidance on this though not sure what. The sage instance that you go through as part of the sage quests was pretty good. If they could use that idea and extend on it, that might be one way the game could help outline how these abilities work together effectively.

That is why I mentioned in another reply that Cure II should be the fallback once you have your charges, as then if you go through all of your ability charges, you still have a viable way of healing but one that shouldn't be overused due to the MP cost.

[finalchlomega]

Their job is to keep us alive and as long as they do that, I'm happy. Almost any button on their hotbar achieves "keeping us alive" because almost all of them heal us.

The problem with that sentiment, is that by spamming their weakest healing spells, they are unable to keep us alive, therefore not doing the job that they signed up for. These people don't use anything but those spells and it leads to constant wipes but because of their refusal to try something different, they become a detriment to the party.

[Zeastria]

The game doesn't really teach people how healing "works" in XIV (i.e. healing being more focused on special mechanics and/or oGCD heals vs being based more on vanilla GCD heals and oGCDs and special mechanics being used more strategically). (＃￣A￣)

That's true, because healers can get through all content just spamming cure I and medica II ..and the likes w/o much consequences..
( They often get carried by co-healer, since you rarly see 2 in same party)
The main blame can be placed on the game itself, They are after all a biproduct of ffxiv's bad heal design.

[Mimilu]

You literally have other buttons that come automatically on your hotbar. Ppl won't learn if they don't want to no matter what kinda system you put there to help them. If ppl were more inquisitive and tried things out this wouldn't be an issue. It's not that hard to actually just try stuff.

Think of it like this:
The only healer new players can play out of the gate is CNJ/WHM.
They get their first oGCD, Benediction, at 50. It can heal a target 100% and has a 3-minute cooldown.
They get their first Lily-spell, Afflatus Solace, at 52.
Going from their first 50 levels, they don't have a special mechanic yet and their first oGCD heal sounds powerful and has a longer cooldown, making it seem like oGCD heals are emergency buttons.
Spamming Cure has kind of been ingrained into them, especially if they are in the mindset that they have to diligently focus only on healing or else the party will wipe if they aren't kept at 100%. (⋟﹏⋞)

[Jeeqbit]

The problem with that sentiment, is that by spamming their weakest healing spells, they are unable to keep us alive, therefore not doing the job that they signed up for. These people don't use anything but those spells and it leads to constant wipes but because of their refusal to try something different, they become a detriment to the party.

Maybe it is just the way I tank that means it doesn't matter.

A tank can take 75% of the burden, 50% or the burden or 25% of the burden, to give some examples.

75% of the burden would be where I tank with the assumption I will get no heals at all. I manage my cooldowns in such a way that if I get no heals, I will survive for absolutely ages, for example using mitigation, arm's length, then invuln, then kiting. By that point I've given them 20-60 seconds to heal me at least, depending on the incoming damage. Obviously this isn't relevant except in old dungeons or leveling dungeons which hit hard. I get by on a rare Cure spell if I do this. I just need that little, 1% of effort by the healer to survive.

50% would be where I'm doing a good amount of work but could do more, but I don't because the healer is meeting me half way and doing more than I need them to.

25% would be where the healer is literally doing everything, to the point I don't even need cooldowns because they are spamming heals on me, so I don't even bother doing anything.

I tank with the assumption I am carrying 75% of the burden normally, so if I run into a healer that is "unable to keep us alive", they still manage to keep me alive because 1 cure spell every 20 seconds is really all I need if I juggle my abilities just right.