Another MMO?

[Enkidoh]

Wasn't the original Final Fantasy a risk? Wasn't pretty much every choice Square makes a risk? What about the billions of gacha games they make yearly and shut down in two months? Those aren't risks?

Except there is no real market for new MMOs anymore, it's a different time now to what it was like 20 years ago when MMORPGs were the newest thing in gaming following the lead of the likes of Everquest and Runescape, and thus everyone wanted a piece of the action, especially when WoW then came along and revolutionised the genre. Back then, everyone wanted to 'kill' WoW and take it's place as top MMO dog. Although FFXIV ARR didn't kill WoW (WoW was more slain by it's own maker), FFXIV did give it a broken nose, a sprained arm, a bloodied lip and two black eyes, especially with Shadowbringers' critical success and acclaim.

So, really FFXIV has reached that 'sweet' spot MMOs have been aspiring to, so there is no reason for SE to waste precious time, money and manpower making a whole new game when FFXIV itself will continue to grow and flourish (as it is the next expansion will be featuring a graphic overhaul so it's clear SE aren't interested in making a new FF MMO to replace FFXIV).

[Ath192]

Except there is no real market for new MMOs anymore, it's a different time now to what it was like 20 years ago when MMORPGs were the newest thing in gaming following the lead of the likes of Everquest and Runescape, and thus everyone wanted a piece of the action, especially when WoW then came along and revolutionised the genre. Back then, everyone wanted to 'kill' WoW and take it's place as top MMO dog. Although FFXIV ARR didn't kill WoW (WoW was more slain by it's own maker), FFXIV did give it a broken nose, a sprained arm, a bloodied lip and two black eyes, especially with Shadowbringers' critical success and acclaim.

So, really FFXIV has reached that 'sweet' spot MMOs have been aspiring to, so there is no reason for SE to waste precious time, money and manpower making a whole new game when FFXIV itself will continue to grow and flourish (as it is the next expansion will be featuring a graphic overhaul so it's clear SE aren't interested in making a new FF MMO to replace FFXIV).

What I find interesting about this self sabotaging behavior in players is that since we are in the forums, I can only assume we are all fans of the genre, but its like people don't want there to be newer and better MMOs coming out. Regardless of your feelings, SE will make a new MMO and most people will jump ship, just like they did with XI. Making XIV solo friendly via trusts is only a means to enable putting this game out on maintenance mode so people can play it in the future in case they want to revisit older FF titles. This game is following the trajectory XI did.

Not only will SE invest in a new MMO, XIV will start to wane and lose players instead of grow, the formula is stale, the jobs are homogenized, the updates aren't frequent and big enough. The main story has ended. SHB - EW was the peak.

This statement is basically endorsing complacency. It's fine guys... lets just keep it as is. Probably the worst business tactic to use out there, for ANY business.

[Jeeqbit]

its like people don't want there to be newer and better MMOs coming out.

It's great for there to be a new game, but I am only interested in certain IPs such as Final Fantasy. So for example, why should I play New World? I don't care about it, its lore or its story. Why should I play Ashes of Creation? I don't care about it, its lore or its story either. Graphics aren't everything to me.

Making XIV solo friendly via trusts is only a means to enable putting this game out on maintenance mode so people can play it in the future in case they want to revisit older FF titles. This game is following the trajectory XI did.

It will be useful should it ever become like XI, but it is nowhere near that point. It is actually a tactic to grow the game. Get people who "only play solo Final Fantasy games" to play FF14. In passing, they may have a conversation with someone and end up in a Free Company and get dragged into the social environment. It's smart, really, because a lot of people who play an MMORPG are initially quite anxious and don't want to interact with anyone, but fall into the social environment when they bump into someone.

Not only will SE invest in a new MMO, XIV will start to wane and lose players instead of grow

It's possible. History says it happens to every MMORPG except WoW, after all. However, WoW is proof they can endure. In the age of AI, it's possible any tangled spaghetti can be undone efficiently so that a game can modernize. So we'll just have to see.

the formula is stale

To you. People have been saying that since Heavensward and Stormblood. Because it was a formula even then. "Oh the next raid tier will be 4 alexander raids, 2 dungeons, 2 extremes and an alliance raid". Yes, so what?

The main story has ended.

Not true, but you know this.

SHB - EW was the peak.

Could be. I'll agree that the viral moment seemed like it could be a peak moment. But it remains to be seen. Neither of us are fortune tellers, and it could go viral again somehow or just continue to grow to have a persistent population that is higher than that viral moment.

This statement is basically endorsing complacency. It's fine guys... lets just keep it as is. Probably the worst business tactic to use out there, for ANY business.

The worst business tactic would be to throw away a game that is at the current height of its success statistically (a higher persistent population than in prior expansions), put it in maintenance mode and focus all efforts on a new MMORPG.

[Ath192]

It's great for there to be a new game, but I am only interested in certain IPs such as Final Fantasy. So for example, why should I play New World? I don't care about it, its lore or its story. Why should I play Ashes of Creation? I don't care about it, its lore or its story either. Graphics aren't everything to me.

It will be useful should it ever become like XI, but it is nowhere near that point. It is actually a tactic to grow the game. Get people who "only play solo Final Fantasy games" to play FF14. In passing, they may have a conversation with someone and end up in a Free Company and get dragged into the social environment. It's smart, really, because a lot of people who play an MMORPG are initially quite anxious and don't want to interact with anyone, but fall into the social environment when they bump into someone.

It's possible. History says it happens to every MMORPG except WoW, after all. However, WoW is proof they can endure. In the age of AI, it's possible any tangled spaghetti can be undone efficiently so that a game can modernize. So we'll just have to see.

To you. People have been saying that since Heavensward and Stormblood. Because it was a formula even then. "Oh the next raid tier will be 4 alexander raids, 2 dungeons, 2 extremes and an alliance raid". Yes, so what?

Not true, but you know this.

Could be. I'll agree that the viral moment seemed like it could be a peak moment. But it remains to be seen. Neither of us are fortune tellers, and it could go viral again somehow or just continue to grow to have a persistent population that is higher than that viral moment.

The worst business tactic would be to throw away a game that is at the current height of its success statistically (a higher persistent population than in prior expansions), put it in maintenance mode and focus all efforts on a new MMORPG.

I hate to break it to you but unless we save the galaxy again everything else we do won't be as consequential, and saving the galaxy twice in the same game seems excessive. So the story going forward may be interesting but it won't be as big. As far as you not being interested in other games or MMOs it's your loss really. I mean just because you want to stay stuck and not pick any more interests that is not a good reason for SE or anyone to not invest in newer mmos or titles. You'll just be the person that never moved on.

In general doing the same thing you have always done and never trying new things is not the best way to live life, but if it makes you happy so be it. Usually when a game is at its height it has nowhere to go but down. So I agree this game shouldn't go into maintenance mode just yet, just like XI didn't when XIV was first announced, but it is time to start investing in the new generation.

The same way you don't have kids when you are 70, you do it in the prime of your life because thats when you have the energy and resources to do it. It's common sense. If they wait for this MMO to die then they'll be like, you know what its a dying genre, maybe we should take all our money and put into mobile gacha games and NFTs instead. This doesn't benefit you, or any of us.

[Jeeqbit]

I hate to break it to you but unless we save the galaxy again everything else we do won't be as consequential, and saving the galaxy twice in the same game seems excessive. So the story going forward may be interesting but it won't be as big.

I know it feels that way. But when you actually play it, I think it will be as if Dawntrail is a different game. I mean, you've saved the galaxy in this game, but if you play another game, you might just be taking care of a local corrupt politician. So if you just think of Dawntrail as a different game, then what's the difference?

I've mentioned this before, but no matter how strong and powerful you are, you can lose. There are many boxers and UFC fighters that were once unbeaten and eventually got beat. They were invincible, never-losing fighters just like the Warrior of Light and some person just beat them after winning for years or even decades.

As far as you not being interested in other games or MMOs it's your loss really. I mean just because you want to stay stuck and not pick any more interests that is not a good reason for SE or anyone to not invest in newer mmos or titles. You'll just be the person that never moved on.

I never said people shouldn't make other MMORPGs or games, but they need to be interesting. A very important thing with an MMORPG is to make people view the hubs as their home and to care about their home. You aren't going to care about something you know nothing about, so that's why an MSQ is useful to teach them the lore of the world and become invested in why they should stick around and why they should care about these bosses.

To me personally, I know Final Fantasy does this well so I didn't even need to think about if it would prior to playing.

In general doing the same thing you have always done and never trying new things is not the best way to live life

I do try new things. The new content.

Usually when a game is at its height it has nowhere to go but down.

True, but that is why I used the wording "current height" because it could go yet higher. We will have to see how it is throughout Dawntrail and then compare the averages to Endwalker. We can only know it has actually reached the height when we see it go down, or at the bare minimum remain the same as through Endwalker.

Typically the average grows about 200,000 or more on Lucky Bancho every expansion and this has been consistent so if we don't see a higher average it would be new.

The same way you don't have kids when you are 70, you do it in the prime of your life because thats when you have the energy and resources to do it. It's common sense. If they wait for this MMO to die then they'll be like, you know what its a dying genre, maybe we should take all our money and put into mobile gacha games and NFTs instead. This doesn't benefit you, or any of us.

I agree it would be smart to start early, but it needs early-sign statistics to back it up ie. the first expansion to not add 200,000+ to the average.

I feel like from Square Enix's perspective, they just recently added servers such as Oceania and Dynamis as well as 4 new EU servers. Something like that tells a company they are seeing explosive growth. Until they receive an early signal saying the opposite of that, it doesn't paint a picture of being even at the beginning of any kind of down slope.