Frontlines sucks Ultra megathread

[Valence]

Before condemning premades, I think it's worth noting one thing.

'The only obligation any player has in FL is to help their team win'

Nobody is under any obligation to make sure everyone else is having a pleasant experience (as long as they don't violate ToS).

The group of people who will play any job and follow any meta with the ultimate goal of having the highest win rate will never get along with the group of people who just want to queue into FL for some mindless zerg fun and don't care whether they win or lose.

Neither group is more correct either, it's simply an irreconcilable difference between players.

My problem isn't about premades, in fact I have defended premades regularly in the past on those very forums against people that wanted to see them removed. My post history is here to show for it, and I took a lot of flak for it.

My problem is about the lack of care SE put into FLs, where the problem has been actually pretty serious for years and yet they're reluctant to invest any resources into addressing it, and how this allows for abuses. This all boils down to abuses, and while it was other things before, today it's DRK-AoE spamm abusers which is not only totally braindead, but also leaves no room for anything else if executed on the field.

[Mawlzy]

My problem isn't about premades, in fact I have defended premades regularly in the past on those very forums against people that wanted to see them removed. My post history is here to show for it, and I took a lot of flak for it.

My problem is about the lack of care SE put into FLs, where the problem has been actually pretty serious for years and yet they're reluctant to invest any resources into addressing it, and how this allows for abuses. This all boils down to abuses, and while it was other things before, today it's DRK-AoE spamm abusers which is not only totally braindead, but also leaves no room for anything else if executed on the field.

100% agree. Yet the current abusers of that lack of care will loudly proclaim the problem with the mode is the stupid players.

While massive XP rewards continue to exist, nobody is going to change the attitude of the bulk of the players, however hard they hit them with the cat-o-nine tails. I'm not sure we can influence SE either, but that's the better bet.

[Aravell]

Yet the current abusers of that lack of care will loudly proclaim the problem with the mode is the stupid players.

Both can be true at the same time. Yes, SE doesn't give enough care to the PvP content because FL problems tend to last for a long time, but that doesn't absolve the people who are lazy.

I can do over 1m damage on a solo BRD, I don't believe for a second that the MCH sitting at 0/8 with less than 200k damage dealt is that low "because of the DRKs". I think the people at the bottom of the leaderboard tend to be there from lack of trying, then they blame the convenient scapegoat of "DRK premades".

[Mawlzy]

Both can be true at the same time. Yes, SE doesn't give enough care to the PvP content because FL problems tend to last for a long time, but that doesn't absolve the people who are lazy.

I can do over 1m damage on a solo BRD, I don't believe for a second that the MCH sitting at 0/8 with less than 200k damage dealt is that low "because of the DRKs". I think the people at the bottom of the leaderboard tend to be there from lack of trying, then they blame the convenient scapegoat of "DRK premades".

I completely agree there's a stubborn rump of players who are putting in basically zero effort. I would be much happier if I didn't have to play with them. However, I'd suggest that group is not blaming anyone for their K/D/A/Dmg. They take the XP and run.

[Mawlzy]

Oh bloody great, as if we don't have enough players screeching about how everyone has to "play their way or else", now we're getting a system where if you're not picking the BiS trait for the meta, you'll have even more of them breathing down your neck.

I hadn't considered that, but you're probably right. I can imagine a whole new set of macros for use during the 45-second countdown, as commanders continue their futile attempts to ensure everyone follows the One True Path.

That said, the current situation is so tedious I think anything new will be an improvement. It just might be a short-lived one.

[Aravell]

I wouldn't be so certain that there will be a BiS trait to pick. This is 'Player vs Player' after all, we're not an AI that behaves the same in every match.

I'd be happy with the system if it enables vastly different playstyles and counter potentials. But then again, this is SE, so the traits will probably be cookie cutter +damage or -cooldown.

[FatCatEnjoyer]

after a certain amount of matches it does feel like playing against AI sometimes ������

[Valence]

Oh bloody great, as if we don't have enough players screeching about how everyone has to "play their way or else", now we're getting a system where if you're not picking the BiS trait for the meta, you'll have even more of them breathing down your neck. If there's one thing I've learned from playing MMOs over the years, selectable talents/traits never plays nice with a community, *especially* the competitive part of it. I suppose one might argue to give Square-Enix the benefit of a doubt that they can make it work... but, like, I've seen what that BOAD has gotten us so far, it doesn't exactly inspire confidence.

We've had that for the whole duration of HW to ShB pvp and I've never seen anybody giving a flying fuck what additional abilities other people took. Sure, some were absolute trash like the backstep, but otherwise it didn't change anything.
However I'll keep my judgement for when we actually get to see those actions, because if they really do intend those to literally change the tides more than on an individual level like in previous history, then perhaps the ones people pick could become too important to pass under people's scrutiny.

[Archeron]

Trait selection is something I don't really trust SE to competently implement even if it may have positive effects on breaking meta's.

The simple fact is that SE has built a reputation of ignoring major flaws on Frontlines for 6 months at a time. They ignored feedback we had been leaving for years, and they even removed more content than they added during Endwalker. There is no way anyone should have ANY faith that these actions come out initially balanced, and they aren't in immediate need of rebalancing within the first week, and nothing gets done for months to fix the initial issues. They can make all these grand promises but they're truly nothing but air until they demonstrate that they are willing to implement fixes to exploits/balancing quickly and effectively, and with a new system and traits there is a lot to go wrong.

[Mawlzy]

I tend to be reluctant to report anyone in FL, but good gravy, when someone both refuses to engage the enemy and spends the match typing gibberish in chat, it has to be done. Mogtome event once again shows that as the rewards go up, so does lethargic play.