Frontlines sucks Ultra megathread

[Mawlzy]

At this point they need to just give us individual objectives. Let us actually carry if we want.

I mean let's face it, people premade frequently so they can carry themselves, it's why most premades are active. I'm in two of the more active pvp discords(one isn't even focused around pvp), and both groups of players literally admit to doing so. You don't even know the people you're premading with most of the time, you just know that you're bettering your odds because you'll be with them and not someone who is afk, either literally or just afk in the head.

There's certain crowds that are willing to do whatever they can to tilt the odds in their favor, and the best thing you can do is ensure everyone has the tools at their disposal to be that productive.

Also, woooooooooooow @ new shatter. You really made an entire pve only map.

For those of us who regard premades as anathema to the spirit of the mode, we're hardly likely to attempt to address the problem by becoming the problem.

[IDontPetLalas]

At this point they need to just give us individual objectives. Let us actually carry if we want.

I mean let's face it, people premade frequently so they can carry themselves, it's why most premades are active. I'm in two of the more active pvp discords(one isn't even focused around pvp), and both groups of players literally admit to doing so. You don't even know the people you're premading with most of the time, you just know that you're bettering your odds because you'll be with them and not someone who is afk, either literally or just afk in the head.

There's certain crowds that are willing to do whatever they can to tilt the odds in their favor, and the best thing you can do is ensure everyone has the tools at their disposal to be that productive.

Also, woooooooooooow @ new shatter. You really made an entire pve only map.

Equating people that may want to queue with literally no more than a couple of friends, and those people who want to queue with , as you point out- a few people who are extremely unlikely to AFK, are going to coordinate, and who want to win the match" is one thing, which I can understand. It's not even "carrying yourself"- it's someone who is typically (reasonably) competent grouped with other competent people.

Certain crowds who will do whatever they can to tilt the odds in their favour" on the other hand, is quite another thing to me , which frequently leads to behaviour that is- if not against someone's moral code- formalized in a TOS and I don't equate the two at all.

[Bonoki]

The newest change to Shatter.


Quicker matches do not personally make me enjoy it anymore than I already did.

[VictorSpoils]

Quicker matches do not personally make me enjoy it anymore than I already did.

Definitely, but the more they drag on, the worse it is. The recent changes made it slower than ever. Now it's probably on par with before.

[Mawlzy]

Think it's worth noting that the two changes to Shatter made in 6.57 were both requested on these forums and SE implemented them rapidly. Some evidence that our voices matter.

[Aravell]

Sounds more like you don't play FL. BH should not be adjusted at all, it rewards people who actually PvP in a PvP map (who knew?!). If you really hate BH that much, get better and learn to prioritize killing people with BH5 > 4 > 3 > 2. If they have premades? Play a ranged job til you get better at noticing their DRKs/RPRs/DRGs/DNCs. Once you're more aware of what's going on in that cluster shizzle called FL, then you can move on to tank or maybe even melee/dnc.

Having played FL since before shatter was implemented, I think that BH does need adjustments.

There was always an element of risk back then, having BH5 meant you're permanently marked on the map and you have to rely on your healers to get you through fights because you die just as fast as everyone else. But now that everyone has Recuperate, the healing boost part has become unbalanced, you now deal more damage at BH5 and are also much harder to kill than everyone else because you heal 7500 more than normal, that's all the benefits and none of the downside, some adjustments do need to be made to keep it somewhat balanced.

A reward for engaging in PvP is fine. But it shouldn't put you so far ahead that the regular player has a much harder time killing you. A damage boost is your reward, you shouldn't have more survivability as well.

[Niroken]

There was always an element of risk back then, having BH5 meant you're permanently marked on the map and you have to rely on your healers to get you through fights because you die just as fast as everyone else. But now that everyone has Recuperate, the healing boost part has become unbalanced, you now deal more damage at BH5 and are also much harder to kill than everyone else because you heal 7500 more than normal, that's all the benefits and none of the downside, some adjustments do need to be made to keep it somewhat balanced.

Yes, giving DPS and Tanks access to instant healer level healing was probably a bad idea when it came to Frontlines. Added that some classes have better killing potential (including LB) while having innate damage resistance... I don't see how anyone can consider BH remotely balanced.

[Nubrication]

There was always an element of risk back then, having BH5 meant you're permanently marked on the map and you have to rely on your healers to get you through fights because you die just as fast as everyone else. But now that everyone has Recuperate, the healing boost part has become unbalanced, you now deal more damage at BH5 and are also much harder to kill than everyone else because you heal 7500 more than normal, that's all the benefits and none of the downside, some adjustments do need to be made to keep it somewhat balanced.

Yes, exactly - you HAD to rely on your healers. Now you can't. Not because you're (not you literally) bad, but because they're (healers) toolkit no longer allows it. You're forgetting that PVP changed drastically compared to before. Survival is more on the individual now; while winning still requires teamwork. So it only makes sense that healing still gets a boost from BH. And the damage you deal with BH5 only brings it slightly above normal, you're forgetting that everyone takes less damage, and some jobs do less dmg in FL.

As for the map pinging. That also makes sense because anyone can get BH5 now. The game mode changed so obviously your toolkit is going to change with it to make it more manageable. The fact that you can get BH5 with just assists is saying something. Battle Fever took like 6-8 kills? I forgot.

TLDR: Game mode has changed -> survival is more self-reliant -> recuperate bonus is needed.

[AriannaStormwake]

but facing premade zerg rushers vs pug groups who run away from pvp is still a ongoing issue
few days later edit in shatter and onsal hakair can folks afraid of actual pvp not queue seriously lowscore third is pathetic

[OjiiM]

I don't know if it's just the general mental climate people live under but I've often had groups (two today in fact) who want to play to lose. Zero desire to fight and either no desire to communicate or just some snarky passive aggressiveness. It makes FL a slog but when you get a team that's actually engaged FL is a lot more fun.