Frontlines sucks Ultra megathread

[Mawlzy]

Call me crazy, but I think the solution to frontlines is simple. Make 2nd place wins add to the achievement score in some meaningful way, how about .5 an achievement point? May take some minor coding. Sure it will change the dynamic a bit... but currently there is just way too much to acquire in frontlines and the grind is absolutely pure RNG and sucks miserably.

I'm not going to even rant about the poor balance and how healers are shafted with the frontline bonus ranking.

You want to incentivize people to play for 2nd? I won't call you crazy, but the idea is IMO.

[Mewi]

You want to incentivize people to play for 2nd? I won't call you crazy, but the idea is IMO.

Logically they'd aim for 1st place as it increases their chances of winning a point in 2nd place should things go the wrong in 1st place. People already do it anyway for the extra rewards anyway... So I think you have a null point here. It also gives a chance to get something out of playing frontlines against mass premades who have a much higher percentile chances at a victory. or maybe all places should get some kind of score point toward the achievement with 1st giving the most ;p

[Mawlzy]

Logically they'd aim for 1st place as it increases their chances of winning a point in 2nd place should things go the wrong in 1st place. People already do it anyway for the extra rewards anyway... So I think you have a null point here. It also gives a chance to get something out of playing frontlines against mass premades who have a much higher percentile chances at a victory. or maybe all places should get some kind of score point toward the achievement with 1st giving the most ;p

I completely agree that the presence of premades with their eye-watering win-rates means many players when facing them just give up. And for achievement hunters I can see how this would be extremely frustrating. I just figure on general principles that the flatter the reward structure, the less effort people are likely to expend, but I could be wrong.

[Aidorouge]

You want to incentivize people to play for 2nd? I won't call you crazy, but the idea is IMO.

To be fair, the non-premade/plugin teams usually end up fighting over 2nd place anyway, so they might as well get something else for the trouble of queuing up instead of pointlessly fighting 1st place to help them with *their* kill achievements.

[Vandi]

Huh…it sincerely boggles my mind you guys are queing front lines at all these days, even to collect daily tones. Since Crystal Conflict came out, I haven’t touched it with a 10 ft pole. Due to the devs c o n s t a n t l y watering dps output down in favor of overbearing team play, there’s no individual skill anymore, just hordes of mindless aoe spamming. Racking up kills used to be enjoyable in itself, but between lag and the last hit, it seems impossible.

Anyone remember the 8 vs 8 vs 8 matches where there was much much much more potential for duels, developing familiarity with other skilled players? Gone. Secure used to be one of the best maps for tactical team distribution. Gone. Seal and Shatter, every other shout is a ‘dont engage, let them fight’ call out in favor of pve objectives over, you know, actual pvp.

Bring back the 24 max matches, or the 8 vs 8s in the wolves den. Being forced to go ranged dps cuz you practically have to dance between the raindrops as melee or tank, risking the lag god’s wrath sucks. Thought we’d finally made progress with the op healer situation, but seems frontlines went even further backwards with bad decision job mechanics. Eh…like I said, I genuinely feel for you guys still needlessly stuck in the trenches out there. Yoshi’s incessant dream of mass pvp needs to be fine tuned or just plain die out.

[Mistress_Irika]

Huh…it sincerely boggles my mind you guys are queing front lines at all these days, even to collect daily tones. Since Crystal Conflict came out, I haven’t touched it with a 10 ft pole. Due to the devs c o n s t a n t l y watering dps output down in favor of overbearing team play, there’s no individual skill anymore, just hordes of mindless aoe spamming. Racking up kills used to be enjoyable in itself, but between lag and the last hit, it seems impossible.

Anyone remember the 8 vs 8 vs 8 matches where there was much much much more potential for duels, developing familiarity with other skilled players? Gone. Secure used to be one of the best maps for tactical team distribution. Gone. Seal and Shatter, every other shout is a ‘dont engage, let them fight’ call out in favor of pve objectives over, you know, actual pvp.

Bring back the 24 max matches, or the 8 vs 8s in the wolves den. Being forced to go ranged dps cuz you practically have to dance between the raindrops as melee or tank, risking the lag god’s wrath sucks. Thought we’d finally made progress with the op healer situation, but seems frontlines went even further backwards with bad decision job mechanics. Eh…like I said, I genuinely feel for you guys still needlessly stuck in the trenches out there. Yoshi’s incessant dream of mass pvp needs to be fine tuned or just plain die out.

I missed those days dearly where 24 man frontlines existed. These days, I feel like I have no control which is why I've stopped playing frontlines altogether. No more forcing fights playing blue dps since you can stack stun on top of stun with no consequences. No more going off on your own and playing 1v2/3s since everyone has access to that elixir. I'm forced to rely on the team at all times. If the squad decides to avoid all fights, place 2nd, and be happy with that playstyle I'm forced to accept it. My only 2 options these days are to enjoy what currently exist or to not pvp at all. For some reason certain maps and modes keep getting locked or deleted altogether. I would probably go through with current frontlines if 24 man still existed. Right now's it's not worth. I'm not sure how many enjoys this current version of frontlines. Regardless, I'm glad that many, if not majority, are enjoying it. I can't seem to follow or forced myself to unfortunately. Even with the new players bring me in every now and then it's very difficult to enjoy it. It feels as though frontlines is being changed in a way that there's only one way to play. I don't want to play frontlines playing pve only or only zerging over high value objectives. It's a boring, overused playstyle.

I've played hardcore exclusively for pvp for 4 years. Despite me disagreeing with more than half of the changes made over the course of that time period I still played to enjoy myself. I don't feel like wanting to try hard for a win with only 6 buttons available for use. It's too much work.

[Escalan]

FFXIV have the one of the most atrocious PVP systems I've seen in a game. It's completely unenjoyable, especially frontlines. They are pointless RNG battles. No amount of "skill" (if you can call it that) will help you win. When I see my group separating in three different directions instead of sticking together, I know there is no chance to win. Most people go there for the XP and don't care much if they win or lose or what happens, and I don't blame them. Majority of the player base dislikes the PVP of this game because of so many good reasons. I don't know if it's fixable, or even if it is, I don't think Square Enix will bother. PVP is there just to be there.

[Vandi]

I missed those days dearly where 24 man frontlines existed. These days, I feel like I have no control which is why I've stopped playing frontlines altogether. No more forcing fights playing blue dps since you can stack stun on top of stun with no consequences. No more going off on your own and playing 1v2/3s since everyone has access to that elixir. I'm forced to rely on the team at all times. If the squad decides to avoid all fights, place 2nd, and be happy with that playstyle I'm forced to accept it. My only 2 options these days are to enjoy what currently exist or to not pvp at all. For some reason certain maps and modes keep getting locked or deleted altogether. I would probably go through with current frontlines if 24 man still existed. Right now's it's not worth. I'm not sure how many enjoys this current version of frontlines. Regardless, I'm glad that many, if not majority, are enjoying it. I can't seem to follow or forced myself to unfortunately. Even with the new players bring me in every now and then it's very difficult to enjoy it. It feels as though frontlines is being changed in a way that there's only one way to play. I don't want to play frontlines playing pve only or only zerging over high value objectives. It's a boring, overused playstyle.

I've played hardcore exclusively for pvp for 4 years. Despite me disagreeing with more than half of the changes made over the course of that time period I still played to enjoy myself. I don't feel like wanting to try hard for a win with only 6 buttons available for use. It's too much work.

Absolutely agree with everything here.^ All pvp is now is a massive kiddy pool free for all. Instead of simply bringing back 8-man matches and just banning premades which was what caused us to lose it in the first place, the devs have just let it go to hell.

I would greatly suggest Crystal Conflict for those seeking a change.

[Valence]

I do remember and miss 8v8v8, but I certainly do not miss the old pvp model (and the damage output was way lower than today let's not kid ourselves, what allowed kills was that there was no recup until way later past half shb). I also do not miss the heal centric meta.

[KageTokage]

I actually liked the first iteration of the PvP revamp because people died more slowly due to the lower damage output but the healing was also more limited.

Current PvP just feels like a party game with how people can just start dying left and right once the LB spam starts happening coupled with how many LBs don't have any reasonable form of counterplay.