What if: Starting with Dawntrail, everyone starts referring to the WoL as they/them?

[Shibi]

Ah; Les mots épicènes Did Titanfr:ann (yes, that's a made-up DE word there) fall off their perch of helpfulness back into chucking chum?

Personally I have used 'they' for decades when referring to other people, yet some in the English speaking parts of the world do have trouble with fitting what they think is the solely plural 'they' into singular grammar, saying it feels 'unnatural' to read. eg: "I am going to watch Naoki-san later on ニコニコ [niconico] and watch them roll their eyes before they facepalms"

Yet some of the same people don't understand the added difficulties of gendered grammar in German and French are much more complex then that extra 's' English suffers with.

[Immut]

No, when the person is sure about their... "cisness", you're definitly being insulting if you keep using the pronoun "they". And, please, stop using the argument of seniority to justify the legitimacy of a word. There are quite a few words that are very old and have disappeared, quite rightly, because they were no longer valid (All the lexical field relating to ethnic groups, to pick the most obvious example). An element of language is consubstantial with its era; it certainly indicates a certain use of grammar, but it also carries ideological meaning. In this respect, you can't claim that forcing the "they" on someone is neutral today - and the very old use of this pronoun won't change anything here.

Your feelings do not change how the English language works or the definitions of the words therein.

[Merrigan]

Your feelings do not change how the English language works or the definitions of the words therein.

It's not a question of "feeling", but of language usage. I don't have any particular feelings on the matter: non-binarity is something I personally don't understand, but I don't see the point in turning it into a personal vendetta either. On the other hand, it's impossible to deny today that if you persist in using "they" for someone who textually tells you "no, I'm a man"; or conversely use "he" for someone who insists they're non-binary, you're making a form of political claim. Hence my point.

On a more general note, it would be very bad faith to claim that a word isn't emotionally charged. The term "Aryan" was originally a way of designating a population; it's difficult to claim it today, for obvious reasons. In France, the term "artist" could only designate those capable of investing the so-called "intellectual" arts (painters, in particular). Today, it also refers to artisans, mainly because they made it a political claim in its own right at the turn of the 19th and 20th centuries - a way, like any other, for them to climb the social hierarchy and escape the stigma of the so-called manual arts.

The biggest lie here would be to pretend that the meaning of words doesn't evolve according to the historical period and culture concerned - even if they retain their grammatical role.

[Tahbitha]

Call me anything you want, just don't call me late for dinner.

But I am secure enough to know what and who I am, regardless of words people choose to describe me.

[Shibi]

...The term "Aryan" was originally a way of designating a population; it's difficult to claim it today..

(Has the thread been Godwinned now?)

irregardless; Only from 1850 or so. Not originally.

Prior to that (and currently) it refers to the cultural self-designation of Indo-Iranians (about 2000BCE-ish), and still does. In this form, it has no racial meaning, just as 'American' has no racial meaning on it's own. It's a cultural self-designation.

A bit like the way the symbol for Buddha (The Japanese Manji character) was co-opted by the same central European political group in the early 20th century, yet is still heavily used. https://maps.app.goo.gl/PTkJCwBCmNqtL1WA9 shows one example.



Mind you, some do have trouble with both of these, as they can't mentally detach the evil use for a couple of years from centuries and millennia of prior good use and hold them as two separate concepts. Both the self-designation word and the Manji character.

[reivaxe]

It would make this game come across as lazier than it has any business being.

[CaptainLagbeard]

This is factually incorrect. The singular "they" has been in use for over six hundred years and is a catch-all for all genders and some objects. It is impossible to misgender someone with "they".

So using the wrong pronoun isn't misgendering. Got it.

But at any rate, They isn't really a pronoun in the way it's get used, it's more a slang term... Like rather than bother saying "That person" or "Those people", people opt for the much short and simpler "they".

[SoloWingMetatron]

Haha I seriously doubt this would ever happen - But in the event it did...I would mod that shit straight back out of the game!

[Merrigan]

(Has the thread been Godwinned now?)

irregardless; Only from 1850 or so. Not originally.

Prior to that (and currently) it refers to the cultural self-designation of Indo-Iranians (about 2000BCE-ish), and still does. In this form, it has no racial meaning, just as 'American' has no racial meaning on it's own. It's a cultural self-designation.

A bit like the way the symbol for Buddha (The Japanese Manji character) was co-opted by the same central European political group in the early 20th century, yet is still heavily used. https://maps.app.goo.gl/PTkJCwBCmNqtL1WA9 shows one example.



Mind you, some do have trouble with both of these, as they can't mentally detach the evil use for a couple of years from centuries and millennia of prior good use and hold them as two separate concepts. Both the self-designation word and the Manji character.

Ahah, originally I was about to talk about the concept of "Homeland" and "art collector". But if I'm being honest, I'm not confortable enough with English to do it correctly. So that's why I took this example : it's more common, and known by everyone.

For the sake of nitpicking, your message contains an interesting example: "race". Very common in English, particularly in the USA from what I've seen, but unthinkable to use in other countries.

[Troxbark]

This is factually incorrect. The singular "they" has been in use for over six hundred years and is a catch-all for all genders and some objects. It is impossible to misgender someone with "they".

Until that offends someone. If referring to me as "they" offends me, then what?

Now we need another term.