[Feedback] Wuk Lamat's English Voice

[WantlessYoYo]

How come this is still going

[Mosha]

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It's similar (though not identical!) to frustrations when a mobile, non-disabled actor plays someone in a wheelchair--especially a character who is unable to walk. (I don't mean "they broke their leg badly so they're in a wheelchair until they heal up again," I mean characters for whom a wheelchair is a necessary tool in daily life.)

There is also a amount huge of disabilities making the pool of actors to pull from not only small but fragmented. I would imagine it can be a casting nightmare for studios and a lot of the time it's just easier and quicker to cast a known actor for the role.

[NonBinaryNyan]

I strongly disagree with this as the end state is the same: the VA loses their job because of mob mentality. Plus people who believe that is "encroaching by taking/holding a role" would 100% go after employers too.

It's not a strongarm attempt, it's not coercion, and I'm genuinely not sure why you're describing it as mob mentality.

It's pointing out that doing this hurts trans actors. One hopes that if someone is voicing a trans character, they also want to support actual trans people in some fashion. It's up to the VA and her own morals and her own situation as to what she does with that information and the suggestion that she step aside and support trans VAs in trans roles.

Maybe she steps down and asks the studio to hire a trans VA.

Maybe she doesn't, but pushes for trans VAs to be invited for future roles with other characters.

Maybe she hears the problems, but isn't in a financially secure position and needs to line other work up first.

Maybe she feels she isn't in a good place to take action now, or even disagrees that it should be on her to do so, but keeps this in mind for other roles she goes for in the future.

Maybe she decides that professionally, she'll incur too much risk if she speaks up.

Maybe she disagrees and yells back.

Maybe she disagrees and ignores it.

Maybe she doesn't even hear about it.

My point is, she gets to decide what, if any, action she takes on it. And people who are members of the communities represented by the character get to decide how they feel about what she does and says.


If by "go after the employers" you mean criticize the employer's behavior and tell them that they should do better, sure.

If you mean "demand the cis VA get fired," no. I'm not saying nobody would, but that's a big generalization there and it doesn't quite hold up.

Hell, Sena doesn't even directly call for her to step down--just expresses frustration that the VA doesn't seem to have any intention of ever doing so. But a personal counter example:

(Please see next post, I have discovered the forums have a 3000 character cap.)

[NonBinaryNyan]

(Reply to Mosha continued)


I quit watching Glee when I realized that the actor playing Artie, Kevin McHale, doesn't use a wheelchair. I was really mad about it. I felt he shouldn't have taken the role, and moreover that the show runners shouldn't have set the role up for him to take in the first place. However, I did *not* write or call them up demanding that they recast him.

I did actually write to somebody at the show/network explaining why it was a problem and suggested that they hire a disabled actor to play a new character in an upcoming season of that show specifically, even if it was a smaller role, and asked them to take that feedback with them on future projects. I explained how this could be incredibly meaningful to disabled teenagers in particular. I have no idea how it was received--I never heard back. I hope someone read it and understood and maybe DID take what I said forward with them, but it could have just as easily gone into the trash. Other people said similar things. Some of them were probably less polite about it.

Kevin McHale (the actor) has since stated that he agrees with those criticisms, and that while he can't take back having played the character, the only way he would return for any sort of Glee reboot is as a completely different character. Moreover, he wouldn't take another role in a wheelchair at this point--he just didn't know better during original casting. I appreciate that he's heard people out, learned from it, and seems to be going forward with empathy on the matter.

(Glee had a LOT of problems and I don't want to derail, but this was a handy example that's relevant to the conversation.)

[NonBinaryNyan]

There is also a amount huge of disabilities making the pool of actors to pull from not only small but fragmented. I would imagine it can be a casting nightmare for studios and a lot of the time it's just easier and quicker to cast a known actor for the role.

Oh *that* problem is easily solved--there are more than you think! Many of them have agents. And with a lot of casting starting online, keyword searches make that a lot easier.

Sometimes they want someone with a specific skillset, like dancing or singing. There are disabled actors who sing! There are professional dance troupes with performers in wheelchairs.

It's not as hard to do as some people make it out to be. Yeah, there's a matter of film stages needing to be set up in a way that's wheelchair accessible. But if that's what's stopping someone from hiring a disabled performer for a disabled role, they aren't trying very hard.

[Mosha]

snip.

Bro going to be real with you I'm just tired of people on Twitter trying to ruin people's lives over the smallest shit (left or right wing) that is where my mind immediately goes. I am just too jaded by online culture warriors tbh. With regards to Kevin Mchale It wasn't your good-mannered and polite letter it was the "less polite" people sending death threats and harassment to him. The way you worded it makes him sound defeated by the bullying he received.

[Mosha]

Oh *that* problem is easily solved--there are more than you think! Many of them have agents. And with a lot of casting starting online, keyword searches make that a lot easier.

Sometimes they want someone with a specific skillset, like dancing or singing. There are disabled actors who sing! There are professional dance troupes with performers in wheelchairs.

It's not as hard to do as some people make it out to be. Yeah, there's a matter of film stages needing to be set up in a way that's wheelchair accessible. But if that's what's stopping someone from hiring a disabled performer for a disabled role, they aren't trying very hard.

Right, but their disability is only one aspect to consider, now you've still got to consider all the other aspects like do they suit the role? chemistry with other actors? scheduling and if they even want the role?

"There are disabled actors who sing! There are professional dance troupes with performers in wheelchairs." I'm very aware of this because I have cerebral palsy myself.

Disability adaptions most likely fall under some legislation depending on the country in question.

[NonBinaryNyan]

Bro going to be real with you I'm just tired of people on Twitter trying to ruin people's lives over the smallest shit (left or right wing) that is where my mind immediately goes. I am just too jaded by online culture warriors tbh. With regards to Kevin Mchale It wasn't your good-mannered and polite letter it was the "less polite" people sending death threats and harassment to him. The way you worded it makes him sound defeated by the bullying he received.

Actually I said he listened to people's stories and frustrations and turned that into a new perspective, nothing about defeat? To my understanding he's been successful in other projects since. Did he get death threats over playing a character in a wheelchair? I know he's gay and was also in a thing about LGBTQ rights, which is unfortunately a recipe for some people becoming dangerously infuriated.

Maybe I've retained a silly thread of optimism, but I don't think trying to get someone to change their approach or move over a lane has to be life-ruining.

(Should go without saying, but just to be clear, death threats aren't okay, regardless.)

[NonBinaryNyan]

Right, but their disability is only one aspect to consider, now you've still got to consider all the other aspects like do they suit the role? chemistry with other actors? scheduling and if they even want the role?

"There are disabled actors who sing! There are professional dance troupes with performers in wheelchairs." I'm very aware of this because I have cerebral palsy myself.

Disability adaptions most likely fall under some legislation depending on the country in question.

Oh, I mean if we have to wait around on the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA), we're kinda screwed. (I don't know if you're in the US or not and don't want to assume.)

[Mosha]

Actually I said he listened to people's stories and frustrations and turned that into a new perspective, nothing about defeat? To my understanding he's been successful in other projects since. Did he get death threats over playing a character in a wheelchair? I know he's gay and was also in a thing about LGBTQ rights, which is unfortunately a recipe for some people becoming dangerously infuriated.

Maybe I've retained a silly thread of optimism, but I don't think trying to get someone to change their approach or move over a lane has to be life-ruining.

(Should go without saying, but just to be clear, death threats aren't okay, regardless.)

"he just didn't know better during original casting" "and that while he can't take back having played the character," Maybe it's just me but these statements come off defeatist/grovelling to me. That might of been not your intent though.

Oh, I 100% agree that trying change people's approaches shouldn't end up that way but sadly this is the internet.

Oh, I mean if we have to wait around on the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA), we're kinda screwed. (I don't know if you're in the US or not and don't want to assume.)

United Kingdom.