Quitting ffxiv for good

[OdinelStarrei]

Thanks for citing the source, Forte, you're the best, and I greatly appreciate it.

I don't care how FFXIV is monetized in other regions. The only thing I care about is how the combat and the encounters are designed. Everything else is superfluous to me. CN/KR clients have the exact same design as the rest of us, so if the CN producer talks about it, which he did, it's coming from a position that I can respect. And it is surprisingly to see him name drop streamers and content creators to say "Yeah, I agree with them." and "Yeah, the 2 minute meta is controversial, but we literally don't know what to do about it" and "YEAH, the game has been on this cycle for too long." Honestly makes me want to think that they're not as deaf as they claim, but I'm not naive or willing to take anything said by an SE employee as truth until I've seen actual changes.

Now try The Dead Ends.

Why move the goalpost? He did what you asked.

Every trust enabled duty is going to have this, because you can't fail. As long as your patient, every dungeon pull and boss can be completed with nothing but you on a DPS job and minimal movements. You don't have to actually press a single job action if you don't want to, which really makes me feel like I'm fighting through the memories of dying civilizations. As an observer. Not an actual participant in anything important, since nothing compelling is ever asked of me in that environment. If you drag yourself into the death wall (if there is one), that's a different story, but I can see where they are going with this.

[Ath192]

You're right. I'll do just that.

What are the rules of your "the game plays itself" test? I assume running up to packs to get the npcs to aggro enemies is okay, but I'm not allowed to dodge any mechanics or move at all once combat has started? Anything other than that, and I'm actually having to do something right?

There are no rules besides finding out if you feel like the game plays itself. For stone vigil I just stood there and the boss died. For dead ends iirc there are some one shots so you'll probably die if you don't move. What you are trying to prove is that the dungeon felt exciting and make you feel like you were necessary to defeat it.

So lets say you go into dead ends and dont do anything and die. Okay, so thats not the baseline for that dungeon. Now lets say you go into dead ends just move away from the big telegraphed AOEs but you don't attack and the trusts kill the boss. Did you feel like you were needed? Like you really made the difference? Or that thancred and the other scions could've done everything without you just fine and they were probably telling you that you were the hero just to make you feel better?

Now I believe intrinsically that we know the answer to this question, but if you somehow find that fun and engaging then by all means say you felt fulfilled by what you just experienced.

[Boblawblah]

Thanks for citing the source, Forte, you're the best, and I greatly appreciate it.

I don't care how FFXIV is monetized in other regions. The only thing I care about is how the combat and the encounters are designed. Everything else is superfluous to me. CN/KR clients have the exact same design as the rest of us, so if the CN producer talks about it, which he did, it's coming from a position that I can respect. And it is surprisingly to see him name drop streamers and content creators to say "Yeah, I agree with them." and "Yeah, the 2 minute meta is controversial, but we literally don't know what to do about it" and "YEAH, the game has been on this cycle for too long." Honestly makes me want to think that they're not as deaf as they claim, but I'm not naive or willing to take anything said by an SE employee as truth until I've seen actual changes.



Why move the goalpost? He did what you asked.

Every trust enabled duty is going to have this, because you can't fail. As long as your patient, every dungeon pull and boss can be completed with nothing but you on a DPS job and minimal movements. You don't have to actually press a single job action if you don't want to, which really makes me feel like I'm fighting through the memories of dying civilizations. As an observer. Not an actual participant in anything important, since nothing compelling is ever asked of me in that environment. If you drag yourself into the death wall (if there is one), that's a different story, but I can see where they are going with this.

The "goalpost" was "The game plays itself", so the goalpost didn't move at all. And a quick update, I just died to the 2nd pack in Castrum Abania. I was DK and stood there and died straight up to a single pack.

doma castle is next!

edit: doma castle, wiped on 2nd boss, totally afk for whole time other than moving between packs.

[Striker44]

The alliance raid, consisting of 3 full parties in order to be able to run should have mechanics for 3 full parties. That includes mechanics for 3 tanks. Not 1 tank and 2 AFKers or potential DCs. You are proposing terrible design because it isn't centered on making the game engaging for players but instead safe in case an occasional technical difficulty is encountered.

It seems you're looking for a different game from a different age, or perhaps just not yet letting sink in the variety of difficulty levels that exist within this game. Maybe go try Wildstar - they've dedicated themselves to making an MMO that's "old school" in having difficult dungeons, required grouping, etc....oh wait, that's right, they had to shut down because their playerbase was so small it couldn't sustain itself. The simple reality is that today's primary MMO demographic is not looking for the base-level of the game to be a wipe-fest. There are multiple levels of difficulty, even in a non-raid-centric game like FFXIV, above the base level that have the "danger" you seem to desire. I encourage you to try it out if you haven't yet. But your solution is to risk turning off a much larger number of people by making the base-game cater to what you want, instead of doing the content already designed for it.

I'll give another recent example. Destiny 2 seems to have focused on its "elite" gamers and streamers in the current expansion. Basic patrol zones have damage sponges, enemies that will one-shot you from far away, lost sectors with tons of adds, and even the first "step up" in difficulty forces your ilvl (equivalent) to be weaker than your opponents (whereas in the past this only happened at a higher difficulty step). The end result? The company just laid off a significant portion of its staff because so many players have left and pre-orders for the next expansion came in far below expectations.

Why do I say this? In another post, you mention that some people here are quitting. But guess what - many more are staying and joining. Make the base game at the difficulty you want, and many more would quit (and not be replaced).

Edit:

Now lets say you go into dead ends just move away from the big telegraphed AOEs but you don't attack and the trusts kill the boss. Did you feel like you were needed?

I think we might be on to something here. The impression I'm getting is that you're someone who feels that unless you needed to be at the top of your game the entire fight, then everything was meaningless and unenjoyable. If that's accurate, you're certainly welcome to feel that way. But I'd have to say that's probably very different than most people's experience. Take me, for example. As long as I'm doing the dance and engaging in the fight, I have fun. I still dodge the mechanics even though technically I could just sit there and absorb a few, because I'm just having fun playing the game.

[VerdeLuck]

You don't have to actually press a single job action if you don't want to

This is so wrong it actually hurts to read.

And it's honestly why it's so hard to take these forums seriously, the amount of hyperbole in discussions is to the extreme. Asking for things fixed or liking the way things are becomes a matter of "so you want the game to clear itself for you?", or "so you just want it for free?"
No, I don't think this needs to be said, but you cannot complete the game by not using any actions. You will die, and the NPCs will also die and wipe trying to bring you back depending on your job. The game doesn't play itself and it's such a ridiculous concept to even throw that out, that it feels silly to even have to address it.

[Ath192]

It seems you're looking for a different game from a different age, or perhaps just not yet letting sink in the variety of difficulty levels that exist within this game. Maybe go try Wildstar - they've dedicated themselves to making an MMO that's "old school" in having difficult dungeons, required grouping, etc....oh wait, that's right, they had to shut down because their playerbase was so small it couldn't sustain itself. The simple reality is that today's primary MMO demographic is not looking for the base-level of the game to be a wipe-fest. There are multiple levels of difficulty, even in a non-raid-centric game like FFXIV, above the base level that have the "danger" you seem to desire. I encourage you to try it out if you haven't yet. But your solution is to risk turning off a much larger number of people by making the base-game cater to what you want, instead of doing the content already designed for it.

I'll give another recent example. Destiny 2 seems to have focused on its "elite" gamers and streamers in the current expansion. Basic patrol zones have damage sponges, enemies that will one-shot you from far away, lost sectors with tons of adds, and even the first "step up" in difficulty forces your ilvl (equivalent) to be weaker than your opponents (whereas in the past this only happened at a higher difficulty step). The end result? The company just laid off a significant portion of its staff because so many players have left and pre-orders for the next expansion came in far below expectations.

Why do I say this? In another post, you mention that some people here are quitting. But guess what - many more are staying and joining. Make the base game at the difficulty you want, and many more would quit (and not be replaced).

Edit:



I think we might be on to something here. The impression I'm getting is that you're someone who feels that unless you needed to be at the top of your game the entire fight, then everything was meaningless and unenjoyable. If that's accurate, you're certainly welcome to feel that way. But I'd have to say that's probably very different than most people's experience. Take me, for example. As long as I'm doing the dance and engaging in the fight, I have fun. I still dodge the mechanics even though technically I could just sit there and absorb a few, because I'm just having fun playing the game.

Both of the examples you mentioned had issues beyond gameplay that affected their performance, and in fact, upon researching Destiny it seems like the gameplay is receiving good press and people are liking that aspect of it. So I don't think you can prove that difficulty was the reason why. I could cite counter examples like Elden Ring. Here is a snip of an article praising its gameplay for lightfall:

There are major improvements here
There are problems with Lightfall, and it’s hard to recommend the campaign right now. However, I don’t want to leave this story without saying that Destiny 2 as a game has seen a massive improvement with the expansion. The new build crafting system makes speccing out your Guardian deeper, more rewarding, and accessible. The Guardian Ranks finally provide a smooth onboarding experience for new players (something the community has been asking for over the last few years). I can confidently say that Destiny 2 as a game has never been in a better spot.

Season of Defiance, which launched alongside Lightfall, is fantastic as well. It’s a much more compelling tale than the one told in Lightfall, and comes with what might be the best seasonal activity Bungie has ever made. Various quality-of-life improvements have made their way into the game, too, finally fixing some fundamental problems with chasing loot you want, managing your inventory, and juggling an endless barrage of currencies. From a gameplay perspective, Lightfall is a huge win.

It’s the narrative that suffers. I’m hopeful that the upcoming Root of Nightmares raid pays off the story in a meaningful way, but it’s hard to imagine a world where delaying that conclusion makes the third act of Destiny 2‘s first saga better. My only hope is that The Final Shape, when it launches, retroactively makes Lightfall a better expansion.

Source:
https://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming...r%20Lightfall.


If we're also going to cite player counts here XIV just dropped to its lowest player count since Jan 2021 before the WOW exodus brought in a huge surge of players to the run up to Endwalker. So I would say the game isn't doing super hot, failed to capitalize on retaining the huge new growth and is receiving negative press currently. It will remain to be seen if Dawntrail will bring everyone back but we'll find out. I know people like to hate on steamcharts because not everyone uses steam but I fail to see how steam users differ from their non-steam counter parts so firmly believe the trends would be similar across the board.

My guess is that Dawntrail won't be as big as Endwalker and we'll slowly shrink unless the changes make the current playerbase more happy and press/players turn more positive once more.

[Palladiamors]

I'm probably not far behind you, man. Endwalker single handedly destroyed everything I was invested in in-game including my main job and Dawntrail hasn't shown me anything I think I'll care about. I'm holding out for that last job reveal in faint hope that it'll give me something to cling to but it ain't looking good.

Que sera, sera

[Ravenblade1979]

I know the flamers are coming to get me even with this title but i dont have a fear at all this stuff needs to be said.

I am Skylar Spirit from Diabolos server and have been playing the game roughly since 2.5 just before heavenward. I dont care if I dox myself because I am NOT coming back.
I have over 800 days of playtime ( not tons of AFK time) the mentor mount and have cleared most savage fights so this isnt some meme casual gamer making this post, it was a DEDICATED player to this game who has been forgotten about

The game has this last expansion been the absolute worst in terms of casual and midcore content and I see the directions the developers are going in. Also there is 0 social content outside of what has not been taken over by ERP clubs and Venues.

Most of the player base cannot commit to ultimate raiding due to work and IRL obligations. The casual content is too easy now which is what kept me coming back. I remember dungeons, trials and normals raids in heavensward and stormblood having some bite to them and you actually had to pay attention. Now the content is so easy its just , " Stack, Spread, ect.

Healers are so OVERPOWERED playing them without a damage rotation is dumb, the amount of OGCD heals one has literally breaks most content in the game.

Boss hitboxes are so massive it takes away fun tank playing

Item level and rewards are absolutely pointless other then to validate someone's self worth on ff logs ( /s)

I dont see the game direction changing, the casual content is on baby mode now and there is nothing that brings the players to play together.

Party finder is dead on primal, Crystal and Dynamis
Im out this expansion ruined the game for me. I love and appreciate all who like this game but I encourage you all to stop settling for mediocre content and hold these devs accountable. Yoshi p did a good job with the game but it has since fallen apart for me.

So we shall see you in game then?

[Troxbark]

So if I get thrown a bad tank in an alliance raid I deserve to wipe for 90 minutes until the lockout ends?
No way, get out of here with that.

Is there an alliance raid that DPS or healers can't reliably tank? I can't think of one.

[caffe_macchiato]

If we're also going to cite player counts here XIV just dropped to its lowest player count since Jan 2021 before the WOW exodus brought in a huge surge of players to the run up to Endwalker. So I would say the game isn't doing super hot, failed to capitalize on retaining the huge new growth and is receiving negative press currently. It will remain to be seen if Dawntrail will bring everyone back but we'll find out. I know people like to hate on steamcharts because not everyone uses steam but I fail to see how steam users differ from their non-steam counter parts so firmly believe the trends would be similar across the board.

My guess is that Dawntrail won't be as big as Endwalker and we'll slowly shrink unless the changes make the current playerbase more happy and press/players turn more positive once more.

There are some issues here:

1) According to the forums, Steam is a completely separate player base that has largely nothing to do with the rest of the game, so their numbers don't count at all. The official census is from Lucky Bancho, who shows that the player base is still exploding like it was in 2021. If you disagree, you will be called a troll, or worse, you will be called me.

2) Many people say that journalists are only accurate when they're saying good things about the game, since the good things are facts and the bad things are not. If a journo says something negative, then he or she is only doing it for clicks and page views.

3) Everyone generally agrees that Dawntrail will bring a ton of people back. There will be massive login queues and the game will be massively popular.

Keep in mind that we are in a designated "play other games" period. Yoshi-P even assigned us games that He wants us to play instead of FFXIV. Did you beat all of them? If not, you are not upholding His will and doing as He instructed. FFXIV is the "play other games" game where, during the officially designated period, you shall not play. Except you should, because there's an unlimited amount of things to do, and if you don't play, we will see you tomorrow you troll. Does that make sense?