Random thought: Why isn't the discount from moving houses 100%?

[NekoMataMata]

A lot of people don't want to buy smalls or mediums. My current ward has a lot of empty smalls, and most wards I look into seem to have quite a few even with the occasional medium.

Moving the housing discount on relocating from 20% or whatever it is to 100% would make more people feel comfortable purchasing something while waiting to get their large.

There might be more gil in-game for it because housing is supposed to be some sort of gil sink, but I don't think it would be that big of a deal?

[Jojoya]

Why does someone voluntarily relinquishing their plot entirely get no gil back at all when giving players a reason to give up their house would help with supply?

At least the 15% is more than players used to get back when they wanted to move to a different plot but relocation didn't exist. Don't forget that relocating also means not having to purchase a construction permit for the new plot (which would cost 3 million gil if they move to a large, or basically the amount not being applied toward relocation if they previously had a small).

It's hard to say what SE's thinking process was when setting the refund rules up, or whether they've had any internal discussions about those rules since the changes made to the purchase system.

Only getting 30% (pre-lottery refund amount) applied toward the purchase of the new plot was a deterrent to most players when it come to randomly relocating a plot for lulz before the lottery existed though it definitely did not stop everyone. Even with the lottery making it even more difficult to relocate now, having that deterrent still isn't necessarily a bad thing. It helps to keep the overall entry counts down for those trying to buy or genuinely interested in relocating.

If someone is uncomfortable about possibly losing about 3 million gil for purchasing a small if they later get a large, they probably should think twice about whether their goal should be a large. I think people forget how expensive furnishings will get. Some with a large is probably not interested in limiting themselves to the vendor furnishings that sell for 2k-11k gil each. Unless they want to spend about 100 hours gathering materials then making all their furnishings, they could easily spend close to the plot price to get a large decorated.

That's not to say that I don't think the refund policy doesn't need to be reviewed and revised. I just think that someone who thinks 3 million gil is a big deal is in over their head if they're trying to go after a large.

[NekoMataMata]

Why does someone voluntarily relinquishing their plot entirely get no gil back at all when giving players a reason to give up their house would help with supply?

At least the 15% is more than players used to get back when they wanted to move to a different plot but relocation didn't exist. Don't forget that relocating also means not having to purchase a construction permit for the new plot (which would cost 3 million gil if they move to a large, or basically the amount not being applied toward relocation if they previously had a small).

It's hard to say what SE's thinking process was when setting the refund rules up, or whether they've had any internal discussions about those rules since the changes made to the purchase system.

Only getting 30% (pre-lottery refund amount) applied toward the purchase of the new plot was a deterrent to most players when it come to randomly relocating a plot for lulz before the lottery existed though it definitely did not stop everyone. Even with the lottery making it even more difficult to relocate now, having that deterrent still isn't necessarily a bad thing. It helps to keep the overall entry counts down for those trying to buy or genuinely interested in relocating.

If someone is uncomfortable about possibly losing about 3 million gil for purchasing a small if they later get a large, they probably should think twice about whether their goal should be a large. I think people forget how expensive furnishings will get. Some with a large is probably not interested in limiting themselves to the vendor furnishings that sell for 2k-11k gil each. Unless they want to spend about 100 hours gathering materials then making all their furnishings, they could easily spend close to the plot price to get a large decorated.

That's not to say that I don't think the refund policy doesn't need to be reviewed and revised. I just think that someone who thinks 3 million gil is a big deal is in over their head if they're trying to go after a large.

I mean I don't think it's a big deal but empty smalls and at times empty mediums are an issue.

If you want we could add a full refund to voluntarily relinquishing your plot as well. I see no issues with that.

Encouraging people to relinquish plots without monetary consequences could free up housing, while giving a full refund on relocations would potentially help fill up empty smalls and mediums. It's not really that complicated.

I also feel as if this could help create a better mentality when approaching the lotto each week. Instead of a bunch of players immediately going for a large you might have some players settling down in smalls, working their way into meds that have lower amounts of lotto competitors, and then eventually working their way into a large.

[Jojoya]

while giving a full refund on relocations would potentially help fill up empty smalls and mediums.

Except relocation doesn't fill up empty smalls and mediums. It changes where the empty plots are located. It is new purchases that fill up the empty spaces.

There are far fewer players going immediately to a large than you think (especially since larges are rarely available). If you're looking at the entry counts on mediums and larges, very few of those are new owner bids. They're relocation bids. Most players are already doing what you suggest - getting any house they possibly can to start then entering to relocate when a plot they would like more becomes available. The lack of a full refund isn't holding them back because it's far too easy to make that gil back.

If you're thinking about how empty the wards are on Maduin, it's because Maduin has the lowest population among the NA worlds. There aren't enough level 50+ non-trial characters on Maduin yet to fill every available plot. Perhaps things will change after the Xbox beta starts (potentially end of next month) but more likely we won't see much difference until Dawntrail is about to release and players worried about release log in queues decide to transfer their characters.

[Stormpeaks]

Except relocation doesn't fill up empty smalls and mediums. It changes where the empty plots are located. It is new purchases that fill up the empty spaces.

There are far fewer players going immediately to a large than you think (especially since larges are rarely available). If you're looking at the entry counts on mediums and larges, very few of those are new owner bids. They're relocation bids. Most players are already doing what you suggest - getting any house they possibly can to start then entering to relocate when a plot they would like more becomes available. The lack of a full refund isn't holding them back because it's far too easy to make that gil back.

If you're thinking about how empty the wards are on Maduin, it's because Maduin has the lowest population among the NA worlds. There aren't enough level 50+ non-trial characters on Maduin yet to fill every available plot. Perhaps things will change after the Xbox beta starts (potentially end of next month) but more likely we won't see much difference until Dawntrail is about to release and players worried about release log in queues decide to transfer their characters.

You also imply Xbox players will chose a dead DC to play on.

[Jojoya]

You also imply Xbox players will chose a dead DC to play on.

You imply that they will have free choice of any world.

Right now 9 out of 28 NA worlds are on Congested status (5 of those are Aether). Once the Xbox beta starts, I'm sure more will be added (probably including the last 3 Aether worlds).The rest, outside of the Dynamis worlds, are Standard.

Even if a world is not Congested, it can be temporarily locked to character creation. Prior to Dynamis's addition to NA, it was not unusual for almost every NA world to be locked to character creation except during the very early morning hours (2 to 6am) when SE would have a roulette going of letting one or two worlds on each data center that weren't Congested be opened to character creation then switching the worlds available when server status was updated 20 minutes later.

If there is enough Xbox player interest in the game, chances are very good we'll see that same thing happening. In that case, they may not have any choice except to pick a Dynamis world. The bonuses that players can get for creating a character on a New world are fairly attractive to those with previous RPG experience and that becomes more incentive to pick the Dynamis world to start. After all, they can still use data center travel to get to the other data centers to play unless SE shuts that down.

Dynamis will get some new players from the Xbox beta. How many is going to depend on Xbox interest and the status of character creation on the other NA worlds. That why I used the word "Perhaps".

[Commander_Justitia]

It could have been a discouragement for bots to buy up houses in the past, to resell it then. As you could make a deal with a player "I relinquish the plot, and you will buy it directly for xx millions gil". The bot would have made his initial investment back, which would have been riskfree to do. While normal players would have to suffer competing against bots on top of against other players. Though with the forced lottery systems now, it would seem not up to date anymore.

And well, imagine you want to have the gil back, you don't enter it for 45 days. It still means you gotta pay 2 subs before you finally have it, compared to only paying 1 sub.

As a sidenote, I think SE should start selling gil themselves, like WoW does with gold. Then implement a rent system to allow players to go beyond 45 days owning the plot, when they are offline. E.g. 1 million gil for a month for a small, 3 million for medium, 5million for large. People will buy gil from SE to keep their houses automatically, which is nicer than being forced to pay a sub to keep it. 45 days is really not enough...It should have been 90 at least, or the once promised "it will never be taken away, once you have bought it".

[Kenky]

It's never going to be 100%. Not every plot is the same, as some are far more favorable than others.

Beachfront property VS Houses next to a Market board VS Houses next to a local Aetheryte. There are plenty of overlap in these areas, but these 3 sections (Plus general view from the plot) are the key features to a plots value.

And even then, it shouldn't be 100%. Because you moving to from Plot A to Plot B, you should get a discount for 'selling' Plot A and that immediately being sunk into purchasing of Plot B. But because a noticable amount of people decided to be antagonistic with the old system, YOU now have to win the Lottery system to relocate. Which means your chances are pretty much zero.

[Kaiproberts]

Lottery sounded plausible on paper but in reality it is completely demoralizing. Placard clicking gave someone the feeling of being in control. You could click inside of/outside of primetime for the plot you wanted. If you walked away, you knew you were not going to get it. The lottery system just makes you hang on for a week hoping. I would go back to the exhausting placard clicking any day. At least in that system, a house was never available for more than 24 hours.

[PredatoryCatgirl]

Lottery sounded plausible on paper but in reality it is completely demoralizing. Placard clicking gave someone the feeling of being in control. You could click inside of/outside of primetime for the plot you wanted. If you walked away, you knew you were not going to get it. The lottery system just makes you hang on for a week hoping. I would go back to the exhausting placard clicking any day. At least in that system, a house was never available for more than 24 hours.

100% disagree. Placard spam was more wasteful of your time than anything Blizzard has ever done, and that's saying something. You spend 12 hours sitting there not playing the actual game only to lose to someone using an autoclicker. Lottery is both far more respectful to the playerbase, and doesn't give bots an advantage. It doesn't solve all the problems we have, but its a definite improvement.