Critique of Endwalker Characters

[aveyond-dreams]

While I generally enjoyed playing through Endwalker’s story, a lot of the longstanding cast members of the game fell quite flat this time around. There were significant problems in their behavior throughout the plot, feeling rather vestigial. Simply put, it is time to trim the fat. Scions like Y’shtola, Urianger, and Thancred have become completely stagnant and their continued presence serves more as an annoyance rather than adding anything significant to the game.

In comparison, other characters like Estinien and the trio of Ancients deserved much more on-screen time than they received.
I do not think we can confidently proceed into 7.0 with the cast as it stands now, unless major events happen in the 7.X patches that we don’t know about or if they finally retire for good instead of continuing to eat away at our patience. My thoughts are below:

•Y’shtola can no longer be taken seriously as a character. She has had a fakeout death scene each expansion since Stormblood and comes across more and more as a know-it-all with a conceited personality. Her traits of intelligence/being inquisitive could be easily transposed onto other characters with little consequence, and she has no role to play forward apart from future research into Shard-travel. Contrast this with some other prominent female characters:

oYsayle – sayings such as “you are truly beyond redemption!” and her frequent bickering with Estinien made for a more interesting party dynamic. She was a lot better at standing her ground and actually had impactful moments such as when Hraesvelgr shattered her delusions and her sacrifice to save us.

oVenat – an intelligent woman who was far less patronizing in our interactions with her, was interested in our character’s story and actively tried to connect with us beyond just explaining lore. She joins in when characters like Hythlodaeus are joking around, rather than the occasional one-off sassy comment or chuckling to herself.

•Either she progresses in a meaningful way, or she needs to exit the plot. FFXIV is in desperate need of a new poster girl, literally anyone but Y’shtola at this point. The only way I imagine that anyone can continue to tolerate her presence is if they like the way she looks, because there is hardly anything going on in the personality front these days besides the same old tired expressions. Bonus points if the new poster girl has hair a color other than blond or white. Dark or red haired characters are shockingly rare by comparison.

•Hythlodaeus was a breath of fresh air, his gag with the shark was quite funny and I’d like to see more moments like that in the future. Usually most rpgs have a party member like him who is a jokester, like Zidane or Bartz. Like Hades, I cannot think of an instance where he’s worn away at my patience whenever he was on screen.

•Thancred’s arc is over, and his role as a “spy” or rogue no longer fits with his current class. The role of the party’s spy could easily go to someone else, just like Y’shtola and Urianger’s role of being the brains/explaining lore. Besides the “this is Thancred” meme and his sacrifice in Ultima Thule, he could have died on the First and Endwalker would have largely been unaffected by his absence. His purpose has been served-let him go already. My present level of interest in him is -10/10.

•Our interactions with Hades were the best part of Elpis and he remains a fan favorite for reasons which need very little explanation. He has a no nonsense, snarky personality and he isn’t afraid to go against the grain and argue with other characters. No stoic nodding from him. You have to convince him to do things, like an actual person. What I’d give to have someone like him as a member of our travelling party.

•Hermes was a character who would have benefitted from a significantly larger amount of time fleshing out and showing us more meaningful or traumatic events happening to him the little we saw in game. He is a villain who I had very little patience or interest for.

•Meteion was great to interact with but like Hermes suffered from too little time spent with her prior to her transformation, though I ultimately had sympathy for her as an individual when she was overtaken by the hive mind of her sisters, who I read as overpowering and suppressing her until we finally broke through to her again in Ultima Thule.

•Estinien as his usual, no-nonsense and straightforward self helped make our interactions with the scions tolerable. Seeing him in action in battle gave a much needed “cool” factor that was otherwise missing in our party. Instead of prattling on about lofty ideals, he was grounded and had his head in the game. My only major complaint is how off-putting it is to see him with his hair tied up-he is significantly more heroic looking with his long hair flowing in the wind in battle, which also helps cover for how absurdly long elezen necks are.

•Alphinaud’s idealistic ramblings got stale ages ago. Seeing him fail catastrophically in Garlemald was a refreshing knockback, but his purpose in the story is otherwise fulfilled. His job change to a Sage is also somewhat problematic-with a style of weapons and fighting that would clash badly in any setting that lacks high-tech elements. I cannot picture him exploring a Heavensward-style kingdom, nor the New World in this getup. It’s completely out of place. I am also uninterested in what I can only assume is the future plan to democratize Garlemald much in the same way that Ishgard was, and I’ll gladly skip those cutscenes to spare myself the headache.

•As for Urianger I was largely uninterested in his backstory with Moebryda and the goings on with her parents. A character that was there for a while and then sacrificed herself to save Minfilia of all people did little to earn my sympathies. I was unmoved by stories about how lonely he was as a child or whatever other fluff was going on, he was a lot more tolerable in Shadowbringers compared to Endwalker. Unless there’s more deep lore to explain, he can go ahead and exit the stage and given us all a break from Shakespeare.

•Alisae was not too bad, and has the excellent feature in that she has somewhat of a backbone compared to the rest of the party. Like Estinien, she is unafraid to leap into the action and her concern for the player character came across as genuine, but care should be taken as to not overdo it. A believable character whose presence added much needed fire to the cast.

•G’raha Tia seems to serve a role more of comfort than anything else. I understand that when writing fanfiction that’s what it’s all about, but he practically has no stakes anymore. Apart from his scene in Thavnair where he temporarily displays his leadership prowess from his Crystal Exarch days and him shielding Alisae during a battle scene, his presence didn’t add very much. Coupled with how his character spiralled into meme territory after 5.3, his current reputation is that of an insufferable hero-worshipper, and one with one of the most bizarre hairdos in the entire game. Adored by his fanclub no doubt, but getting on the nerves of everyone else.

[IttyBitty]

Sorry for you public admittance of your terrible opinions

[aveyond-dreams]

This may come across as shocking to some but compared to other rpgs like Dragon Age or even other mainline FF games, the present core cast of FFXIV is quite weak by comparison. The interesting characters have exited the plot and are unlikely to return, and I don't think that FFXIV players should be subjected to a further 10 years of characters who contribute nothing.

[Nav_Fae]

Sorry for you public admittance of your terrible opinions

Sorry for the public admittance of your terrible attitude.

This is criticism done properly. I welcome the discussion.

[Mordrick]

This is criticism done properly. I welcome the discussion.

Very much agree.

I think the OP makes some great points. I agree with more than half of them. I used to really like Y'shtola but I don't think she did anything all that special or memorable in EW. I also liked G'raha MUCH MUCH better as the Crystal Exarch. I don't dislike him now but he seems more like a tag along buddy than a fierce and strategic mage.

[Padudu]

I don't have too much to add, but I actually think Alisae has had 0 development overall ever since her introduction. She never really changes from SB to EW, never has an arc to speak of and is just kind of the slightly brash, high tempered one for the Scions. Y'shtola's fake deaths have gotten way old though, at this point it's just a meme.

I'm convinced Thancred was supposed to die in ShB but they changed the plot lol.

But overall, idk I haven't had too many problems with the Scions and enjoyed them. Considering that you've basically known them from day 1 and have done basically everything together, there's only so much development they can have. They're basically there as your comfort characters since as the WoL, they're your friends.

I actually enjoy Alphinaud overall, especially since I essentially rushed from ARR to EW in a matter of like.. 4-5 months, I went from cringing at his behavior and attitude when he started up the Crystal Braves to actually appreciating him being there in HW to EW. Dude had the most apparent change of heart of all

[Ath192]

I've disliked Alphinaud for a long time. But the worst offense he ever did to us IMO was talking smack to Vauthry in his throne room surrounded by his sin eaters just because we were there with him, and he knew that if Vauthry ordered his execution right on the spot for being a brat we'd have to save his butt.

We were actively used as his personal bodyguard just so he could be a brat to a ruler while feeling safe about it.

[Saimeren]

Did you finish the story? There was a bit at the end where they all discuss breaking up the band.

Everyone went their separate ways. The Scions aren't a thing anymore and there's a good chance that we're moving on from the majority of them outside of a quest line here and there.

We're more than likely going back to the "adventure in need" trope again instead of the "WoL" shtick.

Y'shtola has no interest in collecting 20 boar hooves. Or I guess in ffxiv's case, running around between 7 zones talking to people one time back and forth for 20 mins to complete one stage of one quest.

So you're safe.

[Kolsykol]

Tbh I think people are exaggerating a lot with the whole argument about Y'shtola's fake deaths.
The only one really I think is the Stormblood one, it's a tad silly she survived that.
But the first time she entered the lifestream she came out and was permanently changed ( also applies to Thancred ).
The second time she was only in the lifestream for a very short time before Emet brought her back, she wasn't there long enough for any long term consequences and it made sense Emet would do it ( especially with Endwalker in mind I'd say where we got a better view of him as a person ).
Y'shtola didn't '' die '' and come back she made a gamble and essentially failed ( like how she got Thancred out but not herself the first time ) and Emet was around to compensate for her failure.
If he hadn't been around she would've been screwed.

Every other time she has had a fake death there were other Scions in the scene that also had it ( in the fight with Emet in Shadowbringers for example ).
Imo I think Y'shtola has stagnated as a character and that she's kinda just there, I do like her because '' sassy cat lady '' but if I am being a bit honest here too I do think she's the most boring Scion and doesn't have anything else going for her than that.
And they did drag her '' fake death '' in the lifestream out a bit much in Shadowbringers even tho it was obvious she wasn't dead but I guess from the characters pov it made sense for them to think she was dead initially.
But I really don't think it's any different than Thancred being tired after his fight with Ran'jit I mean in the end of the day Flow and the effects it has on you ( worse the longer you're there ) has been established since way back in Heavensward.
I fail to see what the issue is really with it being utilized especially when it makes sense, they're just utilizing the established lore and it makes sense.

Someone I'd very much like to see come back is Yugiri, I loved what we got of her in Stormblood and she has been around since ARR it was pretty disappointing imho that we didn't get any of her in Endwalker other than a view of her back in the end credits.
She's a pretty important character to us it's strange that she's not treated as such, when we had no one left she was the one who stepped up after the ARR ending incident.
Her and her people did quite a lot to help us and the remaining Scions out and as a '' legacy character '' I think she deserves a lot more of a presence in the story.
She should've gone with us to Garlemald and been the representative of Doma.

Did you finish the story? There was a bit at the end where they all discuss breaking up the band.

Everyone went their separate ways. The Scions aren't a thing anymore and there's a good chance that we're moving on from the majority of them outside of a quest line here and there.

We're more than likely going back to the "adventure in need" trope again instead of the "WoL" shtick.

Y'shtola has no interest in collecting 20 boar hooves. Or I guess in ffxiv's case, running around between 7 zones talking to people one time back and forth for 20 mins to complete one stage of one quest.

So you're safe.

This isn't what happened, in the next sentence Alphinaud says that it's essentially a fake story they're telling people.
They still consider themselves Scions.

[RedaAlert]

I feel like people downplay G'raha's role more often just cause of his hero-worship or fanboyism attitude, which some may find annoying but this is something that is more tolerable and looked at as 'cute' in Eastern culture.

Whether you think he is annoying or not, him having photogenic memory helped him learn the levitation spell which he used to uncover the secrets within the noumenon, which then proceed to use that spell to save dozen of people including ourselves in the Tower of Zot, then what he did in Thavanir which particularly one of his highlight moments in EW, without his stance things would have turned out far worst, and his existence alone helped us travel back to Elpis, it was him who kept Elidibus stored within the tower and it is him alone who is able to control the tower, and with his help we went back to Elpis and uncovered all we needed to know.

I am sorry, you may find him annoying or insufferable or whatever really, but that will never downplay his role within the Scions, he did same if not even more than what others did as well, so in general, choosing to ignore all that is just a person being willingly blind.

Also while some people think that him as the Exarch was really cool and awesome, I hate when people keep secrets to themselves thinking it is for the greater good, and that is something Urangier was doing alot, so I never was happy with the whole Exarch "I know what's best for us" thing.

That is my opinion.