Thread: 7.0 Tank Wishlist

Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Do tanks genuinely enjoy just being immortal and being able to ignore their party, genuinely curious

The above the comment for example you are basically giving DRK its own version of bloodwhetting on top of TBN and giving PLD its own equilibrium

If the idea is “buff sustainability then buff damage why not just not buff sustainability to fix the problem you just created

I don't want tank to ignore their party, I want that there can be a significant difference between a tank that can properly selfheal, and one that can't.
if the boss does too little damage, you can't see the difference because Kardia/Fairy is enough to heal a tank that don't even know what mitigation is beside for TB.

I want, more TB, frequent small TB, and overall hard hitting AA. At the same time, I do not want the burden of keeping the tank alive only to lie on the healers' shoulder (which was the case mostly in ARR, HW and SB as tank had little way to self heal. TBN was actually my favorite tank skill in SB.) The idea is that a bad tank would require constant healer's attention, so you know he's bad. And a good tank would require very little or "much less".
At the same time, I do not enjoy the current state where, beside in some very specific content, the boss hit so little that tank can totally self heal and require no heal.

Basically, I want mitigation to become a core part of the tank identity. I want mitigation to be much more than just "I popped my 3 CD on that TB then shirked, see you in 3min for the next TB".
You can't have that without giving them the tools to do so. (and obviously the content should follow, so buff the AA from dungeons bosses by 100-200% ffs...)

Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Do tanks genuinely enjoy just being immortal and being able to ignore their party, genuinely curious

The above the comment for example you are basically giving DRK its own version of bloodwhetting on top of TBN and giving PLD its own equilibrium

If the idea is “buff sustainability then buff damage why not just not buff sustainability to fix the problem you just created

No, the reason i picked Dark knight over the others was because it had actual defensive shortcomings, but you were also rewarded with more damage. It was actually different. Now it's just arbitrarily worse for the sake of being worse.
The streamer and his fans have spoken though, they don't want the ridiculous sustain and utility they bring to be considered in tank balance. Conveniently, just forget that jobs on the other roles have their damage taxed for their utility.
Honestly, i don't see why anyone would pick up tank in FF rn. There is Warrior, Worse warrior with a shield and a long cooldown on it's invuln, Worse Warrior with a greatsword that can't heal and Worse Warrior that can sometimes do sliiiiightly more damage with a gun that's prone to drift.
And the only way they're ever going to adress the state the tanks are in is with more powercreep because there's no way they'll make the streamer and his fans mad again.

I don't think i'll be playing tank anymore going forward. I just don't think tank balance can ever be argued in good faith when hyerbolic rants of a biased streamer and their fans are taken seriously.

what if the entire tank role have a shared gauge system? Have it gain gauge when the tank takes damage and the abilities that can spend the gauge are all defensive because let's be honest, the moment we introduce an offensive cooldown tied to it, even if it does 100 potency, people will fight for MT spot to squeeze out even more dps. The speed with which is filled up depends on the amount of damage taken. it will fill faster if the tank is doing wall to wall pulls or taking tank busters. To avoid abuse, gauge decays over time when out of combat. The abilities can be used can either be a self-heal, mitigation or crowd control.

Originally Posted by Lyth

The main issues facing tanks are as follows:

• Self-positioning/self-orientating bosses that return to center and lock themselves in place before every mechanic
• Bosses that don't have damage patterns that sufficiently challenge or place your available defensive resources under stress (i.e. invuln-swap)
• Bosses that generally don't require a second tank outside of being an understudy for when the first one dies
• Erosion of intrinsic tank value (if your tank dies then it's a wipe/if your tank dies then the adds eat your healers)
• Widening gap between raid contributions of true DPS and supports
• Unsatisfying gear progression (Tenacity vs. DH)
• General perception of support gameplay as being lower skill compared to true DPS counterparts
• Large balance discrepancies persisting across multiple expansions that consistently favor certain jobs over others
• Large balance discrepancies in critical role features (invuln recasts - Holmgang, raidwide mitigation - SiO, self-sustain)
• Slow design implementation of solutions/inertia
• Lack of innovation outside of simplified hand-me-downs from true DPS
• Several expansions behind other roles in terms of movement tools

While I don't think that you can lay the blame for this on any specific person, a lot of these issues are self-perpetuated by the community. That's where a lot of the inertia to change comes from. We get too focused on what is currently comfortable or advantageous, and that comes at the cost of improving design or even having fun.

It's worth asking yourself why you would want to currently play a tank over melee. I think the only real drawback to this historically was the fact that tanks had a lot of the really fun job aesthetics (swords). I think if they ever introduce a Mystic Knight/Ivalician-styled Unyielding Blade job into melee, there'd never be a reason to play tank again.

I would strongly recommend swapping out to melee if any of this resonates with you. If the supply of tanks drops sufficiently, then you'll see big changes and the inertia will be overcome. If not, you can enjoy everything that you currently love about tanking while having more appreciation for your skills and more value for effort. And the queue times are still fairly minimal, which makes me suspect that it's going to be the latter rather than the former in the long run.

Honestly If they made a DPS with the holy theme I would no longer care about Paladin.