Heavensward the worst expansion

[EverQuest]

There’s a video going around stating people wouldn’t tolerate the gameplay.

The thing is expansions should generally improve over previous iterations.

Endwalker should be conceptually a leap forward in game play however it’s like a shadow bringer 2.0 with a story you either find better worse or the same. That’s however generally a one time experience.

Ideally I’d like to see dawn take a step forward like going from stormblood to shadowbringer did. If it’s endwalker 3.0 it’s just not good enough.

What do I mean innovation?

New gearing methods new end game things to do besides ultimates

I want new mechanics that isnt just a variation of x or the same thing

A better leveling experience

Better transmog

More interactive stories

More voice acting

I get it mmos are a bit learly of trying new things that don’t work but only by trying can we find things that work.

Yeah island expeditions were hot garbage but hey they tried for example.

This game is like eating the same apple pie your mom makes every year it’s always the same, which ain’t bad but it’s time for some whip cream maybe some ice cream the same ole same ole is getting old.

Think about when the first ultimate came out it was new it was fun and unique we need another spark preferably something for the majority

[Derio]

HW imo is the second greatest expansion only behind Shadowbringers. HW paved the way for many systems we have today.

Introduced Large scale battle content.
Good relic system.
Most dungeons added in a expansion.
Introduced normal raids.
Enhanced on the areas changing environment appearance based on player progression through the story with alexander and Idyllshire.
First expansion to add additional tank and healer jobs.
Was the first expansion to expose the imbalance and the way the dev team balances jobs.
Increased voice acting.
Perhaps the best main and side story quests in terms of storytelling.
The first dynamic 24 man alliance raid that introduced a new boss based on conditions.
First expansion to include free company's in content.
First expansion to expand crafting.

If anything HW is the greatest expansion in terms of the dev team taking the most chances on new and innovative content and not being afraid of feedback when trying new content and systems entirely. SB enhanced the process and SHB almost perfected it. With EW being a copy and paste of SHB but they cut some content out with large scale battle content and dynamic relic grind.

We are hoping that DT takes the good from SHB and the good from EW and expand on that.

[Oizen]

Stormblood best expansion.

[Connor]

Personally I think every expansion has its good and bad points lol. That said, I’m all for them innovating more when it comes to new content.

[Atelier-Bagur]

HW imo is the second greatest expansion only behind Shadowbringers. HW paved the way for many systems we have today.

Introduced Large scale battle content.
Good relic system.
Most dungeons added in a expansion.
Introduced normal raids.
Enhanced on the areas changing environment appearance based on player progression through the story with alexander and Idyllshire.
First expansion to add additional tank and healer jobs.
Was the first expansion to expose the imbalance and the way the dev team balances jobs.
Increased voice acting.
Perhaps the best main and side story quests in terms of storytelling.
The first dynamic 24 man alliance raid that introduced a new boss based on conditions.
First expansion to include free company's in content.
First expansion to expand crafting.

If anything HW is the greatest expansion in terms of the dev team taking the most chances on new and innovative content and not being afraid of feedback when trying new content and systems entirely. SB enhanced the process and SHB almost perfected it. With EW being a copy and paste of SHB but they cut some content out with large scale battle content and dynamic relic grind.

We are hoping that DT takes the good from SHB and the good from EW and expand on that.

The nostalgia goggles is strong with this one

[Kaurhz]

HW imo is the second greatest expansion only behind Shadowbringers. HW paved the way for many systems we have today.

Introduced Large scale battle content.
Good relic system.
Most dungeons added in a expansion.
Introduced normal raids.
Enhanced on the areas changing environment appearance based on player progression through the story with alexander and Idyllshire.
First expansion to add additional tank and healer jobs.
Was the first expansion to expose the imbalance and the way the dev team balances jobs.
Increased voice acting.
Perhaps the best main and side story quests in terms of storytelling.
The first dynamic 24 man alliance raid that introduced a new boss based on conditions.
First expansion to include free company's in content.
First expansion to expand crafting.

I mean some of these were just by virtue of it being the first expansion, more than anything else, but to address each point individually.

Introduced Large scale battle content. - They did, and it flopped several times, was removed and iterated on several times before being permanently removed.

Good relic system. - It was a big grind, but I would necessarily call it a good system. Exploratory content, as flawed as they were and still are, are the closest examples of being good.

Most dungeons added in a expansion. - I wouldn't say more is necessarily better. You do them once or twice, then you only did them on roulette.

Introduced normal raids. - This is just by virtue of the expansion being before another. Complaints were raised extensively in ARR with regards to fairly pivotal story content being locked behind them. This was going to happen regardless of the expansion that after.

Enhanced on the areas changing environment appearance based on player progression through the story with alexander and Idyllshire. - It was also home to some of the worst Aetheryte placement in the games history.

Increased voice acting. - This increases with each proceeding expansion. Stormblood had more than Heavensward, and then Shadowbringers had more than Stormblood, just as Endwalker has more than Shadowbringers.

Perhaps the best main and side story quests in terms of storytelling. - Heavensward was home to some very great highs, and also very great lows with the story - Parts of the story were absolutely downright predictable and borderline wasteful. Personally, I would be inclined to give it to Shadowbringers.

The first dynamic 24 man alliance raid that introduced a new boss based on conditions. - Is this in reference to Proto-Ultima? I am pretty sure this was added after the actual raid itself, and if it is in reference to proto-ultima it was added 3.55a, and the only condition to my knowledge was whether someone had or hadn't picked up a quest, otherwise it defaulted to the Handmaiden. I don't believe there was anything else.

First expansion to include free company's in content. - It did include Free Company crafting. This was good. However, the Diadem which this could also reference was iterated on and removed several times. It was a risk that didn't really pay off, and was also something you could access from the Airship in Foundation.

First expansion to expand crafting. - This is both good, and bad depending on your perspective. Many of the systems they introduced that expanded on crafting were either removed, or made into a husk because they had absolutely no clue what to actually do with them.

If anything HW is the greatest expansion in terms of the dev team taking the most chances on new and innovative content and not being afraid of feedback when trying new content and systems entirely. SB enhanced the process and SHB almost perfected it. With EW being a copy and paste of SHB but they cut some content out with large scale battle content and dynamic relic grind.

We are hoping that DT takes the good from SHB and the good from EW and expand on that.

A lot of Heavensward was just by virtue of being the first expansion more than anything else. So it's difficult to praise it for paving the way and being a bastion of innovation. Like, could many people retain the same feedback they do if the expansion had come later or after ones such as Stormblood or Shadowbringers? I don't think they could. - But this is just my perception.

Overall, for content, I would probably edge to a blend between Stormblood and Shadowbringers being the best of them... Stormblood they took their lessons pretty closely and refined the product whilst still keeping an eye on all audiences. They understood back then (and especially with Shadowbringers), that you simply weren't going to give everyone, everything that they want.

[Poporito_Popoto]

HW had pervy elves, roofies and emo dragons. Only good point was Leather Mommy.

1 out of 5 Tatarus

[NanaWiloh]

My opinion best to ugh.. Shadowbringers> Heavensward>Endwalker>Stormblood. Would have Hw and Ew battling for second but EW pacing of slow,fast slow..grinded my nerves a little too much.

[Shikiseki]

This may be a biased nostalgic view on things but you cannot deny that Heavensward was the only expansion that actually had a cohesive theme and a connected expansion of the OG continent. And while it had its edges, for me it was way and beyond anything we have right now in terms of battle and gameplay design.

The 8man raids actually still felt like raids, alliance raids actually felt threatening at times compared to the tutorial/baby mode that Myths of the realm is, the triad battles were quite unique, the post MSQ story was also insanely strong with the final steps of faith, jobs still had somewhat of an identity with encounter variance to keep you on your toes and they weren't afraid to introduce new content despite pushing out 3 jobs AND hard mode dungeons at the same time. I think this was the developer's peak in terms of passion for this game imo.

As for the story - you were lost and alone but quickly made new dear friends along the way despite all the hardship without any kind of OP Scion magicks (who at that time felt more like some snobby elite circle you had basically no relation to at all). That fireplace scene still remains one of my favourite scenes to this day. For the first time you had your OWN party, apart from the scions and it genuinely felt like it was YOUR story instead of someone elses.
It was the only expansion that felt like you were going through a classic final fantasy journey (this was also the reason Shadowbringers is also one of my favs too)


Sure things are more streamlined and refined now but at the same time, this is what many people criticize about the game these days and got tired of the same formula over and over again

[Oizen]

and iterated on several times before

But this right here is why HW can't be the worst expansion. Yeah it did a lot of shit wrong, but they were changing it, they tried to fix shit, and they did eventually fix shit.

Meanwhile in Endwalker,

Remember when they added Island Sanctuary, took no feedback on it, and let it rot, and are now abandoning it entirely?
Remember when they added V&C Dungeons, no one really did them they ignored all the feedback, and now its likely going to be the most dead content this game has ever seen, they'll even lie to us and call it wildly popular in interviews too.
Remember when they added Eureka Orthos, and it died out in a week because the first 30 floors are a slog and not even worth doing to level your alt jobs, and it universally became the most hated deep dungeon?

Like damn I miss when this game would take feedback on content and try to fix it if it wasn't right. Endwalker has just been releasing half baked systems and never even seeing if people even wanted them in the first place.