Endwalker hates mid-core players

[Asari5]

i guess 'most' of us agree when i say dungeons are casual content and savage is hard content

so we could say anything between, the bridge so to say, is midcore.

this means we have normal raid and extrem trials. other than that there isnt much left.
a-raids have been there, but not anymore.

when we look at this content its pretty much everything harder than dungeons without body checks involving the whole group... there you have mid-core content.



not like every fight fits into it, but thats impossible anyway. difficulty is a spectrum. you have extrems with body checks which arent on savage lvl and then you have fights like P1S which isnt really savage lvl either

and if someone thinks: what? wait.... extrem is too difficult to be mid-core then thise few players might just be low end players.. thats alright.
or the other way around players might just be too good... high end player? (i dont wanna use hardcore because too many relate that to time)

[Atelier-Bagur]

I mean, the issue with FFXIV is that savage became more mainstream due to shadowbringers and it caused feedback to tilt towards the "progression = power" spectrum, as it got a lot of people into using savage as a gearing mechanism for jobs when it was supposed to be a self contained eco system for challenge runners. They added Ultimate into the game as well so now there is a question as to who savage is supposed to be for, since Ultimate is now the new challenge runner mode.

Effectively, savage is warping the system that they created for progression that was fair to just about anyone: Log in and do some kind of end game content, and regardless of what you did you would progress towards better item level. With Savage, someone can not only do that, but leap ahead of everyone else by getting the top end gear on week 2 where the baseline gear is just being introduced. Even if the actual change to stats is not much, it still creates an objectively better path as long as someone can also max tomestones in the same week as progressing savage. So someone could do the "mid core" content that doesn't give an advantage but just gives tomestones and maybe craft materials, or they can go do the slightly harder savage fight and get rewarded with power plus tomestones.

Like, the FFXIV team did this to themselves it isn't anyone in the community being evil here pointing out that they destroyed their own value proposition. There's no way anyone is going to do stuff like criterion or perhaps even unreal if they are just wasting time compared to the almighty gear grinder wheel they stuck in the middle of the game. Casual players are just going to keep doing roulettes and alliance raids so they aren't going to touch these things until they are in the past and they can go in unsync. Heck, even the new deep dungeon is easily ignorable unless someone is grinding up some job they haven't leveled, and PvP is just about the only other content in the patch that has a pull because of the time limited offerings. Not even sure if a casual player would engage in PvP but if anyone here who ignores EX fights, unreals, and criterion does PvP feel free to chime in.

Bottom Line, rewards drives content. You have to give appealing rewards as well as sensible ones to give that content meaning

[Colt47]

Bottom Line, rewards drives content. You have to give appealing rewards as well as sensible ones to give that content meaning

The one who determines what constitutes a reward is the designer of the game. The impression of what is rewarding is just the result of that choice. It's something that isn't very well grasped by people in general as when someone is playing a game, they are playing within the sandbox the designers built, but it is totally possible to build a game that has no item level progression at end game and still have rewarding content. The issue is that they polluted the original idea by having savage grant higher level gear and then having savage become more popular. What was acceptable prior to ShB isn't the same as what has become acceptable after ShB.

[Poporito_Popoto]

"Endwalker hates mid-core players"

I know I do. Eff those guys.

[Darkobra]

There's now been enough of these threads that I'm starting to think Endwalker hates players.

[Araxes]

That list aint completely right. There is no mid core. There is only super easy and super hard. Until a few years ago i was doing savage raids and extremes but for me it was to much stress for to little reward.
My Wife started playing like a year ago and while shes dying of boredom in normal dungeons, she would never dream of killing a current extreme primal.

So no. There is no midcore. For me personally, midcore would be extremes or Criterions without timelimit. Its always the "we devs make it easy for us" Timelimit. That is also the Reason everybody has to slot full DPS materia on every Job that exists.

[OgruMogru]

We need unreal versions of older savage tiers! A whole tier at a time on a rotating basis just like the unreal ex ones.