Dungeon Changes

[SeverianLyonesse]

People don't hate dungeon design, they hate having to account for other players. It's like having to deal with traffic on the road; someone is so conditioned to just find it frustrating, even in a case where it isn't. Even the idea of players having differing goals in a dungeon sends people into "Well everyone will hate it! Nobody wants it!" chant, even if all people want is a breakaway from the [mob pack > wall > mob pack > boss > repeat x2] design that has become so frustratingly formulaic.

This is really the core of the problem. Dungeons, raids, and trials (and job designs) are so formulaic because most players have no patience for inefficiency and failure. This is a problem for all online games but is especially disappointing for MMOs, which at least give off the appearance of being more social and collaborative.

Unless and until the community fosters a culture of caring less about speed clears than it does about simply enjoying the game and growing alongside other players, this is going to remain the design. The low skill threshold is necessary for accessibility (which equates to lower wait times) and consistency (which equates to faster clears). And sorry stupid humans, but I just don't think that many of you are so altruistic.

I don't play pug content, including roulettes, unless I am fine failing and don't mind teaching people things. Not that I think the game will ever change, but if it did: the only solution is for players to take on the burden of creating consistency and clears through community pedagogy, instead of relying on the game's own willingness to remove complexity and challenge inherent to its design.

[Mayhemmer]

I do.

I want dungeon where I have to be a tank. Not a punching ball with a magic button which keep mobs focus on you and... That's it. Let me LOS, do intelligent pull, work on the mobs location so the melee can do their positionnal correctly.

I want dungeon where I have to stress heal because said pull didn't go right.

And I want dungeon where, as a dps, I have to kill something ASAP or it will be a disaster (and give us more utility buttons, please).

A lot of "I, ME, PERSONALLY". I know. But please don't use the "You don't know what you really want" argument.

I started playing around patch 3.2, and I still remember when tanks would priority mark every enemy in every trash pack, and when you didn't just wall-to-wall and facetank in every dungeon. I remember hearing dungeons would be "harder" in ShB and thinking maybe healers and casters would have to utilize sleep on dangerous enemies. Funny foolish me, hehe. Obviously I can't expect the game to not evolve over the years since then, but I still do miss a lot of it. Maybe it's nostalgia from an era where the game was new to me and I'm pining to experience all the things I didn't get to back in that era of the game, but I think I just want them to shake things up again in a way that's deeper than adding instant-kill mechanics on every other mob.

This is really the core of the problem. Dungeons, raids, and trials (and job designs) are so formulaic because most players have no patience for inefficiency and failure. This is a problem for all online games but is especially disappointing for MMOs, which at least give off the appearance of being more social and collaborative.

Unless and until the community fosters a culture of caring less about speed clears than it does about simply enjoying the game and growing alongside other players, this is going to remain the design. The low skill threshold is necessary for accessibility (which equates to lower wait times) and consistency (which equates to faster clears). And sorry stupid humans, but I just don't think that many of you are so altruistic.

I wish it could be so, but alas. The engrained impatience and reactionary hostility to perceived slights is, itself, a cultural thing, just exasperated by online anonymity. I'd love if the devs started to experiment with dungeon design that required, or at the very least encouraged, some patience and co-operative decision making, and looked the naysayers straight in the eyes and said "If you'd like the experience to tailor more to your desires, please use the trust system."