Arcanist is weird

[wylantar]

I got a friend to try FFXIV and he picked Arcanist as a starting class. He had a lot of questions which really got me thinking about how weird this class is.

He immediately gets access to Summon Carbuncle but it literally does nothing but follow him around. Why does ACN/SMN even have a pet bar at this point?

He can kill things faster by spamming Ruin than using Aethercharge and Summon Ruby. Also Ruby Ruin looks exactly like normal Ruin. It supposedly does fire damage, shouldn't it at least be red or something?


Suggestion: Why not just throw Carbuncle in the rotation like Ifrit/Garuda/Titan? Then replace Summon Ruby with Summon Carbuncle and have it use i dunno, Searing Light, and then Ruby Ruin could be Holy Ruin or something.

I assume they just didn't care cause you're only an Arcanist for a little while but its super unpolished and awkward.

[Kalaam]

That's kind of a side effect of the SMN rework, a lot of abilities in the rotation at low level are just recolored ruin essentially. it's very weird to play.

[Ggwppino]

That's kind of a side effect of the SMN rework, a lot of abilities in the rotation at low level are just recolored ruin essentially. it's very weird to play.

Not that It changes much at 90

[Kalaam]

Not that It changes much at 90

That's the funny thing, it highlights that the level 90 version is the same just with flashier effects but in essence has no gameplay distinction.
It's like pre-90 SMN is a beta version using placeholder assets.

[Renathras]

That's kind of a side effect of the SMN rework, a lot of abilities in the rotation at low level are just recolored ruin essentially. it's very weird to play.

The irony to me about that, that in particular, is that it's not like we don't have tons of orange fire ball, purple lighting ball, and CNJ's Stone 1 animation (just do 1 stone instead of 3) that they could have used.

I love new SMN, personally, but I do feel like they missed some easy opportunities there. Even just a slight color tint to each would be nice. Not sure why they didn't do it other than maybe just didn't see it would have much point since you level out of them eventually. But like Fire 1 and Ruin 1 use effectively the same animation, just with a different color. Seems it would have been pretty easy to just do a couple more colors. If they wanted to keep it distinct (not that SCH's Broil II isn't just 4 Fire I's in a trench-coat as it is...), they could have made the core black and just the aura around them red/yellow/green...but whatever.

[Chasingstars]

I think you may want to reread aethercharge. It literally boosts their Ruin damage by 50 potency, so from 240 to 290. In addition Ruby Ruin is 340 potency, which is 100 potency higher than your base Ruin when you exit out of aethercharge.

[Rongway]

I think you may want to reread aethercharge. It literally boosts their Ruin damage by 50 potency, so from 240 to 290.

Aethercharge proper is a 0p GCD though, so the 50p it adds to each Ruin only nets a total of 10-60p once you account for the lost Ruin. Aethercharge's value is not in what it adds to Ruin but in unlocking the summons, and that value is funny at times, with the values of each element varying wildly over the course of SMN's career.

[Chasingstars]

Aethercharge proper is a 0p GCD though, so the 50p it adds to each Ruin only nets a total of 10-60p once you account for the lost Ruin. Aethercharge's value is not in what it adds to Ruin but in unlocking the summons, and that value is funny at times, with the values of each element varying wildly over the course of SMN's career.

Except raw numbers from potency value are different than what you get at later levels.

I hop on with my level 34 test summoner, there was only a difference of 40-60 damage per ruin 2, as I was going from 160 to 220 in damage. Which is what you would expect from an ARR ruin.

Meanwhile when I get on my level 90 the difference of averages on 11000, 16000, or 20000 based on whether or not its ruin, bahamut-ruin, or phoenix-ruin. Which is only a difference of 340 to 440 to 540 in potency. Which honestly still looks the same except its just a big number if two extra zeroes are filed off as the ARR example.

The original poster makes it out like its some weird anomaly, when that is just the squished math of ARR.

[Rongway]

Except raw numbers from potency value are different than what you get at later levels.

This reply is largely irrelevant to what I said, though. The topic was specifically Aethercharge. Summon Bahamut and Summon Phoenix were never in question in this thread.

[Rongway]

Aethercharge proper is a 0p GCD though, so the 50p it adds to each Ruin only nets a total of 10-60p once you account for the lost Ruin. Aethercharge's value is not in what it adds to Ruin but in unlocking the summons, and that value is funny at times, with the values of each element varying wildly over the course of SMN's career.

Back to this topic for a moment, as I've taken a bit of time to think of why Aethercharge is particularly bad.

First, its evolutions, which are mostly not problematic:

• Dreadwyrm Trance - Ignoring the first two levels, gains Deathflare and then Dreadwyrm Trance is immediately worth 500p, on its own making up for the lost Ruin.
• Summon Bahamut - Immediately worth a Deathflare and an Akh Morn.
• Summon Phoenix - Immediately worth a Revelation.

Aethercharge and Dreadwyrm Trance during its first two levels each cost a GCD without providing an oGCD that can immediately make up for that lost GCD. Do they make up for the lost GCD over the course of their duration by increasing the potency of Ruin, and then after their duration by enabling the elemental summons? Yes, of course. But their immediate effect is lost DPS.

Comparisons of pure Ruin spam vs Aethercharged Ruin spam:

Lv6-29  Potency    Running      Charged    Potency    Running    Difference

Ruin        240        240      Aethercharge     0          0         (-240)
Ruin        240        480      Ruin           290        290         (-190)
Ruin        240        720      Ruin           290        580         (-140)
Ruin        240        960      Ruin           290        870          (-90)
Ruin        240      1,200      Ruin           290      1,160          (-40)
Ruin        240      1,440      Ruin           290      1,450            10
Ruin        240      1,680      Ruin           290      1,740            60



Lv30-53  Potency    Running      Charged    Potency    Running    Difference

Ruin II     270        270      Aethercharge     0          0         (-270)
Ruin II     270        540      Ruin II        320        320         (-220)
Ruin II     270        810      Ruin II        320        640         (-170)
Ruin II     270      1,080      Ruin II        320        960         (-120)
Ruin II     270      1,350      Ruin II        320      1,280          (-70)
Ruin II     270      1,620      Ruin II        320      1,600          (-20)
Ruin II     270      1,890      Ruin II        320      1,920            30



Lv54-57  Potency    Running      Charged    Potency    Running    Difference

Ruin III    300        300      Aethercharge     0          0         (-300)
Ruin III    300        600      Ruin III       350        350         (-250)
Ruin III    300        900      Ruin III       350        700         (-200)
Ruin III    300      1,200      Ruin III       350      1,050         (-150)
Ruin III    300      1,500      Ruin III       350      1,400         (-100)
Ruin III    300      1,800      Ruin III       350      1,750          (-50)
Ruin III    300      2,100      Ruin III       350      2,100             0



Lv58-59  Potency    Running      Charged    Potency    Running    Difference

Ruin III    300        300      Dwyrm Trance     0          0         (-300)
Ruin III    300        600      A. Impulse     440        440         (-160)
Ruin III    300        900      A. Impulse     440        880          (-20)
Ruin III    300      1,200      A. Impulse     440      1,320           120
Ruin III    300      1,500      A. Impulse     440      1,760           260
Ruin III    300      1,800      A. Impulse     440      2,200           400 
Ruin III    300      2,100      A. Impulse     440      2,640           540




Lv60-69  Potency    Running      Charged    Potency    Running    Difference

Ruin III    300        300      DwT + Dflare   500        500           200 
Ruin III    300        600      A. Impulse     440        940           340
Ruin III    300        900      A. Impulse     440      1,380           480
Ruin III    300      1,200      A. Impulse     440      1,820           620
Ruin III    300      1,500      A. Impulse     440      2,260           760
Ruin III    300      1,800      A. Impulse     440      2,700           900 
Ruin III    300      2,100      A. Impulse     440      3,140         1,040

As you can see, if we consider only the Aethercharge portion of the rotation and nothing else, Aethercharge is a loss from the moment you get it all the way until Lv60. Worse, it becomes more of a loss at Lvs 30 and 54. It literally, objectively gets worse at those two levels!

And this is considering someone who is able to get all 6 Ruins into one Aethercharge. I have 40ms ping most days and I can only get a 6th Ruin if I have a 2.48s or faster GCD. There are probably people who can never get that 6th ruin, and for them Aethercharge is only a 10p gain with Ruin I and a complete loss with Ruin II and Ruin III.

This all makes it really easy for a new player to perceive Aethercharge as a waste of time.


Yeah, I know SMN already does disproportionately high damage considering its Action set as a whole; no I don't think SMN needs to do more damage. I'm just saying I understand why this looks strange to new folks, who might see that it takes, e.g., five Ruin casts to kill a target whether they Aethercharge or not so why waste a GCD on Aethercharge.