Viper would of been better if it had a different name

[Shurrikhan]

I don't like names with "master" in them, they are kind of generic and communicate a kind of puerile obsession with dominance, especially in the case of "puppetmaster" and "beastmaster". Also I think they just are descriptively very weak.

At any rate, this job is very clearly what we see in "Hunter" classes. Things like Druid's Soulbeast in GW2, Hunter's Beastmaster in WoW, classic Hunter subclass Ranger archetype in DnD (Drizzt), etc.

It has almost nothing in common with GW2's Soulbeast (this neither uses beasts nor 'eats' them to convert their attacks instead into buffs, and GW2 Soulbeast tends to be used with an axe+other melee or longbow, neither of which have anything to do with dualswords, let alone a two-sided spear or twin-blade).

It's nothing like Hunter's Beastmaster (a purely ranged specialization that deals most of its damage through pets and carries the majority of its complexity through the timing of bleeding enemies with its shots) in WoW.

It is nothing like the Hunter subclass Ranger archetype in DnD (which tends to require Finesse weapons in order to be a competitive build and even then is outperformed by Rogue builds unless you actually make good use of your pet and your ranged capacity).

And frankly, "Rangers/Hunters" *are* the "ninjas" of the West, as a matter of their general mythos and role as kind of lone-wolf, transient combat-masters.

DnD rangers are not combat-masters. They simply have a good balance of direct to indirect skills useful for questing.

I don't think the snake motif communicates Zidane at all. Zidane is never associated with snakes, and his trance form is more "beastlike".

Probably because it's not intended to? You're making an unfounded assumption and then saying it disappoints you because it doesn't fit that unfounded assumption.

I will forever be wondering why the Hunter has such a stupid name while Ninja isn't called "Froggy".

"I will forever be wondering why the staff-fighter is named Black Mage."

It's not a Hunter. It has nothing in common with other games Hunters. It shows no evidence of wanting to be a Hunter.

I think the term "Viper" is a really weak flavor connection to the weapon

It's at least as likely that the name has little to do with the weapons, just as "Sage" has little to do with its floating Galactica toys, "Red Mage" has little to do with swords, "Bard" has little necessarily to do with bows, and even "Machinist" would not necessitate a pistol. We have what would appear to be a viper symbol as part of the key art.

It may well be that the weapon was fit to the needs of that group of people or its martial proficiencies, rather than the group naming themselves after the weapon.

Zidane may be nominally a thief, but between his sword-staff, status-effect weapons, and "Killer" skillset, he very easily passes as a kind of Hunter/Ranger

Zidane's abilities: Steal (take an item), Flee (escape battle), Canvas (see the enemy's items), Distract (allows back attack), Imbued Weapon (inflict weapon's status/special effect onto target), Goad (inflicts Troubled), Patsy (sacrifice self to give HP and MP to others), Lucky Seven (Luck-based damage), Thievery (deal damage based on Speed and number of successful steals).

His Trance abilities give him a bit of second theme via unaspected attacks and elemental AoEs, but that's it. His core is... through and through... a Thief. Which is why the game even classifies him as a Thief. And likely why his very profession is... a thief.

Plus, in my opinion, people associate his character more with the "Festival of the Hunt" and the killer soundtrack (there is a track called Hunter's Chance) more than the flavor text of a single weapon.

Zidane has a literal theme. Hunter's Chance is about the competition against Freya, a Dragoon who literally gets more powerful by hunting certain creatures, more so a theme of/for Zidane specifically.
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Again, Severian, I would love a scouting hero that was a bit more wild, tribal, etc., in keeping with Zidane under Trance, but... none of your warrants for saying Viper should be that (or even that Zidane was that except by quite a stretch that, even then, applies only to when he was in Trance) make any damn sense.

By all means, prefer a Hunter over what we're getting, but Viper's not being a Hunter is not a mere naming issue, especially if DnD's Ranger, GW2's Soulbeast, WoW's Hunter, etc., have anything to do with what you mean by that name.


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WoW Hunters have access to swords and polearms and can dual wield.

Two out of three specs have no melee attacks outside of a single fall-back slow and do not equip melee weapons; apart from that skill, every attack requires a ranged-weapon. Even for the remaining "Melee" spec, the melee attacks do not work without a two-handed weapon and its only advantage over other melee is the uptime afforded by carrying a hand-crossbow.

None of the Hunter specs can dual-wield.

If you're playing Classic, then sure, they have melee weapons. As stat sticks. They aren't actually used in combat unless you're bound within melee range somehow and have the MP to spare, since it's painfully inefficient.

But easily the two most common archetypes are some sort of bow, or some sort of dual wielding sword/axe thing.

The most common archetype of a Ranger is a guy skilled with a bow or crossbow who has another weapon (hatchet, sidesword, etc.) as a fallback weapon.

The sole archetypal weight for a 'dual-wielding Ranger' in DnD, something wildly impractical that would reduce the efficacy of their other more unique actions by using up all their bonus actions for poor amounts of extra damage compared to what a Rogue or Fighter could put out, begins and ends with Drizzt. It's an outlier, not a norm.

The Hunter sub-class was made so people could better play as a Drizzt-alike, but it's not a build that particularly synergizes with the rest of a Ranger's kit (has nothing to do with Hunting, only to do with cumulative and/or AoE effect against specific types of enemies, effects which would do far more good in the hands of a Monk, Fighter, Berserker, or Paladin).

[PercibelTheren]

I'm not a huge fan of the name, either. Definitely made me roll my eyes when I was watching the reveal. My first thought was "oh I guess Reaper wasn't edgy enough". It won't be the only job with a silly name that doesn't really describe it very well, so it isn't bothering me *too* much.

[Reinha]

Ranger would have been a good name, with the acronym RNG of course. If the job uses spells, also bladesinger (BDS).

Did Sephiroth... do this?

I don't get it.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Ranger would have been a good name, with the acronym RNG of course. If the job uses spells, also bladesinger (BDS).



I don't get it.

Its a quote from FFVII when the party travels in the overworld and sees Midgar Zolom (which is a giant swamp snake) get brutally impaled in a dead tree and assume that it was Sephiroths handiwork. Its a bit of a meme

[Reinha]

Its a quote from FFVII when the party travels in the overworld and sees Midgar Zolom (which is a giant swamp snake) get brutally impaled in a dead tree and assume that it was Sephiroths handiwork. Its a bit of a meme

Alright, no wonder I didn't get it. It's from 1997.

[Darkobra]

I don't get it.

In your picture is a snake also impaled on a sword which looks similar.

[Payadopa]

Feels like uh... 2021 when SGE was announced. I can't even pretend to care about this to any degree. I'd rather be more worried about the gameplay and how it'll be your usual "press this button every 30 seconds to make DPS go up but blue this time".

[Calysto]

Not much opinion on the name...

It just seems a waste to have the quest started in Uldah instead of Gridania because the GC there is Twin Adder and that would fit more for job literally that snake name in another language that wield twin blades...

[Mcg55ss]

I'm still in the air about the name but what it suggests to me is some type of poison /dot melee class what is the traditional 2 minute burst. If it's that I think the name fits fine

[Atelier-Bagur]

I'm still in the air about the name but what it suggests to me is some type of poison /dot melee class what is the traditional 2 minute burst. If it's that I think the name fits fine

Pretty much. Wish they showed off more but we cant make an accurate judgement of the class yet to determine whether Viper is appropriate or not.

If its indeed a dot melee class then the name is warranted.