2 minute meta: Rework or Remove?

[Rychu]

Do you people also realise that because of the 2 min meta, they were able to create the raids and ultimates for ew, the ultimates being mechanically the most fun, interesting and hardest to date.

Ehhhh debateable. I definitely enjoyed my prog of DSR and TOP *DSR more*, but this savage tier was a whole herd of really great and pretty fucking shit. The tiers kind of just got a bit worst as we went on. P6S,P7S,P11S were all really boring fights and some of the worst designed I have seen in awhile, but at least P11S had cool visuals. P8S was a fun puzzle boss which made it the coolest thing on your first clear, but made it really boring on reclears. P12S was a disappointment by all counts, the second phase felt really underbaked compared to P8S and P4S. P4S especially was the best of the 3 finales by a wide margin. And we have to think about this P4S was the first savage tier made with this new meta in mind and it has only gotten worse overall. P9S was good and P10S was a surprisingly amazing second turn but that has nothing to do with the 2 minute meta. P10S's 2 minute bursts all did the same thing of 1 stack beam and 2 solo beams and just stood there and do your burst, that isn't interesting or game design changing, it's lame.

Not only that but the 2min meta makes accessability to savage slightly better for midcore players (there's still too big a gap in difficulty though), who are the real ones who have suffered this expansion to begin with.

I would like more clarification as to the gap in difficulty and how they have suffered this expansion the most. Not saying you are wrong, I just don't want to assume and be rude by mistake.

Raiders got all the usual savages, some of which were pretty tough aswell, the usual extremes and 2 ultimates this expansion, a lot of them having fantastic designs and some of them being the best too date in part thanks to 120s meta, so it DID work better than the old system.

I think that this is just comparing apples and oranges. Raiders would have gotten these things regardless of if they changed the meta or not so we can't just parade the 2 minute meta as this savior of raiding. We only didnt get a second ultimate in shadowbringers due to the pandemic throwing a whole shitstorm at the developers while they were also well underway of developing Endwalker.

It could be improved sure, but not before they add some serious midcore content first, hardcore raiders had their fill this expansion, there's 0 question about that.

Again, I would like to ask for clarification, also what do we mean by midcore content in the first place? Because I consider extremes to be midcore content, savage and ultimates are hardcore even if you only do them casually. People have this weird idea of what is casual,Midcore, and hardcore content in this game. Some people consider only the MSQ casual while others include exploratory zones into the casual group.

[Llynethil]

Again, I would like to ask for clarification, also what do we mean by midcore content in the first place? Because I consider extremes to be midcord content, savage and ultimates are hardcore even if you only do them casually. People have this weird idea of what is casual,Midcore, and hardcore content in this game. Some people consider only the MSQ casual while others include exploratory zones into the casual group.

Best example would be Bozja before everyone had the hp/dmg/healing buffs stacked up, but ofcourse it doesn't have to be a Bozja.

Extremes don't have nearly the longevity of Bozja or something similar to it, and DR and castrum had that perfect in between difficulty of not being casual, but not savage tier, you can't go brain off in them, but you don't need to be super dedicated to clear it neither.

The best thing they could have done for this in ew would have been criterion, they could have easily added a difficulty there that matches that, and match rewards to it, but instead we got .... well does anyone even play criterion?

[Rychu]

Best example would be Bozja before everyone had the hp/dmg/healing buffs stacked up, but ofcourse it doesn't have to be a Bozja.

Extremes don't have nearly the longevity of Bozja or something similar to it, and DR and castrum had that perfect in between difficulty of not being casual, but not savage tier, you can't go brain off in them, but you don't need to be super dedicated to clear it neither.

The best thing they could have done for this in ew would have been criterion, they could have easily added a difficulty there that matches that, and match rewards to it, but instead we got .... well does anyone even play criterion?

Fair fair. I think that the game really suffers when we don't have a zone like bozja and eureka. Yeah sure some of the Eureka zones kind of sucked on launch but it was their first attempt and by the end it was really good. Bozja and Zadnor were better zones for doing content, but the war-like battlefield made for a visually boring area to explore which probably hindered a lot of people's enjoyment. Honest if Dawntrail has a zone like Bozja/Zadnor with a more interesting visual design scheme like Eureka had, I think we got ourselves a winner.