The Enormous Gap Between Casual and Hardcore Content

[CrazyDude]

Let's talk about one of the biggest problems this game has right now - a ridiculously lopsided distribution of content. Content in MMOs like this is usually built like a Pyramid: each higher level of difficulty gets less and less content because there are less and less players that are capable of completing it. Generally you want casual players to be able to complete most of the content in the game, while leaving a very small amount for the most dedicated players to challenge themselves with (like ultimate raids in this game).


To illustrate this problem, we should first establish some basic categories:

• Casual: content that can be easily cleared by anyone with very few (if any) wipes
• Midcore: content that can be easily cleared by random first time PuGs within one Duty Timer
• Hardcore: content that usually takes a static group
• Elite: content that is extremely brutal and only for the most dedicated of players. Expect wipes to number in the hundreds.

You might disagree with the above criteria, but it should give us some general guidelines to follow.



Now let's take a look at the distribution of the main content in Endwalker up through 6.4:


EW Casual content:

• FATEs
• Tower of Zot
• Tower of Babil
• The Dark Inside
• Vanispati
• Ktsis Hyperboreia
• The Aitiascope
• The Mothercrystal
• The Dead Ends
• The Final Day
• Smileton
• The Stigma Dreamscape
• Hunts
• Overworld Treasure Hunts
• Gold Saucer
• P1N
• P2N
• P3N
• P4N
• Alzadaal's Legacy
• Aglaia
• Arkasodara Quests
• Custom Deliveries: Ameliance
• The Excitatron 6000
• Manderville Weapons
• Relic Tools
• The Fell Court of Troia
• Storm's Crown
• Island Sanctuary
• P5N
• P6N
• P7N
• P8N
• Omicron Quests
• The Sil'dihn Subterrane
• Lapis Manalis
• Mount Ordeals
• Euphrosyne
• The Shifting Gymnasion Agonon
• Loporrit Quests
• Custom Deliveries: Anden
• Eureka Orthos
• The Aetherfont
• The Voidcast Dais
• P9N
• P10N
• P11N
• P12N
• New Ocean Fishing Route
• Mount Rokkon

EW Midcore content:

• EX1
• EX2
• EX3
• Only the latest Unreal Trial
• EX4
• EX5
• EX6

EW Hardcore content:

• P1S
• P2S
• P3S
• P4S
• P5S
• P6S
• P7S
• P8S
• Another Sil'dihn Subterrane
• P9S
• P10S
• P11S
• P12S
• Another Mount Rokkon

EW Elite content:

• Dragonsong's Reprise (Ultimate)
• Another Sil'dihn Subterrane (Savage)
• The Omega Protocol (Ultimate)
• Another Mount Rokkon (Savage)

See the problem? There is significantly more hardcore content than midcore content in Endwalker, when it should be the opposite. This not only affects players looking to transition from casual content to harder stuff, but also players that want a challenge without carving out time for a static.

[CrazyDude]

There's also an argument to be made that Endwalker's extreme trials are a little too hard for midcore. Take EX5 for example. That one is commonly considered an "easy" extreme. But do you really expect players taking their first steps into non-casual content to be able to handle the Flamespire Brand/Sweeping Immolation sequence? My experience with EX's this expansion have been that after the initial wave of Savage raiders have left the scene, they become very hard to clear in random PuGs.


Am I alone in believing these things a problem?

[WhiteFlow]

I know it sound stupid, but where is pvp?

[Nizzi]

Why do people insist on being so coddled and handheld each step of the way to Savage or Ultimate? Yeah, there's a difficulty spike going from Normal content to Extreme, but the point is that it's content that takes a bit and requires effort, hence why it's not designed to be facerolled within a lockout; otherwise we'd have even more of the "lol cleared the content in an hr, was this sh*t patch supposed to last me 4 months? terrible game SE" comments. I don't see an issue with the level of difficulty especially in this expansions Extremes, high-end content shouldn't be designed around people who don't want to put in effort to learn or grow. You shouldn't expect to easily clear things blind within one lockout that aren't normal mode.

[Jeeqbit]

There's also an argument to be made that Endwalker's extreme trials are a little too hard for midcore.

I don't think they are too hard for midcore. But anxiety is a very common thing and a lot of people avoid extreme trials just because of that. But it also seems that more people do them than the higher up content.

One argument for something such as Bozja and all its raids and CEs is that because of the sheer amount of people there, you don't have to worry about anxiety or dying as much and you are not one of only two tanks or two healers there, so if you die it doesn't really matter. But it is punishing enough that you actually die if you make mistakes, so you feel a sense of accomplishment if you survive the entire fight.

That's why for midcore content, it seems to work well for there to just be a lot of people like an alliance raid where mechanics actually kill you, but for it to be easy to queue and not make 1 person's actions wipe the whole alliance too much.

I did like the idea introduced in CLL where most of the party get a fight where they can die as much as they want, but a more experienced team of 8 have the responsibility of succeeding or it's a wipe.

[AurisNix]

That only if you consider EX midcore, Im 100% sure that a lot of casual players wouldn't consider EX midcore, being a casual myself in shb I was terrified of EX at the end I was able to try it thanks to the confidence I gained in Bozja and Zadnor, funny enough the Red Chocobo Fate was harder than some of the EX mechanics I faced, eventually I became a Savage raider thanks to that, so yes EX is midcore but people doesn't know or wouldn't try. Alliance and Variant, should have a spike of difficulty similar to bozja/zadnor and eureka in order to encourage ppl to try "harder" content like EX.

Bozja had a good thing that it didn't matter if you died or wiped you could still try again and again without griefing anyone, in EX or Savage if you do that you will eventually get people tired. Instance areas were the perfect neutral ground for anyone, casual that could challenge themselves and become better or hardcore raiders that had something else to do that wasn't boring enough like the dungeons in the game.

[Jeeqbit]

That only if you consider EX midcore, Im 100% sure that a lot of casual players wouldn't consider EX midcore, being a casual myself in shb I was terrified of EX at the end I was able to try it thanks to the confidence I gained in Bozja and Zadnor, funny enough the Red Chocobo Fate was harder than some of the EX mechanics I faced, eventually I became a Savage raider thanks to that, so yes EX is midcore but people doesn't know or wouldn't try. Alliance and Variant, should have a spike of difficulty similar to bozja/zadnor and eureka in order to encourage ppl to try "harder" content like EX.

See this poster immediately proved my point.

[Poporito_Popoto]

I know it sound stupid, but where is pvp?

I'll do you one better...why is pvp?

[Payadopa]

I'm not sure if I'd count Ex as midcore.

[Katish]

I don't think they are too hard for midcore. But anxiety is a very common thing and a lot of people avoid extreme trials just because of that. But it also seems that more people do them than the higher up content.

One argument for something such as Bozja and all its raids and CEs is that because of the sheer amount of people there, you don't have to worry about anxiety or dying as much and you are not one of only two tanks or two healers there, so if you die it doesn't really matter. But it is punishing enough that you actually die if you make mistakes, so you feel a sense of accomplishment if you survive the entire fight.

That's why for midcore content, it seems to work well for there to just be a lot of people like an alliance raid where mechanics actually kill you, but for it to be easy to queue and not make 1 person's actions wipe the whole alliance too much.

I did like the idea introduced in CLL where most of the party get a fight where they can die as much as they want, but a more experienced team of 8 have the responsibility of succeeding or it's a wipe.

I'd argue if there are bodychecks that are extremely hard to recover from, then that content is more hardcore (savage-like).
I would put Golbez in here for his meteor mechanic, but not the rest (have not tried to the new one). I'd say that most extremes are midcore though if and when they are recoverable, albeit, less optimized. When they aren't, then it's more hardcore just because there's a bodycheck which expect you execute the mechanic precise. Bodychecks are savages ways of creating that artificial difficulty. So that would make Golbez a savage lite (a savage with a few less steps).