REALLY random idea: A deep dungeon, but all Jobs have their PvP kits.

[Renathras]

Discuss.

That's the thread.

Deep Dungeons try to "do things different", but after three iterations, it's pretty much HoH with different Summon stones, one or two different statuses, and a different Frog trap. And I don't mean that to disparage it - I enjoy Deep Dungeons a lot - but I think it's become a smidge stale.

(some) people like the PvP kits and wish the PvE ones were more like it. So why not give that a PvE test run? And DDs are a somewhat enclosed "laboratory conditions/test environment" that can have some slightly unusual mechanics.

I know Criterion does that a bit, but it's more a less-open Eureka/Bozja/Exploration Zone content in dungeon form.

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I'm not saying this is a good idea, it was just a straight up spur of the moment thought when I was reading some people discussing PvP vs PvE abilities in another thread. But the more I think about it, the more I think it might be cool for something like 7.2/3's Deep Dungeon (if we get one). It would certainly keep it different than other things, and I would LOVE to slap those obnoxious Mimics with some Afflatus Purgation, personally...

[Reap00]

I like the idea. I am a big fan of the deep dungeons but I am getting a bit burned out on the formula. The pvp changes this expansion were good and I enjoy the speed and flow of them. I am not sure it would work in deep dungeon but I wouldn't be against giving it a go.

What if it was PvP during deep dungeon? HAHA that could be interesting. They would have to turn chat off though. People would be fumin.

[Fyrebrand]

Interesting idea. I barely play PvP and I'm only really familiar with the White Mage and Dancer kits, but having access to Purify for any status would be nice. Although, PvP kits seem to have more focus on crowd control skills, and I would imagine they would make bosses immune to a lot of that. Could be a conflict there.

It would also give PvE players a way to practice and get used to the PvP kit in a non-competitive environment, maybe then encourange more people to play PvP once they're comfortable with it.

[NekoMataMata]

Don't really see this as a good idea.

Every job would have way less of a kit to play with, and on that small of a scale it would get boring really fast. Yes, pvp bars do group up 1-2-3 combos into one button(which is nice QoL), but even without that the difference between pvp and non-pvp bars would be huge.

You'd also have to make changes to those kits to make them function in a non-pvp environment most likely.

[Absimiliard]

You know, I actually would be pretty interested to see this scenario play out. I can't speak as to whether or not people would particularly take to it, but I for one do like how abilities are handled in PvP. Only downside is that some jobs are a wee bit sparse in that area, so they may have to incorporate a handful of new abilities to make it fly.

[ForsakenRoe]

I would not mind seeing a PVP only DD, and I also wouldn't mind seeing a BLU only DD, as I think the DD formula got stale as soon as the second one (HOH) came out. It's so copypaste I have no idea how people get excited for a new one. The only issue with a PVP DD would be the job kits are so condensed into a few key abilities, that certain jobs would just become far and away 'the best' for solo runs. I know that eg WAR MCH RDM are 'better' than other jobs in POTD solos, for example, but I mean like... Compare how bursty (a critical factor in choosing your POTD soloing class) a NIN or MNK can be, compared to something like a SCH.

If anything, since Blizz 'borrowed' the idea of Deep Dungeons to do Torghast in SL, I would like to see SE 'borrow' Torghast to make a new Deep Dungeon. That is, your Aetherpool weapon level does not increase for this one, instead silver chests give you passive buffs that have wacky effects on your class. From 'you take 10% less damage from Physical attacks' to 'Your Blasting Zone has a 5s shorter CD' to 'Your Phlegma now applies Phlegmatic to the enemy, causing them to take damage based on how far they move', jst go completely wacky with the effects because balance does not matter in there, it's side content. Then, instead of enemies only getting stronger because more HP (kinda bland), have each 10 floors completed also assign a debuff you have to work around. 'You take 3% of your max HP in damage for each 5 yalms you move', 'Enemies now explode on death, causing both you and nearby enemies to take 20% of your respective max HP as damage', 'Enemies now enrage at low health, doubling their autoattack rate but reducing their accuracy' etc. And then because of these effects, you could have a chance for the 'upgrade chest' to instead offer you 'you don't get an upgrade this time, but can instead remove one debuff', so you can choose to either overpower the debuffs with your own buffs, or remove the really horrible ones if they're too hard to work around. Make it a real 'roguelite' instead of using Pomanders for the 4th time

The reason Torghast was a failure was not because it sucked. Far from it, it was actually really fun. The reason it failed was because Blizzard made it mandatory, by attaching the resource to make your legendary to it, and making it give half the weekly cap per run, forcing two runs a week. Left as an optional standalone thing, or better yet, allowing people to enter it at lower levels (so it could be used for alt levelling) would have seen it be much more favorably received

[Zairava]

If anything, since Blizz 'borrowed' the idea of Deep Dungeons to do Torghst in SL, I would like to see SE 'borrow' Torghast to make a new Deep Dungeon. That is, your Aetherpool weapon level does not increase for this one, instead silver chests give you passive buffs that have wacky effects on your class. From 'you take 10% less damage from Physical attacks' to 'Your Blasting Zone has a 5s shorter CD' to 'Your Phlegma now applies Phlegmatic to the enemy, causing them to take damage based on how far they move', jst go completely wacky with the effects because balance does not matter in there, it's side content. Then, instead of enemies only getting stronger because more HP (kinda bland), have each 10 floors completed also assign a debuff you have to work around. 'You take 3% of your max HP in damage for each 5 yalms you move', 'Enemies now explode on death, causing both you and nearby enemies to take 20% of your respective max HP as damage', 'Enemies now enrage at low health, doubling their autoattack rate but reducing their accuracy' etc. And then because of these effects, you could have a chance for the 'upgrade chest' to instead offer you 'you don't get an upgrade this time, but can instead remove one debuff', so you can choose to either overpower the debuffs with your own buffs, or remove the really horrible ones if they're too hard to work around. Make it a real 'roguelite' instead of using Pomanders for the 4th time

The reason Torghast was a failure was not because it sucked. Far from it, it was actually really fun. The reason it failed was because Blizzard made it mandatory, by attaching the resource to make your legendary to it, and making it give half the weekly cap per run, forcing two runs a week. Left as an optional standalone thing, or better yet, allowing people to enter it at lower levels (so it could be used for alt levelling) would have seen it be much more favorably received

Agreed, I would like to see them take the torghast approach. It was very fun to do, but it being mandatory killed it for me.

[TheGrimace]

Sounds interesting and maybe worth exploring. A Dynasty Warriors mode could be neat.

[Stormpeaks]

Actual Renathras W, never thought it'd happen that I'd agree with you ever not gonna lie, but for once I approve

Count me in

[Sebazy]

It'd be a neat experiment for sure and I'd love to see SE try it.