Let's talk about the upcoming DRG rework...

[Valence]

Lancer/dragoon was my starting when I first started playing and while I dont play it often I do like how the job flows currently. So Im kinda mixed on how to feel, like Im scared they'll do what they did to MCH, but Yoshi and the Devs have stated that they think they pushed the "ease of the game" to far, so hopefully they dont nerf it to much.

Nothing indicates they were referring to job gameplay in any way, shape or form. They specifically mentioned encounters when talking about it, and making comparisons to platformers.

[WiccaP]

Nothing indicates they were referring to job gameplay in any way, shape or form. They specifically mentioned encounters when talking about it, and making comparisons to platformers.

The majority of forum posts about potential changes and reworks are based on conjectures we make based on statements made by Yoshi P and the Dev team. So almost every forum about it, is us guessing and interpreting what was said. He referenced side scrollers as an example about lack of stress and how reducing stress can lead to a reduction in fun as well.

Being an MMO and specifically mentioning encounters would logically suggest that part of that stress would have come from encounter mechanics and part would come from job gameplay. Job gameplay and a jobs kit directly correlate to how difficult a game would feel. Given they are starting reworks on jobs while saying they have made the game too stress free would suggest, without directly saying it, that job gameplay could be involved in some form or function of making the game feel more intense.

A majority of the times in the past when a job has had a rework, one of the main stated reasons why has been how complicated a job is and to make it easier for the majority of players. And given the comments made by the community on over simplification of jobs over the past couple expansions, it would not be a big leap that job reworks could play into making the game feel more stressful. So yes there is things that could indicate they were also referring to job gameplay.

"Yoshida (reflecting on the fan festival): So from now on, we’ll keep working to surprise players and go beyond what they imagine. But that reminds me of something I regret… as we’ve continued to operate FF14, we’ve made the game more comfortable, a game you can play without stress. But looking back on the last 10 years, I’m thinking we’ve overdone that a bit.

Shimoda: What do you mean?

Yoshida: A video game should ofcourse have an element of stress, but how to handle that properly, is extremely difficult…

Shimoda: I can agree with that.

Yoshida: For example, in a side scrolling game, if there aren’t any holes you can drop down into if you miss a jump, ofcourse the game would lose its stress, but it would also lose its fun.

Yoshida: Speaking of FF14, I would like to restore that part a little bit. If we do that, we can give everyone a better challenge, in a good way, than ever before.

[Zairava]

The majority of forum posts about potential changes and reworks are based on conjectures we make based on statements made by Yoshi P and the Dev team. So almost every forum about it, is us guessing and interpreting what was said. He referenced side scrollers as an example about lack of stress and how reducing stress can lead to a reduction in fun as well.

Being an MMO and specifically mentioning encounters would logically suggest that part of that stress would have come from encounter mechanics and part would come from job gameplay. Job gameplay and a jobs kit directly correlate to how difficult a game would feel. Given they are starting reworks on jobs while saying they have made the game too stress free would suggest, without directly saying it, that job gameplay could be involved in some form or function of making the game feel more intense.

A majority of the times in the past when a job has had a rework, one of the main stated reasons why has been how complicated a job is and to make it easier for the majority of players. And given the comments made by the community on over simplification of jobs over the past couple expansions, it would not be a big leap that job reworks could play into making the game feel more stressful. So yes there is things that could indicate they were also referring to job gameplay.

"Yoshida (reflecting on the fan festival): So from now on, we’ll keep working to surprise players and go beyond what they imagine. But that reminds me of something I regret… as we’ve continued to operate FF14, we’ve made the game more comfortable, a game you can play without stress. But looking back on the last 10 years, I’m thinking we’ve overdone that a bit.

Shimoda: What do you mean?

Yoshida: A video game should ofcourse have an element of stress, but how to handle that properly, is extremely difficult…

Shimoda: I can agree with that.

Yoshida: For example, in a side scrolling game, if there aren’t any holes you can drop down into if you miss a jump, ofcourse the game would lose its stress, but it would also lose its fun.

Yoshida: Speaking of FF14, I would like to restore that part a little bit. If we do that, we can give everyone a better challenge, in a good way, than ever before.

Sure, but he explicitly said at PAX that they didn't want to "upset" the direction of jobs, and were mostly going to add to them.

I want to believe that what he said in that interview applies to jobs as much as the next guy, but I'll believe it when I see it

[WiccaP]

Sure, but he explicitly said at PAX that they didn't want to "upset" the direction of jobs, and were mostly going to add to them.

I want to believe that what he said in that interview applies to jobs as much as the next guy, but I'll believe it when I see it

Same, I had originally said that I was both nervous and hopeful about the rework and took what was said about the ease of the game as a plausible point when thinking about reworks. I was responding to the person who decided that that was flat wrong and I just wanted to explain how the ease of the game can also apply to job gameplay and how we are all making assumptions based on how we interpret information.

The direction of the jobs is also a very broad idea and adding things to them are inherently going to change them.

[Aco505]

They explicitly said they won't change jobs too much for DT and would just keep on building over what already exists. Yoshi-P's comments were more in the line of making encounters more surprising, avoiding repeating the same mechanics, and taking a second look at boss hitbox sizes.

However, it is likely that they'll be bolder when it comes to jobs for 8.0. How bold though... we'll see.

[RyuuZero]

imo there is a reason the devs post-poned the DRG/AST reworks after SAM in 6.1 .. so best would be cautious and worried

[Equitable_Remedy]

Sure, but he explicitly said at PAX that they didn't want to "upset" the direction of jobs, and were mostly going to add to them.

I want to believe that what he said in that interview applies to jobs as much as the next guy, but I'll believe it when I see it

I would argue that it is literally impossible to avoid upsetting people on social media, so if that's the standard, it will not be met.

This thread is a great example. To summarize: half the posts are about the job being terrible and the other half are pre-raging about any possible change to the job. No way to satisfy this.

[ThorneDynasty]

Who is saying the job is terrible? And it's perfectly valid to criticize the motivations to rework DRG when SE has stated what they are, as well as their current design philosophies that are pretty well evident from their most recent reworks on other jobs.

I loathe this endless "wait and see, you can't criticize until you try it" mentality. The goalpost keeps being moved forward endlessly and we've seen how well posthumous feedback works with jobs like SAM.

EDIT: Like if it turns out the DRG rework is actually great that's just a point in favor of "pre-raging", since it started as soon as it was announced, rightly so after what we saw happen with other reworks. Pre-raging and demanding SE actually thinks long and hard if a rework is well thought out before releasing it seems to work.

[Equitable_Remedy]

I'll make a very, very bold prediction: people on social media (this forum included) won't like the changes.

[ThorneDynasty]

I can make a very bold prediction too: people on social media will defend any changes they make.

What is the point you are making?