What is Midcore? Why does it matter?

[R041]

I think SE is out of touch with what Midcore is and why it matters. (probably even myself)
But I do understand that it can be difficult to pinpoint because we keep trying to find XIV content to put into that category, which is like trying to aggressively punch a square peg into a round hole.

So I want to start a discussion around what this type of content could look like.

I only have around 30 minutes to 10 hours a week with no idea how much of that I can commit at any given moment - I enjoy a good challenge, engaging coop, and love rewards. Midcore players might call themselves Hardcore with limitations.


They're not perfect, but..
These are my rules:

1. Commitment: More involved than casual, but I won't need to strictly set time aside longer than 30 minutes a session. (Can I fit a short CSGO match in?)
   
   
2. Complexity: It's got depth and engagement, but I shouldn't need a guide to understand it. I should be allowed the range to think and act to the best of my ability - With a higher skill floor than Casual, and greater risk with failure.
   
   
3. Accessibility: Easy barrier to entry, don't gatekeep me, let me play on my terms. Don't force me to sit in queue for long, or juggle PF.
   
   
4. Social: Team up with others or friends anytime, calendars not required. Hop-in / Hop-out.
   
   
5. Progression: Steady and diverse rewards that won't make me feel left out. Keep the rewards and progression engaging.
   
   
6. Flexibility: Play it my way - Instructions not included, not enforced.

I think this content does exist, but it's so few and far between that XIV suffers for it as a Subscription game, and especially as an MMO to me - I feel we need players to have somewhere to go that isn't strictly PF or AFK after MSQ.

The content we do have only touches on a few of these at a time - There's almost no piece of content that hit all of them at once. There's not much range within individual pieces, only across different pieces. This type of content is also often subject to retirement. (Why should I do EX now, when I can wait for an easier grind later?)

I would argue that Eureka and Bozja are the closest to fitting all rules, but still fall flat with Accessibility and some Social. Even then, most of the other content isn't MMO oriented, they're small-form Multiplayer or it's just straight up Singleplayer. So Midcore feels very lonely in our MMO.

Maybe Midcore isn't really a thing? But it sure feels like we're missing some Mid-Something, because I have no reason to login and I don't fit in with any EW content. (Playing XI for now)
At a minimum, I think we need to fix or make a new Synced Wondrous Tails.

What are your rules for Mid-Something?

(edited because Complexity and Flexibility didn't make as much sense as I thought)







(SE release housing from it's shackles)

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Your definition of midcore sounds like casual content to me.


Midcore is ex and early savage. Always has been. The only difference is how long it takes to clear for your group.

[Boblawblah]

Why is social a requirement for what makes something 'mid-core'? Or are you simply using mid-core to mean "The type of content I'm looking for"?

Also, imo, a lot of those requirements are subjective. A quick round of unranked League of Legends might be super casual for ranked players, but for those that don't play ranked, it's a fairly intense experience (just see how many people rage over unranked games).

[R041]

Your definition of midcore sounds like casual content to me.


Midcore is ex and early savage. Always has been. The only difference is how long it takes to clear for your group.

I think you're using XIV terms to determine what Midcore means, when I'm presenting it as a form of genre content.

It could be Casual, and that's the frustrating part - Because then we have to admit that XIV lacks engaging Casual gameplay. But we know Casual is also a spectrum of wants, so I'm presenting it as a more engaging tier within Casual.

Why is social a requirement for what makes something 'mid-core'? Or are you simply using mid-core to mean "The type of content I'm looking for"?

Also, imo, a lot of those requirements are subjective. A quick round of unranked League of Legends might be super casual for ranked players, but for those that don't play ranked, it's a fairly intense experience (just see how many people rage over unranked games).

They are subjective, that's why I said they were my rules. I'd say a quick match of Ranked anything is a form of Midcore content, as long as you're not too serious about that rank. You might have a goal to hit, but it's not like anyone is relying on you to get somewhere.

Also yeah, I'm using it as my own form of measurement. I refuse to call myself casual, and know there's a spectrum between the 2. There's no hard bar, which is why I think you can pull some of them and call it Midcore. But it's not about Midcore, it's about Mid-Something. So we either lack Casual Content, or we lack Mid-Something. I also refuse to combine MSQ content with engaging gameplay. So is that less than Casual?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I think you're using XIV terms to determine what Midcore means, when I'm presenting it as a form of genre content.

It could be Casual, and that's the frustrating part - Because then we have to admit that XIV lacks engaging Casual gameplay. But we know Casual is also a spectrum of wants, so I'm presenting it as a more engaging tier within Casual.

That doesn't make any sense. The only differentiation of casual, midcore, and hardcore is time spent.



Casual content is meant to jump in and out of with convenience. Midcore is for those who have more time to dedicate. Hardcore just means you focus all of your time into it.



Hence casual raiding - maybe 2 nights a week for a lockout. Midcore - multiple nights a week for multiple hours. Hardcore - going every night until clears happen.



What you are asking for is harder content for a casual playstyle.

[R041]

What you are asking for is harder content for a casual playstyle.

Yep - I just know we lack what we lack.

You can call it Hard-Casual, doesn't detract from our needs in an MMO with a Subscription that only has hyper-casual, or forced commitment.

I'd also have to argue that if you have a dedicated group to 'Casual Raiding' - You're probably out of touch with these needs.

[Tint]

Midcore content cannot exist.

Either you have easy content which does not require communication.

Or the content is hard enough that you have to talk with your team about the tactic.

And you will not convince people to step up to content which requires communication.

[SophiaDL]

Midcore content is casual content

change my mind.

[LittleImp]

I almost think we should just ditch the terminology altogether; There's enough discourse on these forums to demonstrate that casual/midcore/hardcore are not only subjective, but also regularly change definitions respective to the scope of what is being discussed.

For example, all three terms (Casual, midcore, hardcore) can be invoked to describe different levels of savage+ raiding groups, and tend to be based on time commitment, skill-level and ambition. Yet, when we're talking about the full scope of the game, the terms are almost always applied instead based on what types of content someone is interested in. This creates a lot of confusion, willful and otherwise, wherein people aren't operating with shared definitions of the terms they're mutually using.

I've started to just say things like "We need more content like X" or "Content like X but with the difficulty of Y" because the subjectivity around 'midcore' is too confusing in many cases.

[Snorky]

I think SE is out of touch with what Midcore is and why it matters. (probably even myself)
Snipped for length

I would argue that Eureka and Bozja are the closest to fitting all rules, but still fall flat with Accessibility and some Social. Even then, most of the other content isn't MMO oriented, they're small-form Multiplayer or it's just straight up Singleplayer. So Midcore feels very lonely in our MMO.

Maybe Midcore isn't really a thing? But it sure feels like we're missing some Mid-Something, because I have no reason to login and I don't fit in with any EW content. (Playing XI for now)
At a minimum, I think we need to fix or make a new Synced Wondrous Tails.

What are your rules for Mid-Something?




(SE release housing from it's shackles)

I agree with all of your post for my part. The only trouble is unless people can agree on what actually constitutes Casual/Mid/Hard there can be no real consensus for what is needed. I think we would first have to use the definitions that SE uses as a basis for meaningful suggestions. While I like seeing others suggestions for midcore content, its all subjective. I think Bozja is a good example of mid content but some others might not see it that way. I raided causally in ESO. Once a week or every two weeks depending on schedules. To me that was pretty casual, we used discord and when we were done we all logged out. I defined as casual raiding or casual content. So unless there is a general understanding of exactly what mid content is people will go round in circles, just my observations. Oh and I am sorry I can not watch Zephla sorry fans of hers no disrespect but after seeing the hot tub video nope no way not gonna watch her again. Sorry.