What is the warrior job fantasy?

[GoatOfWar]

What are supposed to be Warrior's defining characteristics?
I see a lot of ''homogenisation bad'' talking points when it comes to tanks, so let's start with the developer's favourite tank; Warrior.

What are supposed to be Warrior's strengths and weaknesses? What sort of fights is it supposed to thrive in, and where should it fall short?

[Zairava]

What are supposed to be Warrior's defining characteristics?
I see a lot of ''homogenisation bad'' talking points when it comes to tanks, so let's start with the developer's favourite tank; Warrior.

What are supposed to be Warrior's strengths and weaknesses? What sort of fights is it supposed to thrive in, and where should it fall short?

According to devs, it seems it's supposed to thrive in every category because reasons.

Honestly, I'm okay with it being the easiest tank in the job to play, it gives it that unga-bunga feel that Warriors traditionally have. The falling short should be having the lowest dps of the tanks next to PLD, of course not to the point it isn't taken into high-end, but the lowest.

Obligatory nerf the hell out of Shake it Off, there shouldn't be any tank that heals the party this much. The eHP from the shield alone is sufficient.

I think, currently, the split between magic and physical damage negation is key if we want weaknesses and strong points.

DRK and GNB could provide magic defense, WAR and PLD could provide physical defense, for example. (Though...really it makes more sense for PLD to provide magical defense). Ideally this would only apply to party utility since issues would be ran into if, say, Vengeance only reduced physical damage.

[VerdeLuck]

According to devs, it seems it's supposed to thrive in every category because reasons.

Honestly, I'm okay with it being the easiest tank in the job to play, it gives it that unga-bunga feel that Warriors traditionally have. The falling short should be having the lowest dps of the tanks next to PLD, of course not to the point it isn't taken into high-end, but the lowest.

Obligatory nerf the hell out of Shake it Off, there shouldn't be any tank that heals the party this much. The eHP from the shield alone is sufficient.

I think, currently, the split between magic and physical damage negation is key if we want weaknesses and strong points.

DRK and GNB could provide magic defense, WAR and PLD could provide physical defense, for example. (Though...really it makes more sense for PLD to provide magical defense). Ideally this would only apply to party utility since issues would be ran into if, say, Vengeance only reduced physical damage.

oh god no please do not break up tanks into magic and physical tanks again, it would be DRK/GNB only in EX and above because those bosses do 90% magic attacks on raidwides and TBs

[Zairava]

oh god no please do not break up tanks into magic and physical tanks again, it would be DRK/GNB only in EX and above because those bosses do 90% magic attacks on raidwides and TBs

If there was a balance struck between physical and magical it wouldn't be an issue. Don't blame the abilities themselves when the devs are the ones making most of the endgame magic damage. Now that we can actually see what's magic and physical it would be easier to tell which is which as well.

[VerdeLuck]

If there was a balance struck between physical and magical it wouldn't be an issue. Don't blame the abilities themselves when the devs are the ones making most of the endgame magic damage. Now that we can actually see what's magic and physical it would be easier to tell which is which as well.

And then what happens when a troublesome tank mechanic is discovered to be Physical damage, so you need WAR/PLD as your tanks to deal with it, but it's mid-prog and you don't have them geared?
It creates a situation where there is potentially a wrong answer in composition for fights that you only find out after you've already locked into starting progging.
Either that or it would force every tank to farm/buy 2x weapons and use a standard BiS for their tank gear on the off chance they have to swap mid prog

[Zairava]

And then what happens when a troublesome tank mechanic is discovered to be Physical damage, so you need WAR/PLD as your tanks to deal with it, but it's mid-prog and you don't have them geared?
It creates a situation where there is potentially a wrong answer in composition for fights that you only find out after you've already locked into starting progging.

What would gear have to do with the physical/magic party mitigation split I mentioned? Did you miss when I mentioned that it would exclusively be party mit and not cooldowns like Vengeance?

DRK and GNB could provide magic defense, WAR and PLD could provide physical defense, for example. (Though...really it makes more sense for PLD to provide magical defense). Ideally this would only apply to party utility since issues would be ran into if, say, Vengeance only reduced physical damage.

[TaleraRistain]

oh god no please do not break up tanks into magic and physical tanks again, it would be DRK/GNB only in EX and above because those bosses do 90% magic attacks on raidwides and TBs

They could add more things like Harrowing Hell were as a GNB you're sitting there feelsbadman when the only party mit you can offer on the heaviest hitter in the fight is a 10s Reprisal.

[GoatOfWar]

They could add more things like Harrowing Hell were as a GNB you're sitting there feelsbadman when the only party mit you can offer on the heaviest hitter in the fight is a 10s Reprisal.

Well, neither Dark missionary nor Heart of light are better at mitigating magic damage than Shake it off is. So they'd need to rebalance that.

[Jeeqbit]

What is the warrior job fantasy?

In terms of fantasy, they are supposed to channel their inner beast (their rage) either into doing attacks (Fell Cleaves) or into defending others. In a real life context, you can think of it as having anger issues and finding positive ways to channel it, such as specific targets or protecting others.

The job certainly achieves that feeling if you get into it. Spamming Fell Cleave and doing as much Fell Cleave is a fun past time for many Warriors and it's still very much about that, except in one of the expansions they made a button that lets you spam Fell Cleaves instead of it all being about wrath stacks / gauge.

What are supposed to be Warrior's defining characteristics?

That they take that damage like an angry beast with abilities like Holm Gang or Thrill, but then heal it right back up. Whereas other tanks would actually mitigate it, such as PLD using Hallowed Ground/Sheltron/Bulwark/Passage plus PLD used to have a 40% mit instead of 30%, or DRK would have TBN for everything to prevent the damage in the first place.

But this kinda changed in Endwalker since now they have have a lot of mitigation and shield on Bloodwhetting (which is half as strong as TBN) and mitigation in general had a cooldown reduction over time (used to be less frequent, especially before 5.1).

What are supposed to be Warrior's strengths and weaknesses? What sort of fights is it supposed to thrive in, and where should it fall short?

Where it would often fall short is in a fight that needs constant heals that PLD can achieve with Clemency, because WAR's heals are limited to their cooldowns unlike Clemency which is unlimited if you can maintain MP. Or where mitigation could work better than heals. But again this has changed with Endwalker and there being more of a variety on Bloodwhetting. Their heal also only used to be this good if they used it on something like Inner Chaos or Fell Cleave, whereas now it's good on anything.

[-Magnai-]

In terms of fantasy, they are supposed to channel their inner beast (their rage) either into doing attacks (Fell Cleaves) or into defending others. In a real life context, you can think of it as having anger issues and finding positive ways to channel it, such as specific targets or protecting others.

The job certainly achieves that feeling if you get into it. Spamming Fell Cleave and doing as much Fell Cleave is a fun past time for many Warriors and it's still very much about that, except in one of the expansions they made a button that lets you spam Fell Cleaves instead of it all being about wrath stacks / gauge.

That they take that damage like an angry beast with abilities like Holm Gang or Thrill, but then heal it right back up. Whereas other tanks would actually mitigate it, such as PLD using Hallowed Ground/Sheltron/Bulwark/Passage plus PLD used to have a 40% mit instead of 30%, or DRK would have TBN for everything to prevent the damage in the first place.

But this kinda changed in Endwalker since now they have have a lot of mitigation and shield on Bloodwhetting (which is half as strong as TBN) and mitigation in general had a cooldown reduction over time (used to be less frequent, especially before 5.1).

Where it would often fall short is in a fight that needs constant heals that PLD can achieve with Clemency, because WAR's heals are limited to their cooldowns unlike Clemency which is unlimited if you can maintain MP. Or where mitigation could work better than heals. But again this has changed with Endwalker and there being more of a variety on Bloodwhetting. Their heal also only used to be this good if they used it on something like Inner Chaos or Fell Cleave, whereas now it's good on anything.

This! All of this~