2 tanks and 4 dps can beat P9?

[LilimoLimomo]

Tonight I was with a random group doing Pandaemonium 9 (the one with the white soul sucker), and with the boss at 33%, both of our healers were killed and many of our team were at critical HP after the AoE that had just hit. None of our DPS had rezzes. I figured it was a wipe.

But over the next 3 minutes, our remaining members didn't just stay alive, we thrived. No matter how much damage we took, our HP got topped off and was kept topped off — presumably by our PLD, WAR, and DNC. What felt like it should have been a wipe was actually an overwhelming success. And I have mixed feelings about that.

Before this, I already felt like Endwalker content had some manner of "imbalance" between incoming damage and the party's ability to shrug it off; but while I've seen lone surviving tanks defeat dungeon bosses numerous times (with their massive health pools and self-sustain), I had never seen anything quite as drastic as this. I'm so accustomed to DPS needing actual healers to survive in content, but apparently in the latest raid content this isn't the case? It really left me feeling like healers literally haven't been given a role to fill in casual Endwalker content.

I'm curious to hear how other folks feel. Was this a coincidental perfect storm, a rare case where healers were unneeded to an atypical extent? Or is this representative of the status quo?

[Supersnow845]

This is just how EW is

PLD with clemency, WAR with nascent, DNC with curing waltz (and I guess SMN with phoenix’s healing) healers just exist to pretend like they are needed and so the DPS can blame someone else if the raid actually does wipe

All healers are useless in casual content, regen healers are useless in all content it’s a literal joke

[Avatre]

This is just how EW is

PLD with clemency, WAR with nascent, DNC with curing waltz (and I guess SMN with phoenix’s healing) healers just exist to pretend like they are needed and so the DPS can blame someone else if the raid actually does wipe

All healers are useless in casual content, regen healers are useless in all content it’s a literal joke

If there was a SMN, the healers would have been picked up off the floor. PLD and WAR(and GNB to an extent) can help keep a party alive for quite a while. Heck, I remember when Copied Factory was new and I was on WAR, my entire alliance was downed during the second boss around the 70% mark, and the people with res were far enough away that they were out of reach for the other alliances. I received one heal from one of the other alliances, and never went down.

[GoatOfWar]

If there was a SMN, the healers would have been picked up off the floor. PLD and WAR(and GNB to an extent) can help keep a party alive for quite a while. Heck, I remember when Copied Factory was new and I was on WAR, my entire alliance was downed during the second boss around the 70% mark, and the people with res were far enough away that they were out of reach for the other alliances. I received one heal from one of the other alliances, and never went down.

Warrior has been powercrept into the stratosphere thanks to crying streamers and their followers eventhough it was perfectly fine before.
Previously, the community understood that with the utility Pld and War have, they should do less damage.
But they kept buffing them over and over again because people played Dark knight over them because of a 2% dps difference.
Sustain buff after sustain buff to warrior in particular, and then damage buffs. Patch after patch, and now here we are. A certain streamer's favourite line ''Warrior's healing doesn't matter'' turned into healers no longer matter. Because Warrior's healing does matter, his ego just couldn't stand being outdamaged by another tank.

If the balance team does not consider this a problem, i can only imagine what 7.0 will look like lol

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Being at "critical HP" means nothing if there's no damage coming up in the next 30-60 seconds. That's an ample time for many non-healer job to heal up through various means, and apparently how plenty of encounters are made.

THIS short 5m vid probably sums up most (about 80%) of what I feel.

[GoatOfWar]

Reason 91312312 why tank sustain (War) needs to go down.

Also, here's p12s without healers.
https://youtu.be/etKYa3K70ek

[Noox-115]

Reason 91312312 why tank sustain (War) needs to go down.

I used to love WAR now I f hate it and they better not make DRK a tank that heal itself too or I quit tanking

[Supersnow845]

I used to love WAR now I f hate it and they better not make DRK a tank that heal itself too or I quit tanking

Granted, all bosses have the enrage timer of second boss of euphrosyne, it’s there but it’s completely useless

[Absimiliard]

Reason 91312312 why tank sustain (War) needs to go down.

Also, here's p12s without healers.
https://youtu.be/etKYa3K70ek

Yeah, let's nerf tanks because bosses aren't doing enough damage. This makes sense. It isn't rocket science. All they have to do is increase endgame enemy damage to the point tank and DPS are incapable of healing themselves enough to keep up with it.

[ASkellington]

Yeah, let's nerf tanks because bosses aren't doing enough damage. This makes sense. It isn't rocket science. All they have to do is increase endgame enemy damage to the point tank and DPS are incapable of healing themselves enough to keep up with it.

I'd pay premium for SE to make an entire raid series where both healers are needed in endgame content, tank and dps healing is still welcomed on top of that, ilvl can't cheese all the healing (it still has some teeth after gear), SGE and SCH can't handle it because its not entirely mitigation based but also healing based with heal checks that aren't just "heal to full to prevent doom", have debuffs you want to clense and not just HoT over, isn't just a Dance Dance Revolution fight - it has tonze more unavoidable raid wide damage, off tank responsibilites, AND they don't nerf it what so ever.

They don't have the spine.

Edit: I'll even add that they keep doing so for all future raid series and don't back track next expansion.