I'm bored when I heal because I need more complex DPS rotations

[Zeastria]

Serious question: for someone who is constantly saying that they need to "make healers healers" implying they aren't already while calling others "dps-healers", do you actually do any endgame "high end" content on healers? Have you proven to yourself that you can handle the healing requirements of content that makes you press GCD heals more?

Let me define what dps-healer is:
It's the type of player you meet in PF/random groups - who dosnt heal or ress -> bc it's a dps loss.

Also the content i want more healing req is in NORMAL content...
Ex,savage,ultimate is different topic all together( why even bring it up?).
You cant balance/build around both w/o one of them suffering for it!
- this game balance around endgame(savage,ultimates), yet majority of player doesn't play said content!

[seolhyun]

I believe currently this is the most pressing issue in the entire game that needs to be addressed above everything else. That is my feedback.

its not just healers, even the dps are boring now. the classes are streamlined to the ground and it makes most battle content in EW boring.

[Nizzi]

Let me define what dps-healer is:
It's the type of player you meet in PF/random groups - who dosnt heal or ress -> bc it's a dps loss.

Okay, so you're complaining about bad players. Majority of the players of this game are bad, which is why the normal content is easier than ever. Where players are concerned about DPS losses is in high end content that has DPS checks, not normal content where it doesn't. Discussions about DPS losses are inherently built around content with enrages, not normal mode content. If a player refuses to heal by not pressing the glut of oGCDs they have, they're very likely just a bad player, which is whatever.

Also the content i want more healing req is in NORMAL content...
Ex,savage,ultimate is different topic all together( why even bring it up?).

You: "There needs to be more healing requirements!"
Me: "Have you done the content where there's more healing requirements?"
You: "Why are you bringing that content up?"

lol

You cant balance/build around both w/o one of them suffering for it!
- this game balance around endgame(savage,ultimates), yet majority of player doesn't play said content!

This first part doesn't make sense at all and the second part is true because content that has enrages are where balance matters, content without it doesn't matter when you queue into it via DF and it randomly pairs you. There's not a chance of your job being locked out for being "unviable" in a random DF group without it being a reportable offense for them kicking you because of the job you queued in on. The current design of healers is built around the low end, the "normal mode" playerbase by the way. The developers have stated several times that it is, that they don't want healers to be focused on DPSing over healing and the gutting of DPS buttons from the healer jobs is so that they can have more of a "heal focused playstyle" (despite high end content being the one where this design doesn't work the most). Numerically the jobs are balanced at the high end, but the role design is absolutely not and is designed for normal mode healers "to not feel pressured to do DPS". I'll say to you what Yoshida said to us, if you're bored with your healing requirements, "go do Ultimate and suffer"

[AmiableApkallu]

It's easy to say 'here's how to fix the problem' but it's a butterfly effect of extra knock-on issues that get raised that also have to be factored in and removed or minimized, and no matter how it gets sliced, I can't see how 'more healing needed' results in an overall smaller devtime cost than 'add more damage buttons'

I think there's a simpler way to look at this whole "more healing needed" thing. The one thing SE cannot modify in any way, shape, or form is time. So, we ask ourselves:

1. What fraction of every minute do you expect a healer to keep the GCD rolling?

2. Of the GCDs that healer is casting, what fraction is required by mechanics, and what fraction is available to help the party recover from mistakes?

Here's one possible scenario, which I'm aiming "casuals" and "normal content": We expect a healer to have a 75% GCD uptime. We expect 2 out of every 3 GCDs to be devoted to healing the encounter's mechanics, leaving 1 out of every 3 GCDs available to help the party recover from mistakes. Do the math, and that's only 30 seconds out of every minute that's spent on "required" healing. If I happen to be an S-tier healer with perfect GCD uptime in an S-tier party that never makes a single mistake, what exactly am I supposed to do for the other 30 seconds every minute?

That's the problem. How do you answer those questions such that normal content is clearable by casuals without also giving the S-tier folk large chunks of time for DPS?

[Zeastria]

Okay, so you're complaining about bad players. Majority of the players of this game are bad, which is why the normal content is easier than ever. Where players are concerned about DPS losses is in high end content that has DPS checks, not normal content where it doesn't. Discussions about DPS losses are inherently built around content with enrages, not normal mode content. If a player refuses to heal by not pressing the glut of oGCDs they have, they're very likely just a bad player, which is whatever.



You: "There needs to be more healing requirements!"
Me: "Have you done the content where there's more healing requirements?"
You: "Why are you bringing that content up?"

lol



This first part doesn't make sense at all and the second part is true because content that has enrages are where balance matters, content without it doesn't matter when you queue into it via DF and it randomly pairs you. There's not a chance of your job being locked out for being "unviable" in a random DF group without it being a reportable offense for them kicking you because of the job you queued in on. The current design of healers is built around the low end, the "normal mode" playerbase by the way. The developers have stated several times that it is, that they don't want healers to be focused on DPSing over healing and the gutting of DPS buttons from the healer jobs is so that they can have more of a "heal focused playstyle" (despite high end content being the one where this design doesn't work the most). Numerically the jobs are balanced at the high end, but the role design is absolutely not and is designed for normal mode healers "to not feel pressured to do DPS". I'll say to you what Yoshida said to us, if you're bored with your healing requirements, "go do Ultimate and suffer"

All i ask is for us healers to have more healing in our gameplay..
Healing requirements shouldn't exist only in hardcore content
with pugs/new/unexperienced players lol..

Why is it so hard to comprehend.. that healers want to heal?
and don't forget the fact that Normal content is a big part of this game..

[TheOperator3712]

All i ask is for us healers to have more healing in our gameplay..
Healing requirements shouldn't exist only in hardcore content
with pugs/new/unexperienced players lol..

Why is it so hard to comprehend.. that healers want to heal?
and don't forget the fact that Normal content is a big part of this game..

There is a healing requirement in normal content. It's just set so low that you are easily able to meet it. It was intentionally designed that way to minimize the amount of times a healer wipes the party due to insufficient healing. If you don't like it, then tough. The devs aren't willing to increase healing requirements in normal content. They have received numerous complaints about it over multiple expansions now, and their response was "go play ultimate". So unless the devs change their vision for the game, it just isn't happening.

[Shurrikhan]

I think there's a simpler way to look at this whole "more healing needed" thing. The one thing SE cannot modify in any way, shape, or form is time. So, we ask ourselves:

1. What fraction of every minute do you expect a healer to keep the GCD rolling?

2. Of the GCDs that healer is casting, what fraction is required by mechanics, and what fraction is available to help the party recover from mistakes?

Here's one possible scenario, which I'm aiming "casuals" and "normal content": We expect a healer to have a 75% GCD uptime. We expect 2 out of every 3 GCDs to be devoted to healing the encounter's mechanics, leaving 1 out of every 3 GCDs available to help the party recover from mistakes. Do the math, and that's only 30 seconds out of every minute that's spent on "required" healing. If I happen to be an S-tier healer with perfect GCD uptime in an S-tier party that never makes a single mistake, what exactly am I supposed to do for the other 30 seconds every minute?

That's the problem. How do you answer those questions such that normal content is clearable by casuals without also giving the S-tier folk large chunks of time for DPS?

This is a wonderfully sensible way to look at this, though I do feel that by lv90 we should be able to expect more than 75% GCD uptime and be okay with less than a whopping 33% over-time error margin, even in casual content. Even this understanding would likely allow us to push required healing to up to two-thirds of GCDs if we wanted to; we needn't baby our healers quite so much.

That said, I do of course agree that we should have more involved downtime activities available to us. That much should happen, imo, even if we spent 80% of GCDs healing in some content.

[ForsakenRoe]

Increased healing requirements does not make healing itself harder!.
it just means you have to press your heal buttons more often ,
rather then pressing your 1,1,1,1 dps button..

Worded differently, that reads as 'healing an EX trial like Rubicante and healing Living Liquid in TEA is the same difficulty, because you just have to press your heal buttons more often', it's such a hilarious oversimplification of what makes healing checks 'hard'

Also, the way I solved healing checks when I did Ultimates was to press 3-3-3-3, my Cure3 button. So... how's that any different?

[Zeastria]

Worded differently, that reads as 'healing an EX trial like Rubicante and healing Living Liquid in TEA is the same difficulty, because you just have to press your heal buttons more often', it's such a hilarious oversimplification of what makes healing checks 'hard'

Also, the way I solved healing checks when I did Ultimates was to press 3-3-3-3, my Cure3 button. So... how's that any different?

The whole point is i want to press heals abilites more often and less dps-buttons.
It's not complicated at all.

[WaxSw]

Based on if they made healing req higher:
They would go OOM, and such healing would be too weak ^^

Imagine going OOM in this day an age, only the ones who rely on GCD healing, not the "dps healers", woudn't be able to heal that because those have never pushed their tools to their maximum efficiency. If anything it would lock the role from the sylphies because they would be forced to finally learn how to use their kit.

DPS and Tanks have expectations to their role..
so why shouldn't healers too? other then just do good dps?

Because dps is king and that dps shows job mastery. Anyone can simply spam healing and get high hps, there is no difficulty or knowledge behind that, but in order to do good dps what most "dps healers" do is use content and job knowledge to know when and where to use their tools in order to be efficient. That is the healer expectation, being efficient and provide the most value to your group, not just being a sylphie, it just happens that there is a sector of healers who refuse to even try to fulfill it.