Originally Posted by
Renathras
Some people are good at healing and managing people's health bars but really not good at doing DPS rotations. So more healing requirements wouldn't phase them while more damage buttons/a damage rotation more complex than the present would.
The "low end of the skill floor" has no trouble pressing Medica over and over again.
Adding an even more annoying version of a thing I already dislike; an upkeep DoT that is boring and has no useful or interesting interaction and would have to completely change the kit to be given one.
It's not good enough because people have a damned love affair with DoTs for some reason; the single kind of damage spell I hate most in all of gaming.
But that the change would require a severe reduction in its APM - to WHM levels
Here we go again
- Also, the 'low end of the skill floor' absolutely has trouble pressing Medica over and over again. Because they press Medica 2 over and over again, overwriting the HOT and using the 'less up-front healing potency' move compared to Medica 1 or Cure 3. Besides that, you know Medica's got an egregious MP cost, right? MP management would come back in full force and I'd expect at least one wipe because of 'oops I ran out of MP'. Of course, I guess the SE brand solution to that is to absolutely drown everyone in Piety on gear
- You're basically no-selling any and all suggestions based entirely on your opinion on certain design elements as if you speak for the whole playerbase. Not everyone is bad with DOTs. I am, but I still put more DOTs on SCH, and I'd still try SCH. How would I ever improve at DOT management if I never try a job that has any? As an aside, I wasn't actually that bad at DOT management in SB, so it could be argued that, for me at least, the 'hands off press once and ignore for 30s' nature of the one DOT we have left, has caused that 'muscle' to atrophy and wither because of how little use it sees
- So it's not actually anything to do with the complexity of the damage rotation, but the kit as a whole? Which means that, I can actually add more to the damage rotation with healer design pitches, I just have to make sure to counterbalance it by making other parts of the kit more simple? EG, WHM can have more damage buttons (just a little), but in return it's healing has to be super simple, potentially even more simple than it currently is? For example, merging Medica 1 into Medica 2, so the average Med2 spammer automatically receives the benefit of Med1's extra potency, or making Cure 1 upgrade into Cure 2 (keeping Cure1's MP cost), so that people don't feel the need to use a lower potency heal to trigger the Freecure trait (instead, spamming Cure2 could give the proc if they really want to keep the damn thing)
Let's run a hypothetical. Imagine a dungeon boss. it autoattacks the tank and it does raidwides. As a demonstration of this 'increased healing required', in your opinion, how often should those raidwides occur, and how much damage should they do? Exact numbers please, no feelycraft 'often enough to require GCD healing', I want an exact number of seconds and damage value (can be rounded to the nearest thousand, eg 10k)
Originally Posted by
ASkellington
I would. Please do go and play AST in Deep Dungeon content solo.
That has been my experience for a good year and so playing this game.
I feel like AST needs more than it has, but also not because it's kit is meant to be based around buffing allies, hence I'd make Minor Arcana a bigger part of the kit. Like, if SE added some kind of second DOT that lasted less than 30s (say 15) I'd be like 'ok, it doesn't exactly solve AST's issues but thanks I guess', so I'd rather they looked at making the cards more a focus of the kit (and by doing so, redistributing the APM out of the burst window and spreading it across the full 2min loop). Not sure if every AST agrees with that take (probably not) but it's the take I'm going with
edit:
Originally Posted by
Aravell
First is the argument that healers will get called out more if the damage kit is expanded upon because it'll slow down the dungeon if they don't use the full kit and people will complain. People don't even speak in dungeons right now, why would people go out of their way to complain about something they'd only know about if they were watching the healer's castbar like a hawk?
Second is the argument that adding damage spells will cause healers to not heal during burst windows. Like, a bad tank is one that doesn't mitigate, right? So a bad healer is one that doesn't heal when needed. So why can't we just call the healers who refuse to heal during their burst a bad healer and move on?
1: Healers don't get called out for 'doing their rotation wrong' or whatever, they get called out when they don't do their damage at all. Nobody would care if you pressed Glare instead of Banish. A few vocal nuisances who feel like piping up about to make a mountain out of a molehill, will make statement if you just stop pressing Glare entirely, in favour of standing still and casting nothing in it's place. You could probably do a dungeon boss with just pressing Dia and its very unlikely anyone will make mention of it, they've got their own gameplay to worry about
2: There's a raidwide+bleed cast in P10S that lines up exactly with a burst window, I can't remember if it's the 4min or 6min (if it's the 6min that's even funnier because that'd be most people's 2nd pot window). Anyone who sees that damage coming in and goes 'I will not be pressing Rapture because this is the burst window' probably has already done the maths on whether they need to in the first place (ie they're good enough at the game to have that gamesense). Anyone who is not up to that skill level is going to just play it safe and use the heal. I play it safe and use the Raptures, sometimes two of them. I don't see how 'casual player' is going to suddenly get parsebrain because they have one or two extra buttons that, when used optimally, gain them potentially tiny amounts of potency. It's not like we see casual players causing wipes left and right because 'oops use all my Flows on Energy Drain so no Indom teehee' is it
As a personal anecdote, nobody gave me flak when I went AST for my weekly P12S reclear and absolutely beefed it on almost everything. Cards played basically on CD instead of pooled for 2min, probably drifted Divination by several GCDs over the duration of the fight, used several GCD heals that were probably not needed if I had managed my OGCDs better. Apologized after we cleared for being so out of practice, zero 'you were bad' and several 'np we cleared its all good'. Doesn't count though cos it's 'anecdotal evidence' /s
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