Next Demi-Primal?

[Mithron]

I completely forgot about Odin... personally I want Ramuh, Leviathan, Shiva, Alexander and Diabolos but yeah Odin's gotta' fit somewhere in there too.

[Zarkovitch]

ALEXANDER BABY. ROBOT TIME GOES BOOM!

[MonsutaMan]

Put some OG summon models in the Market place NOT for $50.....

That X Bahamut is still the best summon model to date.

This thread makes me realize Summoner does not have Shiva & Leviathan...which is crazy and breaks the FF tradition.

I don't think Shin was ever a summon in any game by the player......that would be neat but unlikely.

[ICountFrom0]

I completely forgot about Odin... personally I want Ramuh, Leviathan, Shiva, Alexander and Diabolos but yeah Odin's gotta' fit somewhere in there too.

We were given a reason why Ramuh failed when we tried, but it's been so long ago I've quite completely forgotten.

[Anvaire]

We were given a reason why Ramuh failed when we tried, but it's been so long ago I've quite completely forgotten.

Basically we could only hold or attune to the aetheric signature of three primals - which is why for demis we just channel the aether from the land and by the same token get phoenix (whole of Etheirys doused in bahamut and phoenix mojo juice during the calamity)

[Flana]

Basically we could only hold or attune to the aetheric signature of three primals - which is why for demis we just channel the aether from the land and by the same token get phoenix (whole of Etheirys doused in bahamut and phoenix mojo juice during the calamity)

Trances were the cheat because you don't manifest an extra being and instead channel the primals power through your body. This is why we got Dreadwyrm Trance back in Heavensward. Then SE forgot about that plot point and just let you summon bahamut with a nonsensical 'grand spell' from Prim in Stormblood which is never explained or even hinted at throughout the entire questline and piled phoenix on top in Shadowbringers without any context whatsoever. Man would have been nice to actually get a Summoner job quest in ShB to explain all of this with some context and not a Stormbood sidequest masquerading as a job quest instead.

Like I said before, SE hasn't cared about any of the foundational lore for Summoner in years. They just do whatever and retcon in a reason for it to exist if we even get that. To be more on topic, a new demi summon isn't likely to happen because it would create a 3-minute loop (unless it replaces bahamut or phoenix and SE will never do that), which is antithetical to their current job design. That said justice for Alexander. Giant robots and laser beams, can't go wrong with that.

Edit:
Also the above theory doesn't hold water considering we got demi-phoenix on the first and have absolutely no problem demi-summoning on the first or the thirteenth. The result of a bad retcon that muddies the water just to provide a shallow spectacle.

[vetch]

I mean, if any class should be vapid, SMN is the one that makes sense! In the traditional FF games summoning is generally a one button, high-MP nuke. Nothing particularly big-brain about that! ^^

Traditional summoners also have long cast times in exchange for their field-clearing nukes. This could have translated into an interesting design with a high skill ceiling where you need to know when it's safe to stop and do a long-cast, high-damage spell and when you need to use an accelerator. Instead we got a 'physranged in a robe' job where you can't slide an index card between the skill ceiling and floor.

Joking aside, I personally think the new SMN is genuinely a better designed class. It feels more like a SMN, and it's nice to actually rotate through all your summons rather than only seeing 3 the whole time while doing non-summony busywork like managing DoT's.

You're still doing non-summon busywork because you're spamming magic missiles for most of your GCDs and gapclosing in to pretend you're a melee for some reason.

[Raikai]

Traditional summoners also have long cast times in exchange for their field-clearing nukes. This could have translated into an interesting design with a high skill ceiling where you need to know when it's safe to stop and do a long-cast, high-damage spell and when you need to use an accelerator. Instead we got a 'physranged in a robe' job where you can't slide an index card between the skill ceiling and floor.



You're still doing non-summon busywork because you're spamming magic missiles for most of your GCDs and gapclosing in to pretend you're a melee for some reason.

I never understood why they gave SMN a needless gap closer. Is not like the job turns into a Clive-Ifrit thing with a full melee phase to justify that, so the addition just seems like an arbitrary attempt to increase to the skill cap.

Other than that, I think the primal actions are actually fine (although they could've made Garuda a bit more distinct) - but the actual primal summoning should've been a 1.45 cast time. It even makes sense that in every FF iteration, the summons are usually casted.

I hope that if we indeed get a new set of primals, to alternate with the ones we have, their playstyle are more centered around cast times.

[Supersnow845]

What would adding three new primals after Phoenix actually add to the job, right now the only thing that distinguishes the 3 current primals is capacity for movement (ifrit is immobile, Garuda is half half, titan is totally free motion), let’s say they added 3 new primals and decided to make them less mobile…..okay but ts not like you can control whether you summon Bahamut or Phoenix first so all you end up with is an inflexible half of your rotation that can’t be altered, if they made it more mobile then the current rotation would feel like the inflexible annoying half

Okay so let’s say that they had roughly the same mobility, okay so what’s the difference between titan and “blue titan” in terms of gameplay

SMN isn’t a good “foundation” it’s a complete class that is just terribly designed

[Soge01]

^
Perhaps if the egi could mingle their elements together in order to create an all new effect while simultaneously allowing the SMN to summon another Egi that corresponds with said particular combinations of elements?

Example: Summon Garuda. Causes a tornado that consistently does damage for a certain period time. Then next summon Ifrit. Resets Garuda's tornado while also boosting its damage and transforming it into an inferno twister. Now you've unlocked the ability to summon their Eden fusion that causes massive damage upon its summon, so long as you do so within the remaining time limit Garuda and Ifrit's inferno twister combo lasts.