At this point will FFXIV collapse if all mods and third party tools disappear?

[AwesomeJr44]

No hyperbole or exaggeration here, if that happened and there was no hope of them ever coming back, then it would at least would heavily damage the game's playerbase. People really underestimate how many people use third-party things, especially if we are going to assume that 'third-party' tools encompasses external sites like Teamcraft or Discord. If everything was wiped out in an instant, many people wouldn't have a good reason to play the game long-term anymore, and this game can't survive off of the turbo casuals (the ones who play once every 4 months just for MSQ) alone.

And if you wipe out Discord... whoo boy... so many things in this game would be dead.

[Renathras]

No. All console players play without mods, and probably a good chunk of PC players. I think some of you drastically underestimate how many people just play the game as-is.

especially if we are going to assume that 'third-party' tools encompasses external sites like Teamcraft or Discord.

Discord the chat program? That'd be like saying you can't have your cell phone next to your computer on a speaker conference call or be on Microsoft Teams. There's a pretty big gulf between programs that interact directly with the game and chat programs. The only direct interaction Discord has (with all games, more or less) is showing your voice chat people in the upper left, but that's an overlay that's not part of the game engine, I think...

I think the only one MIGHT be parsers...

EDIT:

Reread the OP. I'm aware that Discord being banned is stupid and never going to happen, but it was included in the hypothetical. Respond to TheNight if you have a problem with his hypothetical scenario.

In that case, I'd say "TheNight" (we all know it's another Titanmen alt) is a moron, but...I suppose known quantities and all that.

[AwesomeJr44]

Discord the chat program? That'd be like saying you can't have your cell phone next to your computer on a speaker conference call or be on Microsoft Teams.

Reread the OP. I'm aware that Discord being banned is stupid and never going to happen, but it was included in the hypothetical. Respond to TheNight if you have a problem with his hypothetical scenario.

In that case, I'd say "TheNight" (we all know it's another Titanmen alt) is a moron, but...I suppose known quantities and all that.

*qualities. Not quantities. I wouldn't bother correcting you if you weren't calling someone else a moron in the same sentence.

EDIT: Apparently there's another use of 'quantities' I wasn't aware of. I'll take an L on this one.

[Minifie]

Reread the OP. I'm aware that Discord being banned is stupid and never going to happen, but it was included in the hypothetical. Respond to TheNight if you have a problem with his hypothetical scenario.



*qualities. Not quantities. I wouldn't bother correcting you if you weren't calling someone else a moron in the same sentence.

No it's quantities, it's a mathematical term. I wouldn't bother correcting you if this wasn't a hilarious irony.

[AwesomeJr44]

No it's quantities, it's a mathematical term. I wouldn't bother correcting you if this wasn't a hilarious irony.

Fair enough, I'm not familiar with that use of quantities. I'll take the L on this one.


Edit 1:

Fair cop, my response does insinuate you being a moron but I don't believe it; the situation was too perfect though. Happy to remove the post though.

No, no. It's fine. I take Ls when I deserve them.


Edit 2:

bro PLEASE you tried to school someone on slidecasting and got owned by 10 different people

you are literally the ONE person here who refuses to open your mind to anything

Like I said, I didn't know that there was another usage for that word, and I was factually incorrect. It happens and I admit when it does. But Renathras is the same guy who has spent a month refusing to admit that he was clearly wrong. It's fair game for him to point out that I'm wrong, and it's fair game to be a little smug about it, but he's being a hypocrite by giving the little speech at the end.

[Renathras]

No it's quantities, it's a mathematical term. I wouldn't bother correcting you if this wasn't a hilarious irony.

It is.

Quantity/quantitative means having a measurable value. For example "That person is 6 feet and 3 inches tall". These are generally going to be objective measurements using a standard measurement tool and system of some kind.

Contrast:

Quality/qualitative, which means not having a measurable (or not presently measured) value. For example "That person seems very tall". These are often subjective and are sometimes things that cannot actually be measured, such as "That person is very white", where the amount of "white" a person can be is not clearly defined and no standard of measurement exists.

But in this specific case, it's also for another reason, that it's an idiom:

https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/known+quantity
"Someone or something whose inherent value, characteristics, or properties are previously established."

I do appreciate the irony mentioned.

.

EDI:

Anyway, it's whatever. I guess it's just a cautionary thing to not be quick to get a dig in on someone when it can be avoided and generally agreement otherwise exists. Something I learned a long time ago: Never correct someone's spelling on the internet. 9 times out of 10, you WILL misspell, typo, or have autocorrect butcher a word and then they will pounce on you for your apparent faux pas. Better to just roll with it or ask "Did you mean...?" in case that it does lead to confusion ("You said to, did you mean two?") that you need clarified. And that we all can learn things from each other from time to time, too. /hug

[TheNight]

No hyperbole or exaggeration here, if that happened and there was no hope of them every coming back, then probably yes, or at least it would heavily damage the game's playerbase. People really underestimate how many people use third-party things, especially if we are going to assume that 'third-party' tools encompasses external sites like Teamcraft or Discord. If everything was wiped out in an instant, many people wouldn't have a good reason to play the game long-term anymore, and this game can't survive off of the turbo casuals (the ones who play once every 4 months just for MSQ) alone.

And if you wipe Discord... whoo boy... so many things in this game would be dead.

It's quite clear then the game itself has next to no staying power. The reason people stay is not because of what the developers created but because of the community's creations. CBU3 is quite literally coasting on the community's effort, and this dark premonition from the previous Square Enix CEO has never been more relevant:

I realize that some people who “play to have fun” and who currently form the majority of players have voiced their reservations toward these new trends, and understandably so. However, I believe that there will be a certain number of people whose motivation is to “play to contribute,” by which I mean to help make the game more exciting. Traditional gaming has offered no explicit incentive to this latter group of people, who were motivated strictly by such inconsistent personal feelings as goodwill and volunteer spirit. This fact is not unrelated to the limitations of existing UGC (user-generated content). UGC has been brought into being solely because of individuals’ desire for self-expression and not because any explicit incentive existed to reward them for their creative efforts. I see this as one reason that there haven’t been as many major game-changing content that were user generated as one would expect.

Yes, they want players who contribute, because much like Skyrim, they are exploiting the free labor of thousands of volunteers to fix the game for them and implement features that the playerbase has asked for a decade. Much like Skyrim, barely anyone would play the game in 2023 if it weren't for the mods.

[Deo14]

From sheer number of mods, FFXIV seems to be 3rd most popular game in the history. 2nd if you ignore LE/SE versions of Skyrim. I have no doubts this will cause some major issues.

Twitter, discords, and all social media where people using all the E/RP mods reside will burst in flames. This will inevitably gain serious media attention. It could further evolve into some psychos doing some very stupid stuff, people did some really stupid stuff for much less. This has further potential to gain traction in mainstream and boomer media.

Raiders wouldn't be happy either, ACT is just needed to find out what you're doing wrong. Game will just generally become more annoying, because people are used to QoL stuff plugins do. No plugins means no universalis, so even crafters will hate this.

It would be fair to assume that if we talk about disappearing, you mean that SE implemented some anti cheat, in that case, botting might become harder, which in turn will make RMT gil more expensive, which will further anger paypiggies (high possibility of overlap with the first group of people).

All in all, game would be in flames, I wouldn't be surprised if some SE frontman went and made an apology.

Will the game survive? Very likely, you cannot kill game big like this, WoW survived what, like 3 bad expansions in a row, while they were in plethora of drama and legal problems at the same time?

But yes, plugin creators definitely deserve more credit. Putting their free time to create better game for us is good cause, especially since many of them do it out of goodwill.

[TheNight]

Just not a fan of making up numbers with no basis on scenarios that aren't currently happening and no way of knowing or really even giving an intelligent guess towards because who knows if the players using mods are solely playing FF14 because of them. It feels like rage baiting because you are bored or something.

Regardless of the numbers it is very clear that Square Enix is exploiting free labor while they rest on their laurels and put minimum effort into developing content for FF14.

[Amenara]

Regardless of the numbers it is very clear that Square Enix is exploiting free labor while they rest on their laurels and put minimum effort into developing content for FF14.

That would be a lot of games. Look at WoW for instance. How many mods in that game are essentially required to even play it and how ingrained the modding mindset is with it. The obvious difference is that Blizz sorta embraces the modding aspect compared to SE. For example it took Blizz about 20 years to update their terrible UI to a slightly less terrible UI after letting modders essentially fix the problem for them for all of those years. You can look at another game like Skyrim and make a similar argument against Bethesda and how they continue to milk it for all it's worth.

I am also not a fan of equating mods to content that SE puts out for FF14 as the two seem to not really relate to one another. It's kind of a weird argument too when SE has seemingly started to implement some of the QoL mods (which was long overdue). I guess you can say they are taking the modders ideas with that, but I don't think there would be a lot of people who would complain about that.