G-give it Back T---T; !!

[RosaliaDLB]

That's a good observation.

In fact? I been falsely accused of doing Kaiten jokes and meme's outside of non-Kaiten related threads that I have not done anywhere near the amount they posted anything in this thread the past few days, unless they can quote me one. Policing the forums is not their Job... and repeatedly saying in different ways how they have no sense of humor... I mean great, I'm happy for them XD? but AwesomeJr definitely shows some hypocrisy.





And there's the quote... 14 days ago... so every 14 days is a spam, officer? I have been behaving myself if that's what your detective work is amounting to? Again hypocricy and your spamming this thread way way more then I have any other thread recently with your accusations of me doing Kaiten meme's in non-Kaiten related threads.

yeah because spamming every thread with "bring back kaiten" "muuuh kaiten oh nyoooo" surely is an hilarious joke

entire crowd is laughing

it was funny yeah, the first 5 times, then nah

[AwesomeJr44]

That's a good observation.

No it's not, I proved Atelier's nonsense wrong in the post right below it. I literally half-agree with you. Our opinions jell together just fine. I just don't like the "but muh Kaiten" stuff. Like I said, if you didn't do that, I could probably could have even been convinced to fight for your cause myself.

I been falsely accused of doing Kaiten jokes and meme's outside of non-Kaiten related threads

I've already posted one example, and that example was just the particularly egregious one that I remembered from recent memory. (I didn't even have to check your post history, I just remembered you doing it and then went back to lackluster to grab the quote)

Policing the forums is not their Job

People are allowed to say that they find something annoying. Just like you're allowed to keep doing the thing that people find annoying. If you want to keep posting Kaiten threads, go ahead. I can't stop you and I won't try. But I have as much of a right to say that I find the spam (particularly the off-topic instances) to be annoying, as you have a right to post Kaiten threads/posts.

but AwesomeJr definitely shows some hypocrisy. Again hypocricy and your spamming this thread way way more then I have any other thread recently with your accusations of me doing Kaiten meme's in non-Kaiten related threads.

Discussing Kaiten and the discussion around Kaiten itself is on-topic for a thread like this, especially when the OP has numerous links to creators discussing Kaiten. We're not spamming as our discussion is on-topic, you just don't like the direction it went.

With that said, put aside our differences on Kaiten for a moment. If you want to see real hypocrisy, just look at Atelier.

Personally I find it more annoying and offensive the numerous drama bait andy threads all by the usual few posters with the purpose of fanning the flames on the forums than the people who just quietly post their usual thing every now and then.

Atelier frequently engages in the behavior they are describing here. They've been fanning a lot of flames. Celesti, I am not going to try and force you to call out Atelier or anything, I hate that forced neutrality junk, but there's an example of hypocrisy for you.

Like I said, I know that I'm not going to win too much agreement as I don't line up with the agreed upon opinion for this thread, but I really do agree with you on more than you seem to think I do.

Edit:

the post below

If you don't want me to use quotes to make my post cleaner and indicate which part of your post I'm responding to, that can be arranged.

So you don't want me digging through your post history, but you also want me to use an example that's not the one I remembered the most clearly from memory alone. So... do you want me to try and dig for one or not? I'd also like to point out that even if you haven't done it in the past 2 weeks (because I'm not checking), that doesn't mean that you haven't generally done it in the past. I don't have a written list of the times and dates of every time you've done it.

A couple of people find the "but muh Kaiten" behavior and Kaiten worship annoying, and they used their right to say as such. I in particular have even expressed agreement with some of your points and expressed sympathy for your position. The only thing that I heavily disagree with you on is that I don't think that Kaiten belongs on the pedestal that it gets put on. It wasn't as good of a button as people seem to remember it as. That is all. Our positions on Kaiten are closer than they are distant. I'll use one quote here to show it.

I know that I still care about XIV's Gameplay to improve, I want my " Kaiten " still that they have not replaced with anything new or better.

I agree 100% with the first part and I think it's really dumb that they didn't give a replacement, I just don't think that clinging onto Kaiten is best for the gameplay if we could possibly get something better. Not really a radically different position from yours.

[CelestiCer]

Like I said, I know that I'm not going to win too much agreement as I don't line up with the agreed upon opinion for this thread, but I really do agree with you on more than you seem to think I do.

Well... with that many quotes? I wonder why I got called obsessed in the first place...

While we agree on some topics or parts of them? It's truly false accusation that people make it seem like I spam " consistently nonstop " all over every non-Samurai threads, cause all you can find as the most recent example is something that happened " 14 days ago ". It apparently doesn't matter for how long I behave. I'll just falsely get accused, even by alts (unironically) like that of stormspeaks of something that was clearly harmless intend of laughter of which even that I clearly stopped doing as of for the record - 14 days ago

Yet even then? I'm somehow comparably vilified to spamming/alts/doom-bait-posts and derailing threads. I'm not about to do detective work on the Forums on who does what... I know that I still care about XIV's Gameplay to improve, I want my " Kaiten " still that they have not replaced with anything new or better. Of which is a on-going trend that is not limited to Samurai either where Square continues to remove features from jobs to replace them with nothing. And I don't believe for a second that I am worth being labeled as obsessed to give attention to Square's decision to continue doing horrible Job changes vs everything else that is clearly multi-account thread lithering behavior on this Forum section by so many other trolls, mhm.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I responded to a thread to agree with an opinion that was given by another person in the thread. That's not spam.



As I've said in the past, I generally don't have an issue with those threads as they generate relevant discussion. I'm not going to condemn a thread on a relevant topic just because you don't like the OP. And as I've also said in the past (in this exact thread in fact), I'd have no issue with the specific criticism of the game that this thread is bringing up if it wasn't a topic that the OP has done to death at this point.

So? Who cares? To be fair a lot of topics and points in these forums have been done to death, especially the criticism ones so why is this one be any different?

[AwesomeJr44]

So? Who cares? To be fair a lot of topics and points in these forums have been done to death, especially the criticism ones so why is this one be any different?

Because those topics typically don't get spammed into completely unrelated threads. Here's an example from the lackluster thread:

The story was engaging... it grasped my attention... well...



Up until they removed my " Kaiten ". After that I kinda can't care? I am trying to care about the story. Genuinely trying? but I just end up skipping everything. -> /at <- if you know you know.

This is but one example of Celesti posting things wildly off-topic. Like I said, I would be willing to sympathize with her cause, maybe even fight for it if I was convinced to, but after enough posts like the one I linked, it just gets annoying. This isn't feedback anymore, this is spam.

It's clear that I'm not going to get much agreement here as it seems that outside of a select few people, the only people still in here are the ones who act fanatical about Kaiten and I've apparently burnt that bridge for not fully agreeing with them. I myself only came in here today because I saw Stormpeaks' alt as the most recent poster and only posted as I partially agreed with her take.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Because those topics typically don't get spammed into completely unrelated threads. Here's an example from the lackluster thread:



This is but one example of Celesti posting things wildly off-topic. Like I said, I would be willing to sympathize with her cause, maybe even fight for it if I was convinced to, but after enough posts like the one I linked, it just gets annoying. This isn't feedback, this is spam.

Yeah I know, I've seen their posts. But they only post it once on a thread and it at least begins with something related to the thread topic (sorta).

Idk it never bothered me because yeah, Kaiten's removal is literal doo doo feces. It just seems something that's harmless and easy to ignore if you don't care for it.

Certainly not something worth being antagonistic to somebody about it

[CelestiCer]

Yeah I know, I've seen their posts. But they only post it once on a thread and it at least begins with something related to the thread topic (sorta).

Idk it never bothered me because yeah, Kaiten's removal is literal doo doo feces. It just seems something that's harmless and easy to ignore if you don't care for it.

Certainly not something worth being antagonistic to somebody about it

They are also quoting this of 14 days ago yet they make it sound like i do it every minute... so their obviously going through my history post which clearly shows... I been not joking anywhere else aside from Kaiten related threads... as of 14 days ago and I can continue not I guess. Like even if I did more jokes? Who made them forum mods to allow me to not crack a joke? while others are allowed to or worse? Do literal thread spams. It's like a double standard... while bumping this thread that they obviously don't agree with. Like are they gonna file an arrest charge on that Kaiten cosplayer to xD this is ridiculous, mhm

[Atelier-Bagur]

They are also quoting this of 14 days ago yet they make it sound like i do it every minute... so their obviously going through my history post which clearly shows... I been not joking anywhere else aside from Kaiten related threads... as of 14 days ago and I can continue not I guess. Like even if I did more jokes? Who made them forum mods to allow me to not crack a joke? while others are allowed to or worse? Do literal thread spams. It's like a double standard... while bumping this thread that they obviously don't agree with. Like are they gonna file an arrest charge on that Kaiten cosplayer to xD this is ridiculous, mhm

Personally I find it more annoying and offensive the numerous drama bait andy threads all by the usual few posters with the purpose of fanning the flames on the forums than the people who just quietly post their usual thing every now and then.

[Renalt]

Hey Cel I think you're a pretty cool person. I wouldn't really concern yourself with what others think though. Even my opinion is really just that.

You're jokes are just a fun little quirk you have and I think you should stick with it and fight the good fight!

If not for me, if not for yourself, do it for Kaiten.

[CelestiCer]

Hey Cel I think you're a pretty cool person. I wouldn't really concern yourself with what others think though. Even my opinion is really just that.

You're jokes are just a fun little quirk you have and I think you should stick with it and fight the good fight!

If not for me, if not for yourself, do it for Kaiten.

Kind words Renalt, thank you

In Raid groups like last night attempting to help them, I still crack Kaiten-meme's to cut the serious tension. I know some can have raiding anxiety, and a light-hearted joke with encouraging words can go along way. Specially when a Tank by accident let me tank a tankbuster and I'll just throw out my macro
- Hey look I am tanking :3 ... Oh crap D: !! I'm Tanking DX !! -

Samurai's already lost a lot. Recently a total of up to 7 simplifications. While some warranted QOL or necessary to adapt to the changing environment, it made the gameplay without question easier. For many? Hissatsu: Kaiten removal went to far. Yet if you search back enough? Other Jobs lost and waited way more then us to regain nothing. I don't play other Jobs, but it's not uncommon to see lost skills being mentioned i.e Aero III / Dark Arts and SMN... everything. Even for BRD I had to recently request a history lesson in the DPS subsection. Got a kind informative response from BRD changes all the way back to Heavensward. Players are not even requesting un-playable difficulty for their Jobs, rather to preserve or improve their Job's gameplay with depth, substance, flavor, skill-expression that can be entirely optional to master or what was lost replaced with something. Our Samurai outrage turned into Action...

• We were told to go to the Forums, so we did
• A total of 160+ Threads now written
• The JP forums made a Mega thread
• Content creators created 12 videos for it

Square gave Radio silence... Other roles mocked us telling us this is your 1st rodeo of being ignored by Square? when we didn't mock no one for giving their feedback. If constructive analysis doesn't work, we started meme-ing it. Then the unexpected Cosplayer with the " Bring back Kaiten " sign, thought it was great! felt like sharing it here instead of the DPS forum and you start to see the lengths we go to preserving our gameplay or wanting it improved out of " passion ".

And Instead? many demand us to be silent like the grave as if the past haven't taught us anything that staying silent doesn't improve our gameplay... As time passes, less start to care to the point of forgetting to care... only until the next hollowing change happening or culling of another Skill or Job feature. Hence I often say that I prefer to draw the line at " somewhere " vs " nowhere ". I disliked many simplifying changes, but for me and many? " Hissatsu: Kaiten removal " was just one change to far, mhm