Yoshi P in a nutshell

[Absimiliard]

now they look at popular QOL plugins and create official versions to get people off them.

By creating poor imitations that in no way actually work to prevent those players from continuing to use their plugins. It just forces the people that make them to spend a bit of time writing a workaround so whatever new thing SE implemented doesn't interfere with its superior plugin predecessor. Players that don't use plugins wind up benefiting, at least.

[TheNight]

The most recent Fan Fest. All the folks who've been asking for two dye channels for glams are psyched about it.

With respect, I'm guessing that maybe it feels to you like Yoshi-P isn't making changes due to feedback because he's not making the change you would care about the most?

So yes, they're making simple systems adjustments. Things that an intern can do. Thank you proving my point.

[LilimoLimomo]

So yes, they're making simple systems adjustments. Things that an intern can do. Thank you proving my point.

With respect, this gives me the impression that you aren't considering all of the work that's actually involved with implementing a second dye channel. Depending on their tech, such a change requires structural changes to their database, code, UI, and texture data at the very least. No team worth their salt is going to let an intern do all of those disparate tasks, as there are impactful ramifications for many of them that are far above an intern's pay grade.

[Koros]

structural changes to their database, code, UI, and texture data

something interns can do, or do you think modifying a struct in C# is some nigh-impossible task? the undergrad interns at Google easily deal with far harder tasks than anything in CBU3.

It's kind of sad that people think game dev coding is hard at all, no it's not, which is why we have specimens like Undertale's developer coding dialogues with

if 3232: print("literal string containing dialogue 3232")
if 3233: print...

for thousands of lines.

Of course, sadly Japan has a brain drain problem where its smartest people emigrate since its economy is in the gutters and it's work culture is a relic from chimp age, so even if they tried they couldn't do better anyways.

[LilimoLimomo]

something interns can do, or do you think modifying a struct in C# is some nigh-impossible task?

Oh, the struct modification is the easy part. What I wouldn't trust an intern to do is appropriately manage how the data in that struct is going to be efficiently stored in the database, nor manage how the existing database data will be ported over to the new structure (I feel like it's very safe to assume that CBU3 is using old-school servers, as opposed to anything in the cloud). And I'd be surprised if that same programming intern had the knowledge of the programs the artists do their texturing in to convert clothing that was initially implemented to only have a single dye channel to having two dye channels. This is a non-trivial undertaking across multiple skillsets.

[Arzalis]

Oh, the struct modification is the easy part. What I wouldn't trust an intern to do is appropriately manage how the data in that struct is going to be efficiently stored in the database, nor manage how the existing database data will be ported over to the new structure (I feel like it's very safe to assume that CBU3 is using old-school servers, as opposed to anything in the cloud). And I'd be surprised if that same programming intern had the knowledge of the programs the artists do their texturing in to convert clothing that was initially implemented to only have a single dye channel to having two dye channels. This is a non-trivial undertaking across multiple skillsets.

While I wouldn't presume to know all the details of their codebase, I can guess the implementation on the texture/material side. I think they already map everything into channels (why we get so many color variations of armor; they aren't making new textures for those). They'll just flag a previously non-dyeable channel with a property that says "this dyes with dye channel 2." They won't need to do any actual new texture work for this.

Why would they need to create a new storage method? They already have one. Migrating data from the old structure to the new one is definitely a concern, but that's more of a devops thing. They're going to be making tons of changes for the expansion anyway no doubt and it'll all be handled at maintenance before launch.

You're making this sound more complicated than it is to try to prove your point, I think. Pretty much all of this is exactly the kind of thing I'd expect to be assigned to an intern or a junior programmer. Minus the actual implementation at launch.

[Velaethia]

Yoshi P isn't perfect but still made a great game.

I massively disagree with his stance on pet classes.

Also wish classes could have build-gameplay diversity outside of a couple having rng.

[MonsutaMan]

She aint Japanese, so this looks about right.

[Absimiliard]

She aint Japanese, so this looks about right.

Don't worry. He's not listening to the Japanese players either.
Nobody wins this one.

[LilimoLimomo]

For me, it's seems questionable that in this expansion they've been actively trying to make this game a single player, instead of focusing on this stuff that people do want. I get that attracting new players is priority, but it would be nice if veterans got a little bit more than just scraps.

But in case of healers, they got told to "just play ultimates". I get that this is hard thing to fix, but they still haven't done anything meaningful to address that. In case of Kaiten, that's relatively easy thing to fix, just revert to the state that people were happy with. I'm not sure if you're familiar with the whole SAM 6.1 clown fiesta, but here's my thread if want it in more detail. Long story short, all reasons they gave us make no sense if you dig just a few centimeters under a surface. They specifically asked for feedback about it, which we did provide, and then they ghosted us. You can check DPS forums, even after 1.5 year, people are still not happy about it. So if they don't care about this, how can you expect them to care about anything else?

Yeah, I get it. From a business standpoint, trying to bring in new blood and appeal to the casual player base (that is less concerned about the ins-and-outs of job balance) is where a significant amount of development effort should be focused, to keep the game profitable and hopefully to expand the game's budget...but hardcore players deserve attention as well. Your frustration is valid.

Did healers really get told to just play Ultimates? If you've got the source for this handy I'd love to see it, as that isn't just a terrible suggestion, but terrible PR as well.

While I'm familiar with how dull healing is right now, I'm less familiar with the Kaiten stuff. Seems really suck that they'd ask for feedback and then not follow-up. It makes me wonder if perhaps they're mainly taking Japanese feedback or something? I can't say, but I'll read the thread you provided, maybe that information is already in there.

So if they don't care about this, how can you expect them to care about anything else?

Two things:

• We know that the developers don't have the bandwidth to implement everyone's feedback; because of this, a great deal of feedback they receive will never be implemented.

• FF14 is a product that the devs want to endure for another 10 years; for the devs to not care about any player issues wouldn't just mean not caring about their players, but not caring about their own livelihood. That seems incredibly unlikely.

Both of those together suggest to me that even if for whatever reason the devs aren't catering to Kaiten feedback, there's no reason to think they won't cater to any feedback.

I know that doesn't help with the Kaiten thing, which sounds like a bummer.