Too strict in-game communication rules

[Koros]

There's that problem especially profound with game forums - "mistake of survivor". People which agree that rules are indeed very strict are few and most won't even bother typing a single letter here, because they quit if they value human (like in human human sense) interection in mmo and games as a whole. And they know they won't change shit (sorry don't report me) nothing without power or masses of social media. Jesus, people start using words like "diplomatic approach" like it's not your fellow gamer you gonna play with, but a sultan of another country. All of this is toxic in its own rightful way.

The forums haven't got a clue lmao don't worry.

You're right that there's a massive survivor bias here. The forums permabanned a lot of people in the past and look where we are now. This culture is now self-enforcing even without moderation.

Here's the thing: lots of people have been unfairly banned and warned for minor offenses because the ToS is incredibly strict. This includes people who got banned for listing clubs on PFs. That sparked an outrage but there are plenty of instances of inconsistent moderation that do not spark outrages too. But people like to treat that as a one-off instead of a pattern.

So why do so many people say it's fine? Because they are so short-staffed that basically everyone violates the ToS and yet nothing happens to most. However usually, you don't get an infraction because no one reports you, not because you did not violate the ToS. So while it seems random on the outside, moderation is actually almost purely report-based. Someone with a hate boner for you will report you, get their friends to report you just because you said "eff me", and if a GM picks it up, you roll another dice: each GM can be incredibly idiosyncratic and some will ban you for that while others won't.

The REAL way to avoid bans in the game? It's not about abiding by the ToS. It's about (1) making any insult ambiguous and interpretable the other way and (2) don't make enemies of Karens.

Most of the other comments on this thread have no clue what they're saying.

[Koros]

If you've ever met most sprouts, a lot of them have anxiety about interacting with others and tanking for the first time. They fear that people will be rude to them, or in some cases, ran into such an incident where someone was rude. So a rule that protects them from rude people seems good for the game, actually.

Why do we need to cater to people with social anxiety?

They need to see a therapist and stick to single player games, not play a social game.

[Toutatis]

I decided to bring the mood and typed in /shout "If you focus on crystals, I put them where light doesn't shine." It felt like trainer telling you not to suck this time and win. You can tell that cringe (what isn't really), but I am sure a lot of people would find that endearing and prefer that to (again) completely sterile chat for a minute..

You and I must come from completely different worlds. There’s nothing endearing to it. To me it looks like a rude vulgar person trying to bully people. There’s nothing constructive to it either (it still doesn’t say what is best to do). Besides, I’ve never had a trainer speak like that and I would not rehire such a trainer if it were to happen. While I personally would not have bothered reporting it, I would not be surprised if someone did. People from different backgrounds, languages and cultures play this game, including on the NA servers.

That might be the issue. But then why can't GM tell stop using those words instead making it such a mystery. They don't even put that as obvious examples in their guide.

Their guide is clear enough to understand where the boundaries are and I'm never afraid to help or speak in game chat.

Next time, instead of saying “you got the wrong tactic” or using scatological references such as “if you focus on crystals, I put them where light doesn't shine”, just be constructive like “have you thought of doing x instead of y? it would have z result” or in the case of pvp, “btw if you focus on crystals only we will get less points than if we do this other strat” or “for max points it’s best to…” or in a raid, “watch for x mechanic”, “when the boss does x, you have to go to y”.

"You suck" doesn't get anyone anywhere and just builds resentment; "look for the adds on the side of the arena" or "that big orange marker is a stack marker" might help get a smoother run.

[Darkobra]

Koros giving advice on how to avoid bans is hilarious considering he has so many alts BECAUSE of his bans.

[Syln]

Why do we need to cater to people with social anxiety?

They need to see a therapist and stick to single player games, not play a social game.

Probably because there are far more people playing mmo that have social anxiety than not, would be silly not to cater to them

[Renalt]

That's why I like Balmung it's pretty much Barrens Chat.

[Ishe-P]

I'm not exactly sure what this post is for. Do you think people zone into DF to talk about whatever is on their mind? What's pathetic about not doing that?

I *kind of* understand the 'your tactic is bad' stance, but I will also posit that this rule or whatever it is has been put into effect because gamers just can't help themselves and will harrass what they perceive as bad gamers to the nth degree and even call in their so-called friends to help. Obviously it's better to be an adult in this kind of situation and try to 'get' where the other party is coming from, from both sides, but there is no way that anyone trying to level with another person online is considering that person's feelings. It can happen, but this is the Internet and not some utopia where everyone practices good netiquette. It's just easier to stop this behavior dead in its tracks for the sake of the community at large. Gamers have long been a confused people, and it is better to protect them from themselves. I speak from experience.

Is telling someone they're bad part of the natural interactions you're looking for? In my experience as a real human person, that just isn't something people do. FF14 isn't setup like a sport where team members can rib one another and have it come across as benign trash talk. Anyone who has been reported will know exactly what they did, sure, but would be unable to prove it beyond any reasonable doubt. I think it is better for the community's health more than it isn't. There is simply know way to know what impact your words will have on someone at any given point, and it is better to err on the side of caution, even if everyone's heart is in the right place.

[Mr_Gyactus]

It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
Mark Twain.

[Absimiliard]

That's why I like Balmung it's pretty much Barrens Chat.

[Jeeqbit]

Some people might tell you're trolling with part about SE's house.

No, I am not. I am speaking from experience interacting with SE's GMs when I reported someone. They were extremely apologetic that they allowed this person to behave this way in their game. That tells me that they see it as their house and want everyone in it to behave respectfully.

And guests don't exactly pay for visiting.

You may believe that, because you pay, you suddenly have the right to be as rude as you like. That isn't how it works and a restaurant would kick you out if you were rude. In fact I did get kicked out once. I once told the cook in a restaurant that I thought they should improve their diet (I was genuinely concerned for them based on how they looked if you catch my drift). I got banned from there for life.