Request to adjust Criterion Rewards

[Xelanar]

It should have dropped 650 gear so people who are doing savage could gear up their alts with slightly lesser gear and people who aren't doing savage could have an alternative to tome gear either for alts or to use different stats.

I'd even go as far as to have it drop 660 gear. The dungeon itself syncs at 665, so basically developers intend you to go in there with BiS gear. I see no reason why it shouldn't also drop there then.
By the time 6.45 hit, savage raids had been out long enough to justify a viable alternative for gearing up, I think. Having savage glamour more accessible is not a bad thing either, and considering there are people out there, who don't even do savage raiding, it would allow them access to BiS gear too. Technically thed don't NEED it for anything, but I know a lot of people who would like to have it, just for the sake of having it.

It's not like they would have to design an entire different set of gear either. They could always just attach currency and a vendor for buying savage raid gear, books, item coffers or upgrade materials and such. If for some reason they were scared of people gearing up too quickly at this point, they could even add a weekly cap to that currency.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I'd even go as far as to have it drop 660 gear. The dungeon itself syncs at 665, so basically developers intend you to go in there with BiS gear. I see no reason why it shouldn't also drop there then.
By the time 6.45 hit, savage raids had been out long enough to justify a viable alternative for gearing up, I think. Having savage glamour more accessible is not a bad thing either, and considering there are people out there, who don't even do savage raiding, it would allow them access to BiS gear too. Technically thed don't NEED it for anything, but I know a lot of people who would like to have it, just for the sake of having it.

It's not like they would have to design an entire different set of gear either. They could always just attach currency and a vendor for buying savage raid gear, books, item coffers or upgrade materials and such. If for some reason they were scared of people gearing up too quickly at this point, they could even add a weekly cap to that currency.

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

[Deo14]

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

Criterion normal is a savage. Why shouldn't it at least give upgrade mats?

Criterion dungeon rewards are exactly what they should be. Glamour, mounts, minions, and lore. It doesn't need to be an avenue for gear.

It doesn't matter what your subjective ideal is, hard fact is that PF is having 1-2 criterion parties in prime time few days after it's release. Incentives are clearly not enough.

[Xelanar]

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

Could you elaborate on why?
Is it because you believe 660 savage gear to be some sort of achievement that should remain exclusive to savage 8-person content?
Or is there another reason 660 savage gear exclusivity is important to you, and you do not wish for it to be obtainable by other means besides raiding at all?

[Tint]

Could you elaborate on why?
Is it because you believe 660 savage gear to be some sort of achievement that should remain exclusive to savage 8-person content?
Or is there another reason 660 savage gear exclusivity is so important to you, that you do not wish for it to be obtainable by other means besides raiding at all?

4 person groups are easier to build and manage than 8 person groups and this means Criterion would kill Savage Raids when the rewards are the same.

The reason again is that tomestone gear is just too strong. There is no room between tomestone and savage raid gear for another endgame gear set.

They have to make tomestone gear weaker, turn it into the wellfare gear it is and open up the path for more interesting endgame gearing steps.

When tomestone gear would be 640 and upgrades into 650 then we can have like

640 normal raid gear, 660 savage raid gear, 655 Criterion, 650 24 man raid gear and we even have room for a relic gear set which can be upgraded in easy content with a lot of grind.

But as long as tomestone gear stays 650 / 660 there is simply no reason to play anything else than expert roulette and savage raid and maybe the 24 man raid once a week. And that is the reason the game feels like there is no content.

[Xelanar]

4 person groups are easier to build and manage than 8 person groups and this means Criterion would kill Savage Raids when the rewards are the same.

The reason again is that tomestone gear is just too strong. There is no room between tomestone and savage raid gear for another endgame gear set.

They have to make tomestone gear weaker, turn it into the wellfare gear it is and open up the path for more interesting endgame gearing steps.

When tomestone gear would be 640 and upgrades into 650 then we can have like

640 normal raid gear, 660 savage raid gear, 655 Criterion, 650 24 man raid gear and we even have room for a relic gear set which can be upgraded in easy content with a lot of grind.

But as long as tomestone gear stays 650 / 660 there is simply no reason to play anything else than expert roulette and savage raid and maybe the 24 man raid once a week. And that is the reason the game feels like there is no content.

I see. Well, that is a valid reason, even if it is an opinion I don't really share. People who do not raid for the sake of clearing the raid, but for the sole purpose of gearing up, may not like to see their achievement(aquiring BiS gear) diminished in value.

For me, gearing has always been nothing more than means to an end(and glamour). I would still clear savage raids if they only dropped glamour or vanity items, and I never really cared about what Itemlevel my jobs have, or if other people can get there more easily later on. As long as I take enjoyment out of the process, I'm fine.

I raid because it's fun, and I do not believe to be the only person who does so. Stating that removing 660 itemlevel exclusivity from savage raids would kill them, might be too extreme a statement, but I DO get the point you want to get across.

As someone who does not really enjoy having content gated behind gear requirements, I see no harm in having savage equivalent gear in criterion dungeons tough.

I guess it's just a clash of differing ideals and expectations.