Request to adjust Criterion Rewards

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I'd even go as far as to have it drop 660 gear. The dungeon itself syncs at 665, so basically developers intend you to go in there with BiS gear. I see no reason why it shouldn't also drop there then.
By the time 6.45 hit, savage raids had been out long enough to justify a viable alternative for gearing up, I think. Having savage glamour more accessible is not a bad thing either, and considering there are people out there, who don't even do savage raiding, it would allow them access to BiS gear too. Technically thed don't NEED it for anything, but I know a lot of people who would like to have it, just for the sake of having it.

It's not like they would have to design an entire different set of gear either. They could always just attach currency and a vendor for buying savage raid gear, books, item coffers or upgrade materials and such. If for some reason they were scared of people gearing up too quickly at this point, they could even add a weekly cap to that currency.

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

[Deo14]

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

Criterion normal is a savage. Why shouldn't it at least give upgrade mats?

Criterion dungeon rewards are exactly what they should be. Glamour, mounts, minions, and lore. It doesn't need to be an avenue for gear.

It doesn't matter what your subjective ideal is, hard fact is that PF is having 1-2 criterion parties in prime time few days after it's release. Incentives are clearly not enough.

[Xelanar]

Not on board with it giving an equivalent to Savage or Augmented Tome gear, especially not for Criterion Normal and not before the respective catchup patch (x.1, x.3, x.5 aka the Alliance Raid patches). 5 or 10 item levels below for normal is reasonable enough.

Could you elaborate on why?
Is it because you believe 660 savage gear to be some sort of achievement that should remain exclusive to savage 8-person content?
Or is there another reason 660 savage gear exclusivity is important to you, and you do not wish for it to be obtainable by other means besides raiding at all?

[elioaiko]

I'm honestly surprised they didn't attach the new relic grind to it. What a better way to get people to try new content than to intergrate it into your new dungeon content.

The rewards are very lacking. Not even attaching a glam or mounts can bring people to it. They could have made gear that is a half step into between Savage and unagumented tome gear to bridge the gearing process.

[Shenlao]

I think people are talking about something different here with attaching the relic grind cause pretty sure the relic grind is meant to be a casual activity.
I don't think attaching it to what is kinda savage tier difficulty content is really a thing that makes a whole lot of sense.
Regardless I think we can pack it up it's pretty clear that there is not enough traction for this thing to matter so if it's even on their radar it's gotta be something way at the bottom. It is what it is.

[Xaphire]

Criterion dungeon rewards are exactly what they should be. Glamour, mounts, minions, and lore. It doesn't need to be an avenue for gear.

[Supersnow845]

Criterion dungeon rewards are exactly what they should be. Glamour, mounts, minions, and lore. It doesn't need to be an avenue for gear.

If it’s exactly what it should be why has the content died on arrival twice now

[Tint]

Criterion dungeon rewards are exactly what they should be. Glamour, mounts, minions, and lore. It doesn't need to be an avenue for gear.

And what are your arguments?

I think it should reward gear.

A group of 4 players is much easier to build and manage than a group of 8. This group can be a group of close friends, while in an 8 player group you have to deal with people you barely know.

This means the barrier of entry is much lower, so the audience for Criterion is potentially bigger than for Savage Raids.

But Criterion lacks the reward. Why spend time learning the machanics when you don't get anything worthwile out of it?

With better rewards, like gear, Criterion could become the go-to endgame for a lot of people who would never touch savage because of the 8 people requirement.

At least the mount is less ugly this time around.

[Absurdity]

I don't think you'd even have to shuffle the itemlevel around too much, simply adding 655 gear to criterion would make it a potential gearing option depending on substats. I'd take a 655 crit/det piece over a 660 piece with tenacity any day for example.

[Nav_Fae]

The problem with gear is that gear is only necessary for Savage and Ultimates. There is simply no reason for a casual to need to further boost their item level no matter how much they may desire to do so. The lack of midcore content is a huge culprit for this. For those who want it as glamour, they just simply wait until they can unsync it in future patches. This is an intentional game design choice so that those who do work to earn the gear get a small window of opportunity to enjoy it before everyone else gets it essentially stress free. Unfortunately, until we get more involved Midcore content beyond Extreme Primals, there just isn't a reason to add alternative gearing options for casuals. Let alone with more interesting stats. Gearing alternatives like I mentioned earlier leads to stat overlapping where multiple gearsets have identical stats or one has objectively bad stats (Skill Speed), making it not even an option to consider farming for. Basically, my point is, is that the rabbit hole is a lot deeper than just add more gear because we need more content as a whole to make that gear worth having in the first place. Otherwise, this basically becomes an indirect nerf to Savage gearing. Having 660 gear anywhere outside of Savage would ruin any incentive a casual would need to do that. They already have to wait until the expansion is basically over just to finally upgrade their tomb pieces via Alliance Raid. Which again is still a weekly. If they ever add gear to Critieon, it almost definitely needs to be on a weekly lockout rule. Also, as Tint said, getting 4 people together is a lot easier than 8 people. Do not misunderstand me though, we really do need more gearing options. Even raiders want more options so they can raid on other jobs and not feel locked into a main. But I think the problem is a lot deeper than putting gear into Critieon. Because it impacts everyone as a whole, not just casuals. Not just raiders.