Manderville Relic Criticism

[Saraide]

Except variant dungeons are at least easily soloable on any job for pretty much everyone and there is no waiting. I find that soloing them is the best way to do them as you don't have anyone interfering with what you need. If someone wants to run them a year from now, they would be able to easily do so and requiring a one time clear of the 12 paths would have been ok.

However, I am quite happy that we don't have to redo the 12 paths for each weapon. Once was enough and while the place is pretty, it is also monotonous (repetitive bosses and mechanics) and adds along the paths offer nothing: except two small groups of special adds on a path variation, they have no mechanics other than stay out of their very slow and predictable cone, line or circle aoe and there's walls everywhere to slow you down. I wouldn't redo the grind, no matter the reward (I can't imagine doing that ninja boss 12 times on each job lol). At most I'll go again with friends for a few paths if they ask me.

Yea it will probably be exceptionally easy to convince a friend or two to accompany a player doing a variant dungeon for the first time. Wouldnt say quite the same for delubrum.

[zonderbunny]

I can understand why folks don't like how the relics have been done in EW. Personally I'd rather this than Eureka, Bozja, ARR books, light farming etc. Tying it to variant dungeons would have killed the relics for me. I hate them almost as much as I hate Eureka and Bozja.

[ReynTime]

This must be why I was seeing so many players suddenly interested in doing the Zodiac relics.

[FairyDJ]

I did 1 zodiac weapon and completed it. That was not fun.

[ReynTime]

I did 1 zodiac weapon and completed it. That was not fun.

Good for you. Now all you have to do is never do it again.

Thankfully you can easily get the manderville weapon that you will surely use in a lot of content that you partake in that doesn't desync you off its item level and even get to show off to all the people who won't put the time and effort into such an arduous task of trading in 1000 poetics.

[Syln]

I did 1 zodiac weapon and completed it. That was not fun.

Absolutely, it was annoying as fuck, both Arr and Endwalker relic farm are boring in their own way, one is actively tedious, the other is passively easy but both aren't fun at all and brought nothing to the table in term of actual content after the first step.

Eureka and Bozja were awesome though not perfect but still really good, bringing some fun to the game with dozens of players making party to do stuff, it was a reminder that there was other people actually playing the game and not just being afk at Limsa or whatever, l loved that and that's coming from someone that prefer to play alone most of the time.

It's just baffle me that they chose not to do it again for endwalker, as i said before in this thread, tomestone grind would have been ok as an alternative for people that don't like this kind of content or could even work in synergy with it.

Relics aren't supposed to be hard to get and the idea that they should be tedious to farm, some kind of insufferable ordeal, is absurd to me but that doesn't mean an half-assed tomestone grind will be an alternative either.

As far as i am concerned, relics were actual content and the source of days of entertainment for the last 2 previous expansion, what we get for Endwalker is the epitome of laziness from Squeenix.

[FairyDJ]

I honestly like the idea of not having to “stand in the rain on a Saturday and fine a specific drop and you need six of these drops to weave 1 sign and you need 4 signs to take back to person X to upgrade your relic. I also didn’t like Bozja at all. It was not any fun to me. Also we forget that part of the grind is going through the Hildibrand quest line. So if you haven’t done it you will be starting from ARR and working your way up. And they have a lot of story, trials, quests and instances for you to work through. I think the tome grind is also nice for people who can’t spend weeks grinding a weapon. Just my thoughts.

[TheNight]

I honestly like the idea of not having to “stand in the rain on a Saturday and fine a specific drop and you need six of these drops to weave 1 sign and you need 4 signs to take back to person X to upgrade your relic. I also didn’t like Bozja at all. It was not any fun to me. Also we forget that part of the grind is going through the Hildibrand quest line. So if you haven’t done it you will be starting from ARR and working your way up. And they have a lot of story, trials, quests and instances for you to work through. I think the tome grind is also nice for people who can’t spend weeks grinding a weapon. Just my thoughts.

It's an MMO. Players should not be entitled to welfare handouts of weapons. Accomplishment should actually mean something.

Of course, in the participation trophy era, it indeed quite seems that this is becoming an untenable position.

[Jojoya]

It's an MMO. Players should not be entitled to welfare handouts of weapons. Accomplishment should actually mean something.

Of course, in the participation trophy era, it indeed quite seems that this is becoming an untenable position.

Accomplishments do mean something. The strength of meaning will vary from individual to individual. What was trivial to one may be a major achievement to another.

A relic weapon isn't an accomplishment. This may come as a shock to you but relic weapons have never been anything other than participation rewards. Participate in doing the following activities and you get the reward. Everyone wins if they do the necessary participation.

If you need something that will provide you deeper meaning than a participation reward, create your own accomplishment. Set goals that challenge you then see if you can make them all happen. If you feel a material reward is needed at the end, then set one that you feel is fitting.

I'm still highly confused by them opting out of involving the Criterion dungeons in any of the relic steps, even as an optional alternative to the tomestone farm.

People complained about both so they had a chance to kill two birds with one stone.

Criterion rewards Causality. They didn't opt out of it. It was another opt in all along.

If most players are taking what some consider the easy way out to get Causality, i guess it goes to show just how much relics weapons mean to the average player.

[Toutatis]

It's an MMO. Players should not be entitled to welfare handouts of weapons. Accomplishment should actually mean something.

This idea that getting a weapon in an MMO should necessarily be subject to an unhealthy grind pretty much reserved for people who are either obsessed, on welfare, living in their parents’ basement and/or addicted to gaming is ridiculous. There’s no accomplishment with long grinds other than showing that you have way too much time on your hands and not many interests and/or responsibilities in RL. Personally I would feel ashamed to hold all relics since inception.

The (paying) gamer base has aged, many have jobs, families, responsibilities and can’t carelessly and stupidly spend all their free time grinding a weapon that will soon become obsolete. The new system is fine. Those who want to invent themselves an ARR type of grind can do so. I like that I can finally get a decent weapon (it won’t be BiS until a few months before 7.0) for different jobs in a reasonable amount of time. Don’t care about what others think of what my chars wear, I play for myself, not for strangers.