Adding a Magic Dot Spec Class

[SieyaM]

Unless they fix the hard limit that mobs have on the number of effects that can be applied, DoT caster will not be a thing. It is a pretty high limit and it's hard to reach, but there are instances of it still being hit, and if you have a job whose DPS is entirely dependent on DoTs and they can't land them because the limit has been reached, then you have a useless job. This applies mostly to hunt mobs in the overworld, but even TOP I think ran into this problem with a few cases.

[tearagion]

Unless they fix the hard limit that mobs have on the number of effects that can be applied, DoT caster will not be a thing. It is a pretty high limit and it's hard to reach, but there are instances of it still being hit, and if you have a job whose DPS is entirely dependent on DoTs and they can't land them because the limit has been reached, then you have a useless job. This applies mostly to hunt mobs in the overworld, but even TOP I think ran into this problem with a few cases.

This has been addressed numerous times, DoT doesn't necessarily need to occupy a debuff slot. Slipstream is a DoT effect on the ground, no debuff. Flamethrower is a channelled DoT, no debuff. A single debuff slot can have some nuance added to it by buffing it (whether it's before like bristle on BLU, or a hypothetical new effect that upgrades it while it's on the enemy), or by extending it (old Contagion). Even all that aside, their design doesn't reflect this debuff slot concern considering DoTs that do not take advantage of a DoT's properties exist (Sonic Break, Circle of Scorn), and Reaper has an exclusively personal debuff that exists with theoretically 100% uptime when it could just as easily behave like Storm's Eye or Gekko.

[SieyaM]

This has been addressed numerous times, DoT doesn't necessarily need to occupy a debuff slot. Slipstream is a DoT effect on the ground, no debuff. Flamethrower is a channelled DoT, no debuff. A single debuff slot can have some nuance added to it by buffing it (whether it's before like bristle on BLU, or a hypothetical new effect that upgrades it while it's on the enemy), or by extending it (old Contagion). Even all that aside, their design doesn't reflect this debuff slot concern considering DoTs that do not take advantage of a DoT's properties exist (Sonic Break, Circle of Scorn), and Reaper has an exclusively personal debuff that exists with theoretically 100% uptime when it could just as easily behave like Storm's Eye or Gekko.

While Slipstream doesn't take up a debuff slot, it does require mobs to remain in it's area of effect, and putting too many things like that on one job means it is especially prone to mob movement or tanks just not being able to keep a mob still. Even with Earthly Stars ridiculous range tanks are still running mobs out of its range in dungeons, but I suppose that doesn't matter in the end since jobs are designed for Savage only.

[tearagion]

While Slipstream doesn't take up a debuff slot, it does require mobs to remain in it's area of effect, and putting too many things like that on one job means it is especially prone to mob movement or tanks just not being able to keep a mob still. Even with Earthly Stars ridiculous range tanks are still running mobs out of its range in dungeons, but I suppose that doesn't matter in the end since jobs are designed for Savage only.

I fail to see how this sufficiently contests my point that the debuff limit is a bullshit excuse

[Raikai]

This has been addressed numerous times, DoT doesn't necessarily need to occupy a debuff slot. Slipstream is a DoT effect on the ground, no debuff. Flamethrower is a channelled DoT, no debuff. A single debuff slot can have some nuance added to it by buffing it (whether it's before like bristle on BLU, or a hypothetical new effect that upgrades it while it's on the enemy), or by extending it (old Contagion). Even all that aside, their design doesn't reflect this debuff slot concern considering DoTs that do not take advantage of a DoT's properties exist (Sonic Break, Circle of Scorn), and Reaper has an exclusively personal debuff that exists with theoretically 100% uptime when it could just as easily behave like Storm's Eye or Gekko.

Hm... what if the main gauge for the caster is a 'dot receptacle' that you power up by many buffs with upkeep times, and that receptacle redirects that damage through a single persistent kardia-esque dot?

This opens up for ideas like a puppetmaster caster, treating the puppet like a voodoo doll, and kind of bypasses that dot hindrance that the system has.

[Flana]

Unless they fix the hard limit that mobs have on the number of effects that can be applied, DoT caster will not be a thing. It is a pretty high limit and it's hard to reach, but there are instances of it still being hit, and if you have a job whose DPS is entirely dependent on DoTs and they can't land them because the limit has been reached, then you have a useless job. This applies mostly to hunt mobs in the overworld, but even TOP I think ran into this problem with a few cases.

If it had 2 dots, it is literally impossible to reach the debuff cap even if every DPS job in an alliance raid was the new DoT job. If it had 3 debuffs, you still wouldn't hit the cap unless 12 of your 15 DPS are the new job. The only places the cap matters is world content and exploratory content, and designing around that is a worthless endeavor since both have far more than 60 people wailing on them (doubly so since exploratory content keeps giving even more debuffs to use on top of class kits). This hasn't been a problem since Heavensward and that was when everyone had multiple dots/debuffs and SMN was running around with a mindboggling 7. TOP never had this problem, it was your debuff/buff cap that was hitting capacity, not Omega's.

Additionally as others have said there are ways to do debuffs that don't involve applying additional effects onto a target, such as old Shadowflare or a singular debuff that changes based on your job abilities.

Quick edit: I have also been raving about a curse-based Puppetmaster concept where the puppet is your weapon for years so I am 100% behind the idea.

[Raikai]

If it had 2 dots, it is literally impossible to reach the debuff cap even if every DPS job in an alliance raid was the new DoT job. If it had 3 debuffs, you still wouldn't hit the cap unless 12 of your 15 DPS are the new job. The only places the cap matters is world content and exploratory content, and designing around that is a worthless endeavor since both have far more than 60 people wailing on them (doubly so since exploratory content keeps giving even more debuffs to use on top of class kits). This hasn't been a problem since Heavensward and that was when everyone had multiple dots/debuffs and SMN was running around with a mindboggling 7. TOP never had this problem, it was your debuff/buff cap that was hitting capacity, not Omega's.

Additionally as others have said there are ways to do debuffs that don't involve applying additional effects onto a target, such as old Shadowflare or a singular debuff that changes based on your job abilities.

Quick edit: I have also been raving about a curse-based Puppetmaster concept where the puppet is your weapon for years so I am 100% behind the idea.

Not trying to self promote here, but last year I drew this concept (again, inspired by Lulu from FFX):



My line of thought:
- Mystic (instead of Onmyoji) because it would be able to umbrella more 'fantasies' outside of the Far Eastern origin;
- The weapon is an 'idol', which can be some ominous figurine, a symbol or just a doll;
- Artifact sets usually follow a similar silhouette, and MYS would favor Far Eastern 'mage' attires with traditional ceremonial robes - We already have many of those, so the job wouldn't feel lacking of mix and match options like Dancers do;
- Like with black mages and the pointy hats with hidden eye, they have a 'key piece' which is the mask, inspired by eastern mysticism. Key colors are Purple and Black+Gold;
- Job icon most likely represented by the far eastern mask;

[Flana]

Not trying to self promote here, but last year I drew this concept (again, inspired by Lulu from FFX):



My line of thought:
- Mystic (instead of Onmyoji) because it would be able to umbrella more 'fantasies' outside of the Far Eastern origin;
- The weapon is an 'idol', which can be some ominous figurine, a symbol or just a doll;
- Artifact sets usually follow a similar silhouette, and MYS would favor Far Eastern 'mage' attires with traditional ceremonial robes - We already have many of those, so the job wouldn't feel lacking of mix and match options like Dancers do;
- Like with black mages and the pointy hats with hidden eye, they have a 'key piece' which is the mask, inspired by eastern mysticism. Key colors are Purple and Black+Gold;
- Job icon most likely represented by the far eastern mask;

I'd play the absolute hell out of that. Great mockup for an AF set!