Thread: PVP 7.0

Kind of want new mode of for rank pvp for each new seasons, maybe a new map both frontlines and ranks, think roulette should have frontline and rival wing be in the que. Want the network engine to be better instead of having a graphical upgrade we are going to get in 7.0. Want shorter and faster animation if we can't fix current engine code in this game, but doubt developer for pvp will even look at any of the thread beside for japanese to care.

Originally Posted by SweetPete

I’m not into rival wings. I do wonder what they will do to it in 7.0. Will it survive or be removed?

Would they include it the Fanfest presentation just to then announce it’s being deleted when 7.0 launches? Not that this poster would have known that then, now we do…

First: I'm a Frontlines player. I'm never going to touch CC. Personally, I can't stand e-sports and I'm tremendously sick of devs trying to make 'a scene' happen by pandering to that crowd. I've seen it happen in half a dozen games by now and it always spoils the experience for anyone who's not a streamer.

With that out of the way:

Let me heal again. Like, for real, the way it was in ShB era PvP. If I select a job titled 'healer', then that's what I actually want to spend most of my time and attention doing, not DPSing. I don't want a healer DPS rotation. The fantasy of a combat mage is really only fun when you're making it work against the design anyway. To a lesser extent, I feel this way about tanks as well.

I enjoy prolonging fights, rescuing teammates, and shutting down pushes by understanding where the enemy's attention is, when it's safe to plant and cast, and when it's time to bail. I like encounters to feel more like wrestling matches, with lots of struggling and applying pressure. I like when there's probing and skirmishing and roving parties. Every engagement being so decisive instantly sucks the fun out of it for me. At least under older patches this only happened with heavy premades and runaway battle high; these are things that also still happen in the current patch. I played every role and still felt it was more fun to play melee then, carefully watching to pick off stragglers until you got big enough to attempt dives.

Un-prune the kits. Please give me more than six buttons to hit. Preferably more buttons that do more things than simply produce damage. Sometimes a 90s timer is good. Sometimes oGCDs are good. I am so, so bored by how limited my options are right now on all jobs.

Outside of that, I dunno. Better glams? Ditch battlepass and rely on daily tomestone rewards to drive engagement? I unsubbed for a year because of the rework. Really disappointed to still see Frontlines such an unplayable mess. Would love to see a major shift in coming patches.

Originally Posted by CruciformHeart

First: I'm a Frontlines player. I'm never going to touch CC. Personally, I can't stand e-sports and I'm tremendously sick of devs trying to make 'a scene' happen by pandering to that crowd. I've seen it happen in half a dozen games by now and it always spoils the experience for anyone who's not a streamer.

With that out of the way:

Let me heal again. Like, for real, the way it was in ShB era PvP. If I select a job titled 'healer', then that's what I actually want to spend most of my time and attention doing, not DPSing. I don't want a healer DPS rotation. The fantasy of a combat mage is really only fun when you're making it work against the design anyway. To a lesser extent, I feel this way about tanks as well.

I enjoy prolonging fights, rescuing teammates, and shutting down pushes by understanding where the enemy's attention is, when it's safe to plant and cast, and when it's time to bail. I like encounters to feel more like wrestling matches, with lots of struggling and applying pressure. I like when there's probing and skirmishing and roving parties. Every engagement being so decisive instantly sucks the fun out of it for me. At least under older patches this only happened with heavy premades and runaway battle high; these are things that also still happen in the current patch. I played every role and still felt it was more fun to play melee then, carefully watching to pick off stragglers until you got big enough to attempt dives.

Un-prune the kits. Please give me more than six buttons to hit. Preferably more buttons that do more things than simply produce damage. Sometimes a 90s timer is good. Sometimes oGCDs are good. I am so, so bored by how limited my options are right now on all jobs.

Outside of that, I dunno. Better glams? Ditch battlepass and rely on daily tomestone rewards to drive engagement? I unsubbed for a year because of the rework. Really disappointed to still see Frontlines such an unplayable mess. Would love to see a major shift in coming patches.

Hello Frontlines player, Crystalline Conflict player here.

You are free to dislike CC or small-scale PvP and stick to your large-scale zergfests, however I find your take on how they "pander to CC and try to make an 'e-sport scene' happen" absolutely repulsive. Do you realize for how long Frontline got support where small-scale PvP suffered? God forbid they actually decided to actually support a proper small-scale 5v5 mode for a spin, HUH?

See, this is the thing about Healers - it was always fun for the Healer in question if they were good and got the backup from other teammates or Healers. However, healer-centric PvP starts becoming incredibly unfun if you AREN'T at the top of your game as a Healer, which stems from the absolute dependency on Healers - causing inflammatory comments from those who aren't Healers and rely on them and massive healer anxiety from those who are Healers. This applied to both small-scale (Feast) and large-scale (Frontlines, Rival Wings), but the latter suffered less because you could just throw more healers at the problem.

The change to give everyone Recuperate and be responsible for themselves is so they could make PvP role-agnostic (i.e. breaking the concept of roles) so a team without a dedicated healer wouldn't automatically lose because of it. But make no mistake, Healers still provide a ton of extra healing / mitigation that can and will turn the tide if used correctly, along with other nasty buffs/debuffs.

Both Healers and Tanks got more lethality as a result and actually do damage rather than *just* be damage sponges. Killing enemies is fun, exclusively being a support bot is fun if you like the niche, many did not.


However I do see your plea to expand the kits again. Right now, including global actions (Guard, Purify, Recuperate, Elixir) each job has about 11-12 actions. I'd like to see the kit expand to 16 buttons by adding an extra global action (Fetter Ward) and 3 new job actions each. The reason I like 16 is because of the controller's cross hotbar layout. As for cooldowns... 90s is Limit Break territory. The longest CD is 60s on Reaper (Plentiful Harvest action) so that's as high as it will go. having to wait 1min30s for a standard ability to return is "meh". However, Healers would receive more support actions with it, including potential extra heals (like WHM Tetragrammaton).


On board with better glams, NOT on board with ditching the battle pass. It arguably is one of the better engagement drivers they have implemented that gets people playing. There is only so much tomestone rewards you can add to the game until it just becomes a joke - every roulette already provides a metric ton of them.

I can understand the desire to return to full healing on demand on healers for FLs, because it's not 5v5. On the other hand, most of the healing you do in FLs is not heal spamming, it's pinch healing to save people, which the current kits (esp whm and ast) do perfectly well, and the recast will be up again the next time the need arises

Originally Posted by SweetPete

Hello Warriors of light,

So any ideas of what they might do too PVP in 7.0?

Every job will get an lb that does a 50 yalm pull-in, provide 30 second invuln, and throw out an expanding circle of 20,000x3 potency sky shatters.

I'm only half joking, but watch it happen.

I think they should explore the idea of using skills without tab targeting by default, think of how you can use point blank aoes but for every weaponskill and spell. It can reward more skill play as opposed to whoever was first to zerg down the other team and keep them locked down. By default it would be set to standard camera type as opposed to legacy but you can switch.

Weaponskills with <5 yalms will all have varying range based on weapons and a "critical" zone where they will deal slightly more dmg, i.e, DRG wants to be at the very tip of their attack range while MNK wants to be as close as possible. Single target will have a cone, rectangle or circle aoe in front so you will have to face the opponent to hit them requiring a level of skill where you need to aim your attacks. Weaponskills with >5 yalms will always shoot forward and will have a "travel" zone where you are effectively shooting out a moving aoe and the time it takes to reach its max yalms varies but if an opponent steps in the path during that, they get hit. It would make for effective zoning tools and cover fire for ranged when shooting down a hallway.

Spells for the most part will act like ranged weaponskills with some exceptions to use a target aoe marker instead of a melee range. For example, Flare can drop a target aoe and you will cast it at that spot. Ultimately, while by default, you will not need to tab target to attack an enemy, it is an OPTION to just attack while aiming. You can still tab target enemies but in frontlines, especially on controller that is not always the case and if they changed it to how I suggested above you can just go in and attack instead of trying to pick the target you want when there is 30 ppl on screen. They just need to modernize pvp and reduce recasts to 1.5 base.

Hopefully they introduce new set of Hellhound Weapons and Armor with 7.0

It would be wonderful if the armor set had each piece upgradeable like the weapons are and the complete set would gain additional extra effects once you upgrade your whole set.

Anything to make long time grinding more desireable.

All I truly care about at this point is having a proper custom mode for all of pvp.
Crystal Conflict should be able to queue undersized.
Both frontlines and rival wings should also have the ability to make custom games (also with an undersized option) as well.

As it has been for a long time now pvp just has very limited options available. For alliance raids you have options for which party you want to be in. The same goes for crystal conflict despite having a requirement for their custom games. Meanwhile, for the few that does organized rival wings and/or frontline games from time to time everyone is forced to sync queue, because it's the only option that's available.

Nobody asked for this suggestion, but I'll give it anyway because it's stuck in my mind. Why not encourage CBU3 to try something that plays to the game's strength? Why not try a PvE-based PvP mode? Something akin to Destiny's Gambit, or Maplestory's monster carnival (wonder if I'm the only weirdo that even knows what that was)?

I know the idea of 'competitive PvE' would come with it's own host of balance concerns, but it's been done before, and done pretty well. Get creative. It'd be nice to have a mode you could just queue into on repeat because it's fun to play, and not just leave you upset. PvE content, designed for PvP.

Wonder if it's ever been considered.