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  1. #1
    Player
    Malackai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    74
    Character
    Mezha'ra Athan
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 90
    Only play healer since ARR but I think they really need to spice some things up it has been getting more boring/dull as time went by (and no it doesn't get better in ultimate type content) because the root problem is the way healers are build.

    I Am still not sure why they decided to split healers back to regen/shield types they removed the split in tanks so people of that role could just bring the class they liked but for some weird reason with healers they went nope... your not allowed...
    I have always hoped for healers to have both regen or schield modes especially after AST was introduced seemed like a good start but they just went backwards again..

    for WHM after The Lost City of Amdapor (Hard) was released in HW with the Kuribu boss(that one switches and had healing spells that switch to dps spells when she enters a "reverse" mode that one could have been interesting for WHMs as a system (think kind of a cleric stance but more then just swap of potency but have your actual healing spells convert instead)

    The Lilly job system dint even get expanded in this expansion. The Lilly spells not being full OGCD like tetra to make it at least flow a little bit better in combat is still jarring to me even after 6 years..

    guess my 2 cents
    (8)

  2. #2
    Player
    Yushees's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Posts
    39
    Character
    Yushee Shinra
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 100
    PvP kits are just miles ahead in term of fun and engaging gameplay. Each got their own unique playstyle and feel rather than being pigeonholed into their 2 minutes buff window. Also EVERYONE gets to use their limit break button.
    (4)

  3. #3
    Player
    SilversLyu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2022
    Posts
    109
    Character
    Neni Feanie
    World
    Lich
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Yushees View Post
    PvP kits are just miles ahead in term of fun and engaging gameplay. Each got their own unique playstyle and feel rather than being pigeonholed into their 2 minutes buff window. Also EVERYONE gets to use their limit break button.
    Also combos that go into 1 button, truly a blessing.
    (1)

  4. #4
    Player
    Banriikku's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    I like Viera?
    Posts
    324
    Character
    Kasumi Bunja
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    My opinion ?
    In one word: WEIRD

    We have positionals but only on certain jobs. Some jobs have alsmost no skill ceilling other still have. We have a lot of healing but the necessity for it is missing.
    We have ranged tax on certain jobs but others dont have that. We have mana but almost no mana-mangement (hey to all BLM out there).
    We have a lot of stats but in the end its crit - dh - det as if we could delete the rest ?
    We have BLU... dont know... it exist, i guess.
    We have AST but its lore is ignored.
    We have WAR wich is at the moment all the jobs at once (DPS+healer+Tank) for some reason.... also i do wanna know how the love story in the old WAR Jobquest ends SE!!!!!!

    I could go on but who cares.... my answer is weird and sometimes unsatisfactory.
    (11)
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizzi View Post
    When I saw that we were going from Broil III at 290 potency in ShB to Broil IV at 295 potency in EW, I was shaking with how excited I was. I couldn't believe they were so generous with a whole 5 potency. I'm going to probably scream in excitement when 7.0 comes out and Broil V hits 300 potency, playing SCH going to be WILD once it hits 300!!!

  5. #5
    Player
    Kacho_Nacho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,693
    Character
    Kacho Nacho
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 99
    Quote Originally Posted by Banriikku View Post
    My opinion ?
    In one word: WEIRD

    We have positionals but only on certain jobs. Some jobs have almost no skill ceiling other still have. We have a lot of healing but the necessity for it is missing.
    We have ranged tax on certain jobs but others dont have that. We have mana but almost no mana-management (hey to all BLM out there).
    We have a lot of stats but in the end its crit - dh - det as if we could delete the rest ?
    We have BLU... don't know... it exist, i guess.
    We have AST but its lore is ignored.
    We have WAR which is at the moment all the jobs at once (DPS+healer+Tank) for some reason.... also i do wanna know how the love story in the old WAR Jobquest ends SE!!!!!!

    I could go on but who cares.... my answer is weird and sometimes unsatisfactory.
    Best post in the entire thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silver-Strider View Post
    Easy, you could ignore the entire Lily system and play more or less exactly like HW WHM, just without MP issues thanks to Thin Air.*snip*
    I know that's what I did back then. There was zero reason to use the Lily system in SB. I'm happy that has changed.

    Now, in my humble opinion as a slacker who hasn't done (can't do) the really tough stuff, I have to say I'm not in love with healing. EW is the first expansion where I played jobs in other roles and maxed levelled them.

    Maybe that's what Yoshi P intended but it feels bad. I want to enjoy healing but most times it feels like I'm as necessary as training wheels on a motorcycle. I should be feeling challenged when confronting something new, not unneeded. In their effort to not scare away new healers, Square Enix has only ruined the role for the more dedicated players.

    Tanking seems imbalanced with Warriors being the better job in everything.
    (1)

  6. #6
    Player
    Raikai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    3,560
    Character
    Arlo Nine-tails
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 90
    The.
    2min.
    Meta.
    Must.
    Die.

    I keep trying to think about dozens of ways to improve the complexity of my favorite jobs while still making them accessible, but there's very little to think in the way of player skill expression if everything needs to fit in a collective burst window.

    The challenge is not putting your brains to think. XIV just, quoting Zenos, wants to give a "test of your reflexes" - and your memory, at that, to press your keys at the right time, or else? You guessed it - won't fit in the next 2min burst window, possibly for the rest of the encounter. No wonder why many people regard PVP as a good form of skill expression, because in fact, it is the main thing over there, even though we have 1/4 of the number of actions available in pve.

    The more I think about this, the more I keep getting frustrated at the way XIV structures combat.
    (20)

  7. #7
    Player
    Remish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Posts
    342
    Character
    All-good Namesaregone
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by Raikai View Post
    The.
    2min.
    Meta.
    Must.
    Die.

    I keep trying to think about dozens of ways to improve the complexity of my favorite jobs while still making them accessible, but there's very little to think in the way of player skill expression if everything needs to fit in a collective burst window.

    The challenge is not putting your brains to think. XIV just, quoting Zenos, wants to give a "test of your reflexes" - and your memory, at that, to press your keys at the right time, or else? You guessed it - won't fit in the next 2min burst window, possibly for the rest of the encounter. No wonder why many people regard PVP as a good form of skill expression, because in fact, it is the main thing over there, even though we have 1/4 of the number of actions available in pve.

    The more I think about this, the more I keep getting frustrated at the way XIV structures combat.
    It wouldn't at all surprise me if SE took it the extra mile and went to a 90 second meta or 1min meta in 7.0
    (1)

  8. #8
    Player
    SargeTheSeagull's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    421
    Character
    Rad Calidum
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Remish View Post
    It wouldn't at all surprise me if SE took it the extra mile and went to a 90 second meta or 1min meta in 7.0
    Honestly had they put half of the raid buffs on 1 minute and the other half of two minutes most people, myself largely included, wouldn't have THAT much of a problem. Less than ideal mind you but still. I had a ninja in my asphodelos static and none of us minded the raid buff situation because we had to line up with trick every minute. As soon as that changed in 6.1 is when people started having a problem with the 2 min meta.
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player
    Absurdity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,102
    Character
    Tiana Vestoria
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull View Post
    Honestly had they put half of the raid buffs on 1 minute and the other half of two minutes most people, myself largely included, wouldn't have THAT much of a problem. Less than ideal mind you but still. I had a ninja in my asphodelos static and none of us minded the raid buff situation because we had to line up with trick every minute. As soon as that changed in 6.1 is when people started having a problem with the 2 min meta.
    I would still have a problem with it, because it barely changes anything. Most jobs are already designed to do their burst every 1 minute, they just have a slightly bigger burst every 2 minutes. So changing some party buffs to be 1 minute would still result in you playing the exact same way you do now, the damage spikes just get a bit lower.
    (7)

  10. #10
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,885
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurdity View Post
    I would still have a problem with it, because it barely changes anything. Most jobs are already designed to do their burst every 1 minute, they just have a slightly bigger burst every 2 minutes. So changing some party buffs to be 1 minute would still result in you playing the exact same way you do now, the damage spikes just get a bit lower.
    ^ This. ^

    ___________

    It's the fact that nigh everything can be saved for the 2-minute bursts (from, for instance, giving 60s CDs two charges) that leads to the time between 2-minute bursts feeling so empty, not merely the fact that the raid buffs all occur per 120 seconds...

    ...and it's the sheer amount of potency (relative to sustain / average ppgcd / individual rotational, positional, or uptime optimization rewards) that can be put out in 15 seconds per 2 minutes that causes the problems with the Crit/DHit damage variance between parses with identical actions, far more so than the effect of stacked raid buffs.

    (Remember, we used to have things like ~30% damage multipliers [e.g., DRG's old Blood for Blood] stacking atop 10% Trick Attacks, 10% Foe Requiem, 10% Contagion, 10% crit Litany, and 10% AoE Balance [late HW], etc.; buff multiplicity was far more impactful in the past, before the "2 minute meta". What we didn't have back then, though, was attacks hitting for some 3x our average potency-per-GCD.)
    (1)
    Last edited by Shurrikhan; 07-08-2023 at 05:30 PM.

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