These forums are weird

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

1) Churn. FFXIV has a steady player growth due to new players coming in to replace old ones that leave (Source: Lucky Bancho). Except, the old players are still here and make criticism about why they leave. The new players have no need to complain since the game is free and they have no investment.

2) A lack of places to talk publicly about the game. Balmung Ul'dah has a /shout chat that's similar to these forums in its opinion on the game, but conversation is filled with sex and ERP so you might have not seen it.

3) The "sweet and friendly" paradox. FFXIV has fostered a culture where people are extremely nice up-front due to the censorship from GMs and the overall need to be agreeable in order to make friends and do content. Negative comments are left to other sites like the forums. I have met some forum posters in-game and they have never said a negative thing about the game there. Of course, this is an anecdote, but it's just as true as yours.

4) You do not have a class that is level 90. This means that you don't have experience in endgame raiding or activities that other people do. You have nine years of mostly single-player, "solved" content to do by yourself to keep yourself occupied. Plenty to do. Once you finish it, then what? Perhaps a "break" to "play other games" like Yoshida suggests? Many of us have already taken a break. We pay monthly in the hopes that someday we can have something to do in our favorite video game, which is this one.

A single-player game is fun for your first play-through, but after you finish it, then it's over. Why are we required to pay monthly for this? We were lured to FFXIV in the hopes that it would be an online game similar to WoW, Fortnite, Minecraft, Apex, GW2, PSO2, OSRS, etc. that has a persistent online community. That's what it was from 2013-2022 before the big single-player shift. You don't know what that's like. Now we've lost our favorite game and many of us are still in shock and bewilderment that it could fall apart so quickly.

It takes a lot for us to piece our (personal) lives back together again. Eventually we will, and we'll leave this place so you can have the game all to yourself. While you idle and play other games, of course.

I'm not sure why you personally attacked me multiple times in your post. What did I do deserve that?

[caffe_macchiato]

I'm not sure why you personally attacked me multiple times in your post. What did I do deserve that?

You are not FFXIV. It's time that we realize our roles as consumers of a product made by a corporation for profit. If we fail to establish barriers between ourselves and the product, we become victim to a parasocial relationship whereby our money no longer has value.

As for #4, please refer to #1 for the definition of "churn" in this context. A player's longevity determines their position in the product lifecycle.

Shadowbringers already happened, and was massively Successful, contrary to any belief here on the Forums.

Shadowlands was notorious for encouraging players to play other games more so than any expansion prior. Sound familiar? Those who beg others to leave might have an issue when, seeing how Dragonflight is now, there isn't anyone left.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

Shadowlands was notorious for encouraging players to play other games more so than any expansion prior. Sound familiar? Those who beg others to leave might have an issue when, seeing how Dragonflight is now, there isn't anyone left.

Ok, FFXIV has been saying it for nearly a decade, and the game only grew.
What does WoW: Shadowlands failure have to do with FFXIV, which has only arguably had 1 bad Expansion, which WoW arguably had 4?
(I dont remember the actual number, but hey, people like to be dramatic now, and then in retrospect say it wasnt that bad / it was good)

[GaiusDrakon]

You are not FFXIV. It's time that we realize our roles as consumers of a product made by a corporation for profit. If we fail to establish barriers between ourselves and the product, we become victim to a parasocial relationship whereby our money no longer has value.

It's perfect really. The best way to succeed in a capitalist society as a corporation is to act like you're on the side of the consumers and pretend to be best buddies with them. Yoshi P is far better at this than most other devs. While many corporations fail at this and make cringe ads and what is obviously corporate virtue signaling (like all the Pride flags), sometimes there are savants that succeed and enrapture many fans.

Really you can't even blame these people, Yoshi P is too good at his job.

Maybe one day when consumers in the gaming space realize that corporations are your enemy and not your friend, we would get better quality products.

For now, we just have to watch these savvy firms manufacture an image of themselves as something beyond capitalism, selling products that are more than mere commodities to make customers feel like they're engaging in more than a transaction, and therefore willingly pay much more for much lower quality products.

It's not even ironic at this point to say that 80% of FF14 players are paypigs with Yoshi P as the findom papa.

[VelKallor]

It's perfect really. The best way to succeed in a capitalist society as a corporation is to act like you're on the side of the consumers and pretend to be best buddies with them.

Thats an overly cynical..id say even bitter and nihilistic approach. A corporation is not a living entity, it makes no independent judgements, that is the purview of those who work for it. I have seen many companies, large and small, new startups and established businesses.

Why does it actually surprise you that many try to do their best..their customers are what keeps them in business, in case you had forgotten.

Id also say this is a very limited worldview, as evidenced by the massive disparity in how employees are treated in the US vs the rest of the world.

Yoshi P is far better at this than most other devs. While many corporations fail at this and make cringe ads and what is obviously corporate virtue signaling (like all the Pride flags), sometimes there are savants that succeed and enrapture many fans.

I find no "virtue signaling" in pride flags whatsoever. If their policies are in line with that mindset, more power to them.

Really you can't even blame these people, Yoshi P is too good at his job. Maybe one day when consumers in the gaming space realize that corporations are your enemy and not your friend, we would get better quality products.

Thats an..odd..idea at best. I seem to recall that treating others as ones enemy tends to get in the way of any meaningful rapprochement..its counterproductive, in fact.

YoshiP has done a damned good job and I for one respect what he has done, no one is perfect , agreed, but to my mind at least, he has shown integrity and passion for the game, is well aware that this world of Eorzea exists because of us, the man is himself a gamer at heart.

For now, we just have to watch these savvy firms manufacture an image of themselves as something beyond capitalism, selling products that are more than mere commodities to make customers feel like they're engaging in more than a transaction, and therefore willingly pay much more for much lower quality products.

Yet FF 14 is a high quality game, well run, well supported and highly popular.

I see very little, if any , "low quality", as has been said no game is ever perfect ( if such a concept as a perfect game can even exist in the first place ), so I dont see how what we have ingame is any evidence of "low quality work"

[Shinkuno]

I see very little, if any , "low quality", as has been said no game is ever perfect ( if such a concept as a perfect game can even exist in the first place ), so I dont see how what we have ingame is any evidence of "low quality work"

If you cant see "low quality" then you are just a blind fanboy. Thats the truth. We have low quality textures and models. Low quality servers with low quality netcode. Low quality QOL with a low quality UI where every action needs 5 million confirm windows. Low quality casual content beyond "make it so easy even someone afk can do it". Theres nothing for people that want a bit of a challenge but dont want to / cant commit to savage.

Example: I loathed what Blizzard had done and I voted with my wallet. That IS the prerogative of every customer...so, by derivation, the fact the game is GROWING and so many new players are coming in, speaks volumes for the fact FF 14 has a broad appeal, which directly contradicts your narrative.
?

And we have even more people leaving. Its quite clear from all your replies here that you are a mad "WoW refugee" (god such a stupid term) but cant let go of your "the game i play is the best ever" attitude so you are completly in denial about the quality of the game.