Healer Suggestions Megathread

[Azurarok]

Here's a small idea for WHM I've been kicking around.

First, return the basic attack spell back to Earth aspected instead of Light.

When casting Stone, you have a small chance to proc a reworked Freecure

This Freecure lets the user cast Cure I with 0MP and no cast time (maybe also CureII with 0MP but still casted, like it does now?) and also grants a new status to the user.

Said new status turns your next Stone into Glare, which in this case would have double the potency of Stone.


That's basically it. It's pretty much a mini lily (a lil lily, if you will). The things this tries to cover are:
1. Make WHM more aesthetically varied and not just be a light mage
2. Add utility for mobility and some minor spot healing without losing dps or burning a lily
3. Give WHM an option other than Glare/Dia/Lilies to use on the GCD in content that typically don't have a need for casted heals.
4. Make freecure not largely useless, bringing it a little bit closer to a counterpart to BLM's firestarter/thundercloud.

Maybe this could be expanded to the other Cures/Medicas and Aero/Dia/Water/Holy in some form as well?

[Azurarok]

(Please excuse the double post)
The SGE I wish we had. Plays more like a phys range. I'm sure there's issues with it but I hope it gets the feel across at least.

Dosis/Dyskrasia puts a mini barrier on your Kardia target instead of healing, if that breaks there's a chance it procs Toxicon I. outside not using Addersting Toxicon I is pretty much the same as before, no extra damage in single target, heals the Kardia target, and is an instant cast. Soteria would add healing instead of making a bigger barrier with Dosis/Dyskrasia.

Eukrasian barriers breaking still grants Addersting, but it'll only be used for Toxicon II, which is a separate skill from Toxicon I with double the potency of Dosis to be dps neutral. Only usable right after Toxicon I and shares its button. Pepsis eating a Eukrasian barrier in battle would also grant an Addersting.

The Toxicon I proc rate does need to be often enough that you don't easily overcap on Addersting, but not so much that you can just spam E. Barriers (your MP wouldn't last anyways).

Phlegma comes with a guaranteed Toxicon I proc.

Pnuema actually hits as hard as it looks, then turns into an oGCD button while it's on cooldown that does the aoe heal part of it instead of going off at the same time. The Pneuma heal won't be usable with Zoe in this case, so if it needs to be made up for, it could also shorten some oGCD's recast, like Rhizomata, Zoe, or Pepsis.

The burst would then consist of Phlegma>Toxicon I>Toxicon II twice and a Pneuma, 7 GCDs with plenty of weave windows for healing. Since you can't dump 3 Addersting in the 20s buff window it should somewhat help it from becoming an excuse to not do barrier heals when it's actually needed too.

I think a big thing the role in general needs is more skills working off each other in more noticeable ways than just higher potency heals/mitigation. You only really get to appreciate the latter in high-end duties.

[IceBlueNinja]

I will do a small edit on my idea=not sure if i put them here already but here goes:

Taurochole= I just realize all this time how useless it is compared to kerachole since kerachole hits all your party for the 10% migi and at 76 kera also give regen, and kera last 15 seconds with a 30 second cool down which actually then is just 15 seconds. Change to a effect maybe that debuff the enemy like put a 10 seconds slow effect.


Soteria = aoe kardia effect

Pneuma= Am sorry but I must be the only wierdo that do not like this spell. Its good yes on pen and paper but its too niche for me like ast synastry because physis/kera/ixochole is already taking care of of abundance of heal checks I need. I just press it sometimes when I feel to push an extra button saying Kamehameha !!!!!!. Uh rework it to do something else or just remove the healing part of it and give it a nice 900 potency raw damage instead. Sage anyways was giving that feeling of the healer that should be doing massive damage more than the other healers anyways.

Toxicon= Remove the stupid barrier breaking requirement. Maybe after 3 uses of a E dosis or regular dosis it gives us a stack and buff up the potency as well as let it be like pvp toxicon that you can just smash it all without delay.

Zoe = is now 90 seconds base cool down with 60 seconds as the trait= I love to have this more to use for some big e diag/prog

E prog=potency is now 200 (with the removal of needing it for toxicon stacks I think its fair then to bump it up)

Pepsis=Sorry I know everyone is gonna get mad but just let it make us be able to spread a crit e diag.

hami/pani=cd is now 60 seconds= Sorry to sound jealous here but whm/ast lvl 70 job quest skill is 60 seconds only and schs is just on the go ready.

Incarus =Thanks SE for giving my dream wish to get a gap closer as a healer but please increase its range and change animation to do a fluent jump like BLM teleport

For all HEALERS can we please get our damn aoe at lvl 10? I hate getting things below lvl 46 and cant do nothing but be a heal bot at that point. Though sage edge is we have phelgma but still geez.

[Supersnow845]

I’m really not trying to start an argument about SGE VS SCH here iceblue but can you please explain your justification for why you want to take SCH’s probably most iconic skill and functionally just give it to SGE when the classes are already so similar

If you wanted to achieve something similar (functional mechanical cancelation by massive mitigation) why not do something like eukrasian pnuema giving a 30% mitigation, combine that with holos and you’d basically be doing what spreadlo does

Shouldn’t we be aiming for difference in the healers

[IceBlueNinja]

[QUOTE=Supersnow845;6417470]I’m really not trying to start an argument about SGE VS SCH here iceblue but can you please explain your justification for why you want to take SCH’s probably most iconic skill and functionally just give it to SGE when the classes are already so similar

Look sage is not fully scholar no matter how many times you or others say it, sure a few things is there but there are alot of differences on sage scholar.

Similar list:
E Diag/Alco
E prog/succor
Kera/Scared Soil
physis/whispering dawn
ixochole/sacred soil
Taurchole/Exgo=weaker potency but give a 10% migitation which imo is garbage and as I suggest should be rework because am better off using kerachole

Major differences:

Phelgma=sage has a aoe that is open at lvl 26 giving good damage aoe wise and primary target taking the full it has nothing to do with sch
zoe=pretty much a better dispate/illum giving 50% total to any gcd instead of just 30% and does not contain the 5% magic reduction
toxicon=higher potency than Energy drain but a major trap to make people play the job bad of spamming barriers
holos=way better than seraph with higher potency shield+added migitation to stack on kerachole already 10%
Krasis=this is a buff that you can put on a co healer or warrior/pld(gosh they love when I throw it on em) because it works on both healing type things+healing type actions which protraction cant be a comparison because it gives max HP increase.
rhizomata=I can only see this as a worst aether flow that I hardly if ever have to use which give only 1 measly addergall which I rather instead it gives a full stack of toxicon for more DPS to make sage be that intended healer that should be about mostly damage.
hami/pani=for sure unique and you can say whm literbell ability is a clone of this ability without the shield portion on theirs. Sch shields unless ET do not give burst stacks of heal if the shield is not fully consumed
incarus= I do believe this one has does not has to be explain.
Pneuma= Big heal with damage on the top where as expedience is a free sprint+ slight damage reduce for party in no way are these similar.

Alright my thing is am tired of this whole sage shields are weak thing, but here is the thing E diag is actually (if lucky crit with zoe anyways) is stronger than crit alco. So technically on a single shield aspect a sage win sch on that part.

Aoe wise which is E prog problem yeah the garbage 100 potency is not cutting it. I agree with you and than say lets scrap my idea of letting us have pepsis spread E diag so that yeah sge dont feel more sch clonish at but at least bump up the E diag potency shield to 250/300 like blue mages 250 healer stance gob skin.

Let me ask this, why make holos way stronger than E prog + even give it a 10% migi that can stack on keras 10% migi? So is it ok then I ask for E prog potency to be buffed and we still cant spread E diag to make it fair so that you can keep your unique ability? Side note I saw someone asking for gap closer which is one of sage unique abilty on sch why I even brought that part up of pepsis spreading E crit diag.

[IceBlueNinja]

These are the abilities that I compare:

Toxicon serves the niche of ruin 2.
Rhizomata is just recitation if you use it on aetherflow (which you usually do). Zoe is also similar, since crits are also ~50% buffs to GCD heals.
Haima and Panhaima are Seraphic Veil and Consolation.
Pneuma fits the niche of crit indoms to some extent.

Holos initially was just Fey Blessing but they buffed it and made it a pretty different. Now I compare it to deployment tactics/expedient.

Like yes, they have some differences, and in some ways you play them differently but you can see the similarities of the abilities right away. Other games would differentiate how healers play much more (you could also compare scholar to noct ast and see that the play style was much different). Or compare current white mage to Astro.

Really? when noct ast was a thing the way it was so bashed and hated and was ask to be removed which is finally is now yet now all of a sudden everyone is asking for it back there is never a satisfaction when it comes to ast, see the card dilemma atm. It was too had to handle stormblood ast now its too boring to handle EW ast. Its shields was whine about alot and like sage complained or weak/inferior they are compared to scholar even when in shb they improve it alot. There is always that set who is never gonna be happy. That part on rhizomata is not true because I barely if rarely have to use it unless its a situation where I got a sprout part or the average darknight eating my whole entire kit up with their lack of defenses.

[Supersnow845]

I’m not saying they are identical I am saying they are already far too similar (to me their big difference comes from how you prioritise heals because of energy drain), you are right phlegma and icarus are wholly unique and SCH’s closest equivalent to the pulsing shields is seraph (which is not very similar), unfortunately pnuema (though it has the advantage of being able to be buffed by Zoe) is functionally just critdom and krasis and protraction both do the same thing (protraction just trades lower healing up for a max HP up)

Regardless that’s not really the point as we both know, I actually agree SGE’s E prognosis should be stronger, succor is stronger but only because it has to be cast, holos being a stronger shield than e prognosis is a strange decision caused by knee jerk backlash to DSR which I’ve always said was a bad decision

I also wholly oppose a gap closer on SCH, that’s SGE’s niche and SCH has ruin 2 anyway

If they wanted to “fix the mitigation discrepancy” I’d give SGE a strong stackable mitigation and lean into SGE as the mitigation healer and SCH as the shield healer

[IceBlueNinja]

I’m not saying they are identical I am saying they are already far too similar (to me their big difference comes from how you prioritise heals because of energy drain), you are right phlegma and icarus are wholly unique and SCH’s closest equivalent to the pulsing shields is seraph (which is not very similar), unfortunately pnuema (though it has the advantage of being able to be buffed by Zoe) is functionally just critdom and krasis and protraction both do the same thing (protraction just trades lower healing up for a max HP up)

Regardless that’s not really the point as we both know, I actually agree SGE’s E prognosis should be stronger, succor is stronger but only because it has to be cast, holos being a stronger shield than e prognosis is a strange decision caused by knee jerk backlash to DSR which I’ve always said was a bad decision

I also wholly oppose a gap closer on SCH, that’s SGE’s niche and SCH has ruin 2 anyway

If they wanted to “fix the mitigation discrepancy” I’d give SGE a strong stackable mitigation and lean into SGE as the mitigation healer and SCH as the shield healer

I agree but the same can be said of ast/whm and people seem to not gloat or mention how they are the same of each other as bad as they do with the sge/sch which honestly makes 0 sense. Why should the pure healers get away with cloning similarities yet its a big issue sneezed at on shield healers? Hey look lets go off topic the crafter and gatherer classes are barely different from each other. Other than the burst Idea healer I thought of there honestly no way to make healers too different.

[Supersnow845]

I agree but the same can be said of ast/whm and people seem to not gloat or mention how they are the same of each other as bad as they do with the sge/sch which honestly makes 0 sense. Why should the pure healers get away with cloning similarities yet its a big issue sneezed at on shield healers? Hey look lets go off topic the crafter and gatherer classes are barely different from each other. Other than the burst Idea healer I thought of there honestly no way to make healers too different.

I also agree that WHM and AST are too similar on the healing front (though not as similar as SGE/SCH), I think people harp on about SGE more because it’s a new class they supposedly designed from the ground up and then released it with half its abilities being copies of SCH’s, it has its niches and unique abilities 100% but I think that’s what people get hung up on

WHM and AST also have the advantage of while their GCD’s are copy past their oGCD “bread and butter” heals are rather different, WHM focuses on its lilys while AST rotates CU, CO and star as its core healing, they really don’t have a lot of oGCD overlap (unlike say sacred soil, indom, whispering dawn, lustrate etc)

Don’t get me wrong I’m not arguing to not give spreadlo to SGE because I don’t like SGE, I’m arguing because I don’t want the classes to be even more similar, it’s why I also don’t want SCH to have a gap closer or pulsing shields