Healer Suggestions Megathread

[ty_taurus]

I wouldn't bet on it. The dev team has shown that they're not opposed to doubling down on something until they get so much negative attention that they have no choice but to reverse course. The 2 minute meta also makes job design very limited, thus easier for the small battle design team to handle, so I highly doubt that they'll move away from it, though I'd like to be pleasantly surprised.

I mean, I'm not expecting mountains to be moved or anything, but prior to EW, I feel like most criticism was more subversive and not particularly talked about outside of forums, but these criticisms of buff windows, homogenization, and the lack of strong content are a lot more discussed outside of forums throughout EW. Even if they were planning to do a 180, I wouldn't expect that to show until after EW anyway, and given how much SE doesn't like information to be shared until it's finalized, I wouldn't expect to hear anything about any course changes until the job changes liveletter anyway.

But prior to EW, we did see more sweeping changes from one expansion to the next. And while the current stance has not been great, I also can't imagine that every expansions from here on will just be stagnant.

[Aravell]

I mean, I'm not expecting mountains to be moved or anything, but prior to EW, I feel like most criticism was more subversive and not particularly talked about outside of forums, but these criticisms of buff windows, homogenization, and the lack of strong content are a lot more discussed outside of forums throughout EW. Even if they were planning to do a 180, I wouldn't expect that to show until after EW anyway, and given how much SE doesn't like information to be shared until it's finalized, I wouldn't expect to hear anything about any course changes until the job changes liveletter anyway.

But prior to EW, we did see more sweeping changes from one expansion to the next. And while the current stance has not been great, I also can't imagine that every expansions from here on will just be stagnant.

As I said, I'd like to be pleasantly surprised, but there's no denying that they've been extremely tone-deaf towards healers this expansion.
-"We don't know what to do with SCH"
-"Go play ultimates and suffer"
-Literally everything about AST design

And my personal favourite from pre-ShB
-"WHM usually handles the bulk of the healing while SCH just casts damage spells"

I can't say my hopes are elevated by how they're ignoring their DPS golden child as well, all the SAMs and RDMs that are unhappy. I'd say the only chance you'd be getting any sort of positive change at this point is if you're a WAR.

[Supersnow845]

As I said, I'd like to be pleasantly surprised, but there's no denying that they've been extremely tone-deaf towards healers this expansion.
-"We don't know what to do with SCH"
-"Go play ultimates and suffer"
-Literally everything about AST design

And my personal favourite from pre-ShB
-"WHM usually handles the bulk of the healing while SCH just casts damage spells"

I can't say my hopes are elevated by how they're ignoring their DPS golden child as well, all the SAMs and RDMs that are unhappy. I'd say the only chance you'd be getting any sort of positive change at this point is if you're a WAR.

Is there anyone besides WAR who is actually getting positive changes this expansion

[Supersnow845]

ShB->EW is probably the one time they didn’t make sweeping changes between two expansions (I guess you could argue ARR->HW didn’t change job philosophy very much) and it has gotten a lot of pushback (I almost said “it’s safe to say it’s not popular” but I won’t be the victim of a shot taken because I vaguely mentioned a majority) and a huge amount of criticism

The people who still remember anything older than 5.0 are a vanishing minority at this point (someone on r/talesfromdf got massively upvoted saying that bension never had anything to do with lilies while I got downvoted trying to explain old WHM), it’s hard to determine how much of the criticism about the current job design comes from that minority and how much is people who’ve only ever known the new system not liking it but I think it is safe to say this is the last “chance” to change it, if DT is ShB 3.0 then it will become obvious they never intend to divert from the current formula

[Supersnow845]

Great we got some corrections for skills that have been problems since ShB, fantastic work

Have we got any changes that aren’t just changes we’ve asked for for like 4 years now

[Hammerhorn]

Give healers each a DPS combo that does either a group HOT or group shield at the end of the 1 2 3 but make it one button like Confietor that would be a good start. It would then feel the same as spamming Broil or Glare but you could remove the hard cast version of the spell and add another OGCD or a second Combo of some sorts. This wouldnt be too radical to start with and would still "feel" like the same job associated with it. I think all heals cast should do damage just adjust those heals to be low trickles to stay balanced.

[Shurrikhan]

Give healers each a DPS combo that does either a group HOT or group shield at the end of the 1 2 3 but make it one button like Confietor that would be a good start.

Lost me at that "each". If you feel like a gimmick with relatively little control (your filler now blends in AoE sustain without control, and has to be used 3 GCDs at a time, leaving you little ability to react with GCDs if damage intake were ever increased) compared to its button cost HAS to be given to EACH healer... that's a good sign you'll want to rethink that.

It would then feel the same as spamming Broil or Glare but you could remove the hard cast version of the spell and add another OGCD or a second Combo of some sorts. This wouldnt be too radical to start with and would still "feel" like the same job associated with it. I think all heals cast should do damage just adjust those heals to be low trickles to stay balanced.

So, what is the actual benefit, though? To be locked into one's combos? If they don't lock anyways, then is it just to triple the button cost of filler spam and balance raid damage around the addition of that HoT or shield being added (replacing itself) every 7.5 seconds?

You're having to point out that it wouldn't cost us what feels unique to each job, but what does it do to enhance that uniqueness? Given the button-cost, it ought to produce some substantial increase to engagement and/or job identity.

Honestly though, by being applied to each Healer equally... I doubt it'd do much relative to cost.

[ASkellington]

Give healers each a DPS combo that does either a group HOT or group shield at the end of the 1 2 3 but make it one button like Confietor that would be a good start.

No it wouldn't. We want less homogenization on healers not more. All 4 don't need a DPS combo that amounts to a Continuation (to use GNB as an example) and they all certainly don't need a HoT or Shield each. Doubly so as they all have at least 1 oGCD to heal with. (Assize is an oGCD right?)

If we're going to add more dps to healers they should 1 - fit the theme of the healer in question and 2 - not all be exactly the same. MNK is different to DRG who's different to RPR for example. Yeah all three have a combo but DRG iirc has a branching option (a 4 if you will) and MNK has a 4 5 6 that you want to use depending on if your self buff or DoT needs to be refreshed.

For example, SGE has Toxicon. They could apply a debuff or "shield" if you will to the enemy that when broken by allies could grant them an Addersting. Maybe even buff the the dps Toxicon does. That way they have two ways to apply and gain Toxicon.

AST could have a compile like Earthly Star is that does damage only (likely meaning that the heal and damage part of ES is going to be split if that happens however - not my ideal choice) on a shorter recast (like 15-20s maybe?)

SCH... I mean Miasma and Bane are likely still in the game's code (at least Bane is if PvP's Deployment is anything to go by). Maybe another virus like DoT? Or perhaps for each one applied SCH does extra damage to its target since you're weakening them?

WHM... I can see having a combo rotation but what would be the point of it? Like, if WHM were to get it say, would it mean changing lilies to where said rotation contributes to them for you to then spend to get the Blood Lily or would it straight up contribute to the Blood Lily? If it does the latter then what would be the point of Lilies? (and to clarify NO I would not want the possible rotation to aid in getting the Blood Lily directly; I like the idea of rewarding healing that the lily system has) Further, WHM is already heavily on the GCD in comparison to its counterparts. Wouldn't giving it a combo even with its current casting time or with a melee cast time cause issues (especially for newer players)?

If we weren't going to give WHM a combo rotation... well if you want to throw balance out the window could give WHM another attack like Holy for single target but instead of applying a stun it applies... a damage down for example that can be reapplied and like Holy eventually the target becomes immune to it. Or well and there's Aero III.

Anyway you get the point.

[AnotherPerson]

Give healers each a DPS combo that does either a group HOT or group shield at the end of the 1 2 3 but make it one button like Confietor that would be a good start. It would then feel the same as spamming Broil or Glare but you could remove the hard cast version of the spell and add another OGCD or a second Combo of some sorts. This wouldnt be too radical to start with and would still "feel" like the same job associated with it. I think all heals cast should do damage just adjust those heals to be low trickles to stay balanced.

Sorry but I want 4 different types of healer gameplay, not 1 healer reskinned 4 times. It's already bad enough that every healer basically just plays 1 DoT and 1 nuke for the most part. Having a 1-2-3 combo does nothing to change that, especially if all healers got the same exact skill upgrade as well. It just defeats the purpose other than further homogenization.

[ForsakenRoe]

WHM - Bursty, any DOTs it has are short duration/hard hitting to fit into this 'bursty' feel (eg, dot is no longer than 15s)
SCH - DOT centric, should have 3 or 4 DOTs in it's kit that are used as part of the 'main rotation' (so, 'Miasma 2 but it's only used for mobility' does not count)
AST - Big focus on cards and buffing allies, make the effects of the cards be varied again, give them all different flavours of 'do damage' to balance them and have the additional effects as 'bonus on top'
SGE - Actual damage>healing rotation, can keep Prognosis as the 'i scuffed my rotation and need something to spam while i stabilize the situation' move, but the main way to heal should be from using your damage>heal mechanic

Having all 4 healers get a flavor of '123 combo, but it's all on one button, and it applies Medica 2 at the end of the combo' is not going to be a good start. It'd be, quite possibly, the worst possible start. It'd make it so that you auto-heal the group by doing your rotation, so you need even less focus on 'actually healing'. It's still one button being spammed for the whole fight, unless you give it a CD, in which case... why does it need to be a combo? Doesn't make sense to me, but maybe I'm biased since I have a horse in the 'redesign race', as it were