Healer Suggestions Megathread

[Katish]

I had that idea for Sage myself a few pages back if you're interested in how I went about my proposed healer changes. The big thing I wanted was to also have the healing spells synergize with the damage spells so that it was safer to cut out a lot of the oGCD heals by having the GCD heals be mostly damage neutral similar to WHM currently, but having them all do it just a little differently and complementary to their damage kits.

Sounds nice, I'll give it a read. I've been advocating much of the same in a previous post when suggesting healer attacks incorporate healing in some way or vice versa as a possible solution to satisfy both parties.

[ForsakenRoe]

The only upside a 123 combo has is to gate resource generation. MCH only generates Battery Gauge from it's 3, for example. Having it's filler be 111 instead of 123 doesn't work out for that, because then you have to either have it generate Battery with RNG (35% chance to generate, for example), or a weird split (atm it'd be 3.3333 gauge per GCD), or god forbid, making it a normal number after the division (5 instead of 3.3333) and then you're generating more resource than expected and other parts of the rotation have to be adjusted

Proc based gameplay for healers is likely a lot better. We're already meant to be 'reacting to damage' to heal people (lol) so 'react to procs for your damage' just fits better I think. By procs, I mean 'press this, receive X ready proc', not 'you have a 25% chance when you press Glare to have some other GCD light up ala dancer'. Better yet, a 'best of both worlds' where you don't have to use X ready statuses, and instead just have hard-CD GCDs. A GCD with a 20s CD, another with a 15s CD, etc

[Shurrikhan]

The only upside a 123 combo has is to gate resource generation. MCH only generates Battery Gauge from it's 3, for example. Having it's filler be 111 instead of 123 doesn't work out for that, because then you have to either have it generate Battery with RNG (35% chance to generate, for example), or a weird split (atm it'd be 3.3333 gauge per GCD), or god forbid, making it a normal number after the division (5 instead of 3.3333) and then you're generating more resource than expected and other parts of the rotation have to be adjusted

I mean, they literally could just not multiply all values by 5 for no discernible reason and use a lower gauge maximum accordingly.

(After all, we still have gauges with such strange non-100 maximum values as... 3, 4, and 5.)


To use Battery as an example:

Battery takes 10 combos (30 GCDs) to fully charge without CDs. They could as easily do that as 1 Battery per shot, 2 Battery every other shot, or 3 Battery every 3rd shot, with a maximum gauge of 30. Air Anchor and Chainsaw would each grant 6. Voila; you can do whatever you please with the rhythm of battery generation without any ugly numbers or any balance changes at all.

[Renathras]

A quick commission, as it were:

Been playing around with PLD a bit more doing some stuff, and I've found I really actually like it. So, the idea, since this seems to be a thread of people talking about rotation ideas and such and no one wants to do it in the thread about that topic, so I thought I'd ask it here:

Can someone come up with a WHM rotation that is basically PLD's current rotation? (Ideally without Goring Blade and without FoF/Req being separate buttons, since that's just stupid as there's never a time you'd use them separately...) Like, the reverse of "If Tanks had Healer rotations", instead "If Healers had Tank rotations"? Obviously, Healers are caters, so at range, but the idea behind PLD's rotation I like. It's simple, but flexible.

People like acting like WHM is a BLM, but WHM has a lot in common with PLD, and originally, PLD required 15 CNJ levels (I can't remember if WHM required 15 GLD levels or not...)

Anyway, I happen to LIKE PLD's rotation, so wondering what a WHM with a PLD-ish rotation would look like.

.

In fact, since the topic DID come up about Tank vs Healer rotations in Ty's thread, what would all the Healers look like with one?

Which Tank would you think that each Healer's would/should most look like?

I'd think...

PLD/WHM (both Holy, that aside, straightforward and direct),
GNB/SGE (rigid, "DPS-lite", technical),

...not sure about the others. DRK/AST both have a busy burst and more lax maintenance, so that could work. Is SCH really like WAR, though.......?

.

Anyway, so two questions:

1) What would a WHM having a rotation equivalent to PLD (1-2-3, 4-4-4, -5 somewhere in there; burst phase of 6-7-7-7-7) ?
2) Which Tanks should each Healer be modeled after/closest to in its hypothetical rotation?

[Shurrikhan]

Can someone come up with a WHM rotation that is basically PLD's current rotation? (Ideally without Goring Blade and without FoF/Req being separate buttons, since that's just stupid as there's never a time you'd use them separately...)

If you don't mind my not going out of my way to restrict it / dumb it down, and only instead not adding any complexity to it despite all the low-hanging fruit...

Start with Earth / Water / Air (use all 3, any order, each buffs the next in some way, accumulating potency); doing all three grants a Coalescence, which augments a GCD heal or Holy and grants access to Glare x3, which hit for the accumulated raw potency of your elemental combo's finisher; you Glare x3, repeat. Your 1-minute CD is Seraph Strike, which augments your Earth / Water / Air skills into empowered version with AoE falloff (Quake, Deluge, Tempest) and replaces Seraph Strike itself with Forced Transcendence, a massive hit that can benefit from the affinities of your most recent (enhanced) elemental spell.

Your opener, then, is an elemental cast or two as you wait for raid buffs, Seraph, your 4 post-Seraph GCDs, then finish your first combo as necessary, then alternate elemental combo and Glare combo. Repeat per minute.

Voila. It's still as dull as modern PLD, but at least its animations are far more varied than WHM's and its combo buttons at least aren't an utter waste of space.

/~50 seconds


* (Since FoF isn't separate from Req, per your orders, there's also no point in having it, as you'd only ever use it at the same times you'd already have done so for raid buffs. It'd just be a bloat action that at best penalizes Spell Speed until 11.2% Haste, while doing far less for solo play than the Req window ever could.)

[Renathras]

...

This seems vaguely similar to my post here: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6280577

But yeah, that could work. A few minor things:

1) The any order doesn't make too much since, as PLD's 1-2-3 isn't any order. Also, trying to make this work (again, see that post) via "X Ready" abilities, it's actually really weird to make three abilities that get to the same result in any order, which is why I settled for a "nudge into the correct order to get the person back on track" system since - call it "braindead" if you want - it seemed the most straightforward way to resolve the problem. That said, if there's a good way to do it, "use in any order" is simpler, so I'm fine with it...

2) Presence of Mind. PoM is our FoF on WHM. Could give it a +X% healing/damage buff and a 60 sec CD, but that's the self-buff trigger for WHM's burst right now, so using it for that should work.

3) Please no Seraph Strike. No melee abilities on a caster. I don't know why there's so much push for this lately, but I still liked the days of MMOs where Casters/Healers were considered ranged classes and the point was for them not to engage in melee, not to try/have to do so. I think PoM can be this trigger, though.

4) Flood and Tornado. I believe Quake, Flood, and Tornado are the high level Stone, Water, and Aero spells, generally.

5) I hadn't thought of using Glare like that. 100% approve.

.

Taken together:

Combo: Stone, Water, Aero (my own idea was that they have different cast times of 2, 1.5, and Instant, respectively, to mirror SMN a bit and also to make them feel different to cast; Stone is heavy, Water is fluid, Aero is light, could even have Aero and/or Water have a slight DoT attached that is automatically refreshed when doing the rotation, like DRG's is). Each complete Combo grants 1x empowered Holy (Holy Spirit - needs Holy to be usable at range for this to work, but that's something I've proposed before and so I think is a great idea) + 3x Glares (Atonement). 1 min burst is PoM, "Confetior/Swords" combo of Quake, Flood, and Tornado (using the Stone, Water, and Aero buttons) and then resume your normal rotation, already in progress.

In my specific case, I also made all GCD heals damage neutral via Lilies, instead of having Solace/Rapture as separate buttons, they're just Cure 2 and Medica since...that's what they are. Instead of consuming Lilies, they generate them, and three gives a damage neutral cast (can be Misery or empowered Holy, depending on what that is), and you can stack two "Blood Lilies" (like how Polyglot on BLM stacks to 2)

It's not quite PLD but close enough.

I'd find that acceptable.

Add two buttons (Dia being replaced with Stone, Water, Aero), take away three (Solace, Rapture, Cure 1 since it traits up to Cure 2), and I'd call that a win, personally.

[Shurrikhan]

This seems vaguely similar to my post here: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6280577

But yeah, that could work. A few minor things:

1) The any order doesn't make too much since, as PLD's 1-2-3 isn't any order.

You literally have to purposely reduce complexity and waste any point in having those as separate buttons to imitate that constraint. There's no point in doing so.

Presence of Mind. PoM is our FoF on WHM.

It's not. The gameplay point of a damage window is that it accentuates ppgcd variance, giving it an optimal sync (and therefore less optimal syncs).

PoM can have this be a Ley Lines where it may allow for one or two additional GCDs fall within a damage window (raid buffs, in BLM's case), but that requires that your ppgcd average changes noticeably over the difference of a mere couple GCDs. Even with the ramping combo ppgcd, this would not be that, because the significant portions would fall into even 15s raid buffs regardless.

Note also that I didn't remove PoM. It's still there. It's just not a FoF, nor would that kit's gameplay benefit from an FoF unless flexible and forced to stagger from Seraph Strike.

No melee abilities on a caster.

It's a name. It doesn't have to be melee. Call it just Seraphim or Seraph Blast instead, if you prefer. I would have specified if a job whose every ST action was ranged was getting a melee action.

Flood and Tornado.

Sure. As long as they're each a different name from the base versions and imply greater power.

It's not quite PLD but close enough.

Again, the disclaimer was right at the top. I'm not about to go additional design distance just to dumb things down.

I also made all GCD heals damage neutral via Lilies, instead of having Solace/Rapture as separate buttons, they're just Cure 2 and Medica since...that's what they are.

So... that'd be OP af the moment healing requirements increase.

Lilies are CDs. The reason they can be damage-neutral, acting as your 3 WHMflowgall charges per minute, is because you get only 3 per minute.

Make Lilies spammable, and you effectively have unlimited single-weave Lustrate/Indomitability spam until you run out of MP (which supports a quite a lot more than 3 charges per minute, and easily up to some 14 charges at a time from max MP), so long as you throw in a Misery every 4th GCD.

[ty_taurus]

A quick commission, as it were:

So this is a kinda weird idea I've had for a little while also inspired by FF7 Remake. I really can't tell how this would feel without being able to test it, but I'd be very curious to try something like this. It'll be a little different than Paladin exactly, but would have a similar structure/feel.

DPS Concept

Spark - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 180. Instant Cast with a 1.5 second GCD timer. (This has the White Mage fling little bolts of light magic at the enemy, based on Aerith's basic attacks)
Tempest - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 200 to your target and 50% less to all nearby enemies; this increases to 400 to your target and 50% less to all nearby enemies after 3 casts of Spark (This combo cannot be broken by any GCD action). 1.5 second cast on a normal GCD timer. Grants 1 Confession (max 3)
Stone/Glare - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 150; consumes 1 Confession to increase the potency to 350. 1.5 second cast time on a normal GCD timer.
Aero/Dia - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 100 to your target and all nearby enemies; consumes 1 Confession to apply 3 stacks of Sanction to your main target (no duration) and 1 stack of Sanction on all other enemies (Each enemy can have a max of 5 stacks). Instant cast on a normal GCD timer. Each stack of Sanction inflicted by you detonates to deal unaspected damage with a potency of 100 every time you cast Glare, Dia, Ablution, or any healing spell. (1 Stack detonates per cast)
Water/Ablution - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 100 to your target and 50% less to all nearby enemies; consumes 1 Confession to increase this to 300 potency and 50% less to all nearby enemies. Grants 30 seconds of Flow which can be extended to as much as 60 seconds. Flow grants a 5% increase to your damage and enables the generation of lilies, your lilies do not grow without Flow (think of it as watering your flowers).
Holy - GCD Spell; becomes ranged and deals unaspected damage with a potency of 820 for the first enemy and 50% less for all nearby enemies. 2.5 second cast time on a normal GCD timer. Costs 1 Blood Lily and changes into Afflatus Misery.
Afflatus Misery - GCD Spell; deals unaspected damage with a potency of 930 for the first enemy and 50% less for all nearby enemies. Instant cast on a normal GCD timer. (Used after holy, similar to Red Mage's Verflare/holy > Scortch or a simplified Confiteor combo)
Hydration - GCD Spell; Grants yourself Flow for 30 seconds; instant cast with a 4 second GCD timer. (Used to maintain flow when there's nothing to target but the elongated GCD means you don't really use this during combat).

Other Notes
- Cure spells also grant Confession stacks. They are still a loss of DPS, but you effectively always are getting some amount of refunds. And afflatus spells are still meant to be neutral.
- We add a lily spender that restores your own MP and convert Divine Benison and Aquaveil into Afflatus Aquaveil as a GCD mitigation tool that also consumes a lily.
- Instead of lily spenders nourishing the blood lily, the blood lily is nourished whenever a lily is gained. You still need to use lilies so you can continue nourishing the blood lily, but it means you don't necessarily need to waste healing resources during downtime if you have more lilies to generate.
- When you have 3 lilies, Flow will work toward generating a 4th similar to Black Mage's Enochian. If you do not spend your third by the time the counter fills, it simply refreshes itself.
- I'm honestly not sure if the Holy/Misery dual finisher maths out correctly. It's something I'd really want to test in build to actually ensure the numbers feel right because of the change to WHM's filler, but the objective is for it to still be neutral with the lliy healing/support you will naturally need to engage with.

Gameplay Notes
- The change to Dia creates a much softer "DoT" experience since you're no longer constrained to time down to the second. You simply reapply stacks whenever they run out.
- Your Single Target combo would look like this: Spark > Spark > Spark > Tempest > (Glare/Dia/Ablution as needed). Glare, Dia, and Ablution are effectively like Attonement, but with choices to make that are all pretty easy. Applying Sanction with Dia and managing Flow are both very flexible effects since they aren't reapply on cooldown type actions; you can overlap them to some degree. You can also store several Confessions, and nothing ever breaks the Sparkx3 > Tempest combo, so it's all very fluid and easy to stay on top of.
- I went with Spark having a short GCD based on the visual reference of Aerith flinging bolts of magic with her staff, but if that feels too complicated or weird, we can also easily adjust numbers and make it a normal 2.5 second GCD, perhaps bringing it down to 2 Sparks into Tempest instead. We don't have to commit to any specific interpretation.

It's a little experimental, but I think it would feel good to play with for a wider audience of players. Everything's very flexible, but still engages with light decision making elements that keep it feeling active and approachable at the same time. It probably would need a really thorough balance assessment, but numbers are very easy to adjust. And we would definitely try to cater the rest of the kit around this to ensure it doesn't feel like it has button bloat, while still offering the resources it needs to stay competitive with the other healers and the content.

EDIT: Meant to add that you can hold 3 Confessions so you don't need to use Glare/Dia/Ablution immediately after Tempest. You can hold them and use them at any point.

[TheDustyOne]

I've made a few changes to my WHM rework based on the feedback I got all the way back then on like page 2, and because I feel I've gotten better at this. The rotation is changed as a result, and I'll probably need a new flowchart for it. Full moveset is here:

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post6261020

Stone IV
200 MP -- Spell -- 2.5s Cast Time
Deals earth aspected damage with a potency of 300
Grants a stack of Justification while under the effect of Baptism, up to a maximum of 5 stacks

Stone is now the filler spell instead of Glare and grants a stack of Justification, a new mechanic that's in theme with the other procs. After 3 uses you can use Glare, which has moved to be a powerful finisher-type spell. Cast time is to emphasize WHM as a 'turret' healer.

Water IV
400 MP -- Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time
Deals water aspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 250 for the first enemy and 60% less for all remaining enemies
Grants the effect of Baptism, increasing damage dealt and healing magic potency by 10%, 15s, up to a maximum of 30s
*Becomes Banish under the effect of Sanctification*

I didn't like how the initial Water spell was opener only and was only really going to be used under niche Swiftcast optimization. It's now the primary spell for Baptism rather than Stone being the refresh. Can also be used for creating a weave window.

Banish
0 MP -- Spell -- 0s Cast Time
Deals unaspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 450 for the first enemy and 60% less for all remaining enemies.
Increases the Baptism timer by 15s, up to a maximum of 30s
Nourishes the Blood Lily
Grants a stack of Justification while under the effect of Baptism, up to a maximum of 5 stacks
*Can only be used under the effect of Sanctification*
*Cannot be placed on the hotbar*

Banish now grants a Justification stack as part of its partial 'refund' effect.

Aero IV
400 MP -- Spell -- 0s Cast Time
Deals wind aspected damage with a potency of 70
Wind aspected damage over time with a potency of 70, 21s, cannot be stacked with Dia
*Becomes Dia under the effect of Purification*

Minor changes to duration and potency, slightly stronger, but the extra GCD time between uses is to help balance better with the other healer reworks I made.

Dia
0 MP -- Spell -- 0s Cast Time
Deals unaspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 270 for the first and 60% less for all remaining enemies
Unaspected damage over time with a potency of 70, 21s, cannot be stacked with Aero IV
Nourishes the Blood Lily
Grants a stack of Justification while under the effect of Baptism, up to a maximum of 5 stacks
*Can only be used under the effect of Purification*
*Cannot be placed on the hotbar*

Potency changes to line up with the Aero changes, and Justification as part of the partial refund.

Glare
3 Justification -- Spell -- 3s Cast Time
Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 480
Can only be used while under the effect of Baptism

Glare is now a finisher spell of sorts. Swiftcast usage can still be a damage gain in optimized settings.

*Stone III*
300 MP -- Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time
Deals earth aspected damage to all nearby enemies with a potency of 140
Grants a stack of Justification while under the effect of Baptism, up to a maximum of 5 stacks
Stun, 4s

New AoE filler spell to go with the Justification mechanic. Replaces the stun on Holy III

Holy III
3 Justification -- Spell -- 2.5s Cast Time
Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 200 to all nearby enemies
Can only be used under the effect of Baptism
Stun, 4s

Big change to Holy, it is now a finisher spell in AoE for the Justification mechanic. I opted for Glare and Holy to be distinct instead of combined since I wanted to keep the AoE combo risky and point blank, but with shorter casts to make up for it, while ST is still fully ranged.

Afflatus Misery
3 Blood Lilies -- Spell -- 0s Cast time
Deals unaspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 600 for the first enemy, and 75% less for all remaining enemies
Grants 2 stacks of Justification while under the effect of Baptism, up to a maximum of 5

Misery now gives the final missing Justification stacks from the lost Stone casts. Make sure not to overcap them.

Protect is removed

Going off of what Roe said, and I can agree, it's better to have the mitigation be a part of an oGCD rather than the GCD, not to mention keeping up a permanent 10% mitigation was too trivial with Protect as spammable.

Temperance
Ability -- 120s Recast
Increases healing action potency by 20%, 20s
Reduces damage taken by self and nearby party members by 10%

Temperance is back, now that Protect is gone, it needs to be back, and with it Divine Seal is upgraded. Cooldown is back to 120s

Plenary Indulgence
Ability -- 60s Recast
Grants Confession to self and nearby party members
Upon receiving HP recovery via Cure III or Regen III cast by self, Confession triggers an additional healing effect with a potency of 200, 10s
Reduces damage taken by self and nearby party members by 10%

Plenary has been buffed and now also provides a mitigation effect. Cooldown is back to 60s, but the duration is also reduced to 10s.

[Aravell]

Recalling back before the launch of EW, Yoshi P mentioned that they're adding an extra thing for healers to manage, we now know he meant stuff like Aquaveil, Protraction and Exaltation. But that gave me some ideas, what if it was something different? Every example skill given will be on the GCD:

WHM
Thorns: [1s cast] [2.5s recast] [25s CD] Applies a buff on target ally which causes the next 4 hits taken to reflect damage equivalent to 80 potency.

SCH
Focus Fire Tactics: [1.5s cast] [2.5s recast] [30s CD] Attacks an enemy for 100 potency and grants a buff to all nearby allies in a 15y radius that causes their next attack to echo for a guaranteed critical 30 potency damage.

AST
Crossed Fates: [Instant cast] [2.5s recast] [40s CD] Applies a buff to selected ally that allows them to receive the very next card effect applied as if it was also applied to them directly. (So if you apply this buff to a ranged job and your very next card used is Balance on a melee, the ranged job will gain 3%)

SGE
(Idk what to name this): [Instant cast] [1s recast] Sends a noulith to a selected ally, granting them a buff that enhances their next 5 attacks with 65 potency of damage and also granting them a buff that causes the next Eukrasian Diagnosis to also apply to them at 50% of the effect (Both buffs last 30s, ability cannot be used again unless both buffs are consumed or timed out).