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  1. #1
    Player
    ty_taurus's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Limsa Lominsa
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    3,647
    Character
    Noah Orih
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 90
    I don't like how even a level 1 pugilist, for example, has like 200 HP and 10000 MP. Even if it's ultimately arbitrary, I'd like if MP maybe started at 100, and through traits, would increase in flat values for casters, Paladin, and Dark Knight, and what you could do is have the abilities that cost MP increase in cost, but not by as much. So for example, if healers have 100 MP at level 1, and maybe it increases to 500 at level 15, Raise at level 12 costs 100 MP--all of your MP, but only increases to 360 MP when your max increases to 500, and so on until it's 2400 cost for 10000 total, or something to that nature. It's entirely unnecessary, but it would just look better I feel.
    (2)

  2. #2
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
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    Sep 2011
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    12,966
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ty_taurus View Post
    I don't like how even a level 1 pugilist, for example, has like 200 HP and 10000 MP.
    Well, I mean, it's really just 100.00% MP. We don't have actual MP values anymore.

    Which, while smoother and more aesthetically pleasing, seems a shame given what prospects it then removes.
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    vetch's Avatar
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    Aug 2022
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    back on my free trial account
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    462
    Character
    Discount Hrothgar
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    Botanist Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by ty_taurus View Post
    I don't like how even a level 1 pugilist, for example, has like 200 HP and 10000 MP. Even if it's ultimately arbitrary, I'd like if MP maybe started at 100, and through traits, would increase in flat values for casters, Paladin, and Dark Knight, and what you could do is have the abilities that cost MP increase in cost, but not by as much. So for example, if healers have 100 MP at level 1, and maybe it increases to 500 at level 15, Raise at level 12 costs 100 MP--all of your MP, but only increases to 360 MP when your max increases to 500, and so on until it's 2400 cost for 10000 total, or something to that nature. It's entirely unnecessary, but it would just look better I feel.
    I disagree that it's unneccessary. Creating a feeling of getting more powerful and capable beyond just 'got new gear with bigger number' is very necessary for a fun RPG experience.
    (3)
    he/him

  4. #4
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
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    Sep 2011
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    12,966
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    So, this is just an aside again, but...

    One thing I'd like to see MP used for is in a context where...
    • nearly every primary stat is worthwhile for nearly every job (at least up to a point),

    • max MP is variable (your effects/actions, not just stats, may increase your max MP),

    • many skills may consume up to a certain % of current MP, for scaled effect (thereby increasing their maximum effect as your max MP increases),

    • :: as such, rather than MP being purely a starvation mechanic, the lower your %MP, the lower your potency, but the lower your MP costs and sustainability, since your regen rates would remain at max regardless),

    • Weakness/Brink of Death are replaced with a simple decrease of max MP (in turn decreasing regen and the effect of MP buffs, etc.), atop your current %MP being reduced to almost nothing (which then has an impact on your effectiveness)...

    • ...maaaayybbee the base GCD would be considerably lower, but with the combination of MP efficiency [slow down a bit] and combos [but not too much / not too slow] essentially keeping you to a variable average GCD-length rotations for sustain (I feel like I'll probably put that on Stamina [SP], though, in place of TP -- shorter-term and consumable on physical utility functions like Sprint for variable expenditure/drain rates based on frequency of use, or likewise having its maximum reducible by overuse, restoring to normal over time),

    • and maybe HP would have sort of a mirror of the above, with max HP likewise being reduced (perhaps slowly/inefficiently restorable via overhealing) from overexpenditure / high damage taken / being reduced to very low health -- as to make mitigation/dodging feel more rewarding without hugely increasing the number of one-shots...

    • (But somehow without the problems of high-max-MP people simply Manashifting their MP to low MP people, maybe because magical potency would be separate from physical, which would in turn be more affected by short-term things like Stagger. Still working on that, though it doesn't seem like it should be too big an issue.)

    That said, that feels like it'd want some further context, and I'd really need to finish that mock-up for this to make much sense. It's involved with the customization system (diverse jobs and being able to mix-and-match) mentioned before, though.
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player
    TheDustyOne's Avatar
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    Nov 2021
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    660
    Character
    Dusty Two
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    I'm curious about how Astros here would feel if Draw became a trait. We always have a card drawn, and the cooldown was moved to Play instead. It frees up a button, reduces the amount of weaving needed (especially double weaves in openers), and still keeps similar functionality. I know it would screw with the current opener and Astrodyne, but I'm curious what people think about the idea.
    (4)

  6. #6
    Player
    ty_taurus's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Limsa Lominsa
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    3,647
    Character
    Noah Orih
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDustyOne View Post
    I'm curious about how Astros here would feel if Draw became a trait. We always have a card drawn, and the cooldown was moved to Play instead. It frees up a button, reduces the amount of weaving needed (especially double weaves in openers), and still keeps similar functionality. I know it would screw with the current opener and Astrodyne, but I'm curious what people think about the idea.
    I literally mentioned the exact same thing in another thread actually as something I was thinking of too, but also that your gauge would also show you the next 2 cards you’ll after after your current one. Or that Draw is a GCD action that adds “card play” stacks which are a resource needed to play all cards. Play is still OGCD but you need card play stacks in order to use them.
    (3)

  7. #7
    Player
    TheDustyOne's Avatar
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    Nov 2021
    Posts
    660
    Character
    Dusty Two
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Alright, here's what I've got for Astro for my Yet Another Astrologian Rework™, I'm very much open to changes here, especially in regards to card effects and to the use of the old Sects (which are now swappable mid-combat).

    The aim of this rework was to put more emphasis on the time-based elements of Astrologian, bring back unique buffs and effects on cards, and make the main healing spells more desirable and fun to use.

    This healer rework will be the lightest on the amount of new attacks, with only 2 new GCD spells and one new oGCD to interact with them. The new mechanics are Favor stacks proced by Malefic, which allow the use of Fall Malefic, Doomsday from the new Comet spell, a delayed effect which causes a comet to fall on the target after 19s, and Temporal Tragedia, which detonates and speeds up Combust and Comet. Hopefully this won't be too hectic and I'm fine with removing Fall Malefic to keep the damage kit simple. Cards do enough to make Astros lack of damage exciting regardless.

    Anyway, let's start with the damage spells

    Damage spells:
    Malefic IV
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 300 MP

    Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 200
    50% chance to gain 1 stack of Favor, up to a maximum of 4

    A proc mechanic feels fitting for a job themed around fortune and luck

    Fall Malefic II
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 1 Favor

    Deals unaspected damage with a potency of 260

    Combust
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 300 MP

    Deals unaspected damage over time with a potency of 70, 15s

    Gravity
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 300 MP

    Deals unaspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 130

    The Favor stacks won't be used in AoE, subject to change if people want that

    Comet
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 400 MP

    Mark your target with Doomsday, once the effect of Doomsday expires, a comet will fall on the target, 19s, only one Doomsday effect can be active at a time
    If the target dies before the effect expires, the comet will fall where the target was
    Deals unaspected damage to the target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 350 for the first enemy, and 30% less for all remaining enemies

    Thank you ForsakenRoe for this idea. 19s was chosen so as to not have high sps accidently overwrite and restart Doomsday on the 8th GCD after the previous Comet cast.


    Healing spells:
    Benefic
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 800 MP

    Restores target's HP with a potency of 600
    Grants Double Cast Ready if the target is in combat

    Exalted Benefic
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 800 MP

    Restores target's HP with a potency of 900 after effect expiration, 8s
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon expiration if the target is in combat

    Exaltation has been replaced with spells of similar effect, I like the idea of Astro being a delay healer that can reward good play with MP cheap and effective heals

    Diurnal Benefic
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 700 MP

    Restores target's HP with a potency of 250
    Restores target's HP over time with a potency of 250, 15s
    Grants Double Cast Ready if the target is in combat
    *Can only be used under the effect of Diurnal Sect*
    *Changes to Nocturnal Benefic under the effect of Nocturnal Sect*

    Nocturnal Benefic
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 1200 MP

    Restores target's HP with a potency of 250
    Grants a magicked barrier that nullifies damage equaling 220% of the amount of HP restored
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon barrier being completely absorbed
    *Can only be used under the effect of Nocturnal Sect*
    *Cannot be placed on the hotbar*

    Yes, I am bringing back the Sects. Changing Sect will also be allowed mid-combat and it's up to the player to make good use of both shields and regens. I'm open for removing this if it feels too OP.

    Helios
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 1000 MP

    Restores HP of self and nearby party members with a potency of 500
    Grants Double Cast Ready if you're in combat

    Exalted Helios
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 1000 MP

    Restores HP of self and nearby party members with a potency of 600 after effect expiration, 8s
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon expiration if you're in combat

    Diurnal Helios
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 1200 MP

    Restores HP of self and nearby party members with a potency of 150
    Restores HP of self and nearby party members over time with a potency of 150, 15s
    Grants Double Cast Ready if the target is in combat
    *Can only be used under the effect of Diurnal Sect*
    *Changes to Nocturnal Helios under the effect of Nocturnal Sect*

    Nocturnal Helios
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 1500 MP

    Restores HP of self and nearby party members with a potency of 150
    Grants a magicked barrier that nullifies damage equaling 300% of the amount of HP restored
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon barrier granted to self being completely absorbed
    *Can only be used under the effect of Nocturnal Sect*
    *Cannot be placed on the hotbar*

    Censured Detriment
    Spell -- 0s Cast Time -- 800 MP

    Remove a single detrimental effect from the target. If the target is not enfeebled, a barrier is created nullifying the target's next detrimental effect
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon successful removal

    Exalted Detriment is back, but name-changed as Exalted is used for the new delayed heals. Astro differs from WHM cleansing in that it can be pre-emptive with it, up for changes if it's too OP.

    Censured Malady
    Spell -- 1.5s Cast Time -- 1100 MP

    Removes a single detrimental effect from self and all nearby party members. If the targets are not enfeebled, a barrier is created nullifying the next detrimental effect
    Grants Double Cast Ready upon successful removal


    Cards:
    Draw
    Trait -- 1s

    Draw a random Arcanum card, only one card can be drawn at a time

    Draw is now a trait and will automatically draw a card whenever your arcanum is empty.

    Balance
    Increases damage dealt by a party member or self by 10%, 15s
    Grants Solar Astrosign

    Spear
    Increases critical rate by a party member or self by 15%, 15s
    Grants Solar Astrosign

    Bole
    Reduces damage received on a party member or self by 10%, 15s
    Grants Celestial Astrosign

    Arrow
    Increases movement speed of a party member or self, 10s
    Grants Celestial Astrosign

    Open to changes on Arrows effect, single target Expedient feels like a good choice for arrow instead of GCD recast destroying rotations.

    Ewer
    Creates a barrier around target that absorbs damage equivalent to a heal of 500 potency, 20s
    Grants Lunar Astrosign

    Spire
    Restores target's HP over time with a potency of 150, 15s
    Grants Lunar Astrosign

    Open to changes on Ewer and Spire effects, basic heals are boring.

    Play
    Ability -- 30s Recast -- 2 Charges

    Triggers the effect of the drawn arcanum and grants its astrosign
    *Shares a recast timer with Minor Arcana

    Play now has the cooldown of Draw to regulate its usage, hopefully this will cut down on weaving.

    Redraw
    Ability -- 60s -- 2 Charges

    Draws a different arcanum from your deck, will prioritize an arcanum with an unobtained astrosign

    This should cut down on a lot of the randomness with cards. There may be some pushback to this since I know some like the randomness of cards.

    Divination
    Ability -- 120s Recast

    Trigger effects based on currently obtained astrosigns
    Can only be executed after obtaining an astrosign
    Solar sign: Gradually restores own MP with a potency of 60
    Lunar sign: Increases critical rate of self and all nearby party members by 10%
    Celestial sign: Increases damage dealt by self and all nearby party members by 5%

    The change to the astrosigns offering different effects based on current signs was to promote using a variety of cards, including using cards like Bole, Spire, Arrow, and Ewer for an overall damage gain as their signs grant the damage increases. Balance and Spear are still desired. Unlike now, you can only have 1 stack of a sign.

    Minor Arcana
    Ability -- 30s Recast -- 2 Charges

    Becomes Lady while Balance, Arrow, or Spear arcanum is drawn
    Becomes Lord while Bole, Spire, or Ewer arcanum is drawn
    *Shares a recast timer with Play*

    Will act as a card dump again. Don't need the healing effects or signs from Ewer and Spire? Lord will damage. Everyone dropping like flies? Well that Balance won't do much good there, but Lady may help.

    Lady
    Restores HP of self and all nearby party members with a potency of 600

    Lord
    Deals unaspected damage to target and all enemies nearby it with a potency of 400 for the first enemy and 50% less for all remaining enemies


    Abilities:
    Diurnal Sect
    Ability -- 2s Recast

    Regen stance, can use Diurnal Benefic and Diurnal Helios

    Nocturnal Sect
    Ability -- 2s Recast

    Barrier stance, can use Nocturnal Benefic and Nocturnal Helios

    If people feel that swapping between shield and regen might be too op for AST, I'm fine with removing it and returning Neutral Sect

    Temporal Fortuna
    Ability -- 60s Recast

    Dispels Regen effects casted by you, restoring HP equal to the amount of healing over time remaining
    Dispels Exalted effects casted by you, triggering their healing effects immediately

    Temporal Tragedia
    Ability -- 60s Recast

    Dispels Combust effects casted by you, dealing damage equal to the amount of damage over time remaining
    Dispels Doomsday effect casted by you, triggering the comet immediately

    Horoscope
    Ability -- 90s Recast

    Remember the current barrier, exalted, and regen durations and values. Executing the action a second time will apply effects at the remembered values
    Remembered Diurnal Benefic and Diurnal Helios becomes Diurnal Ascendance and Diurnal Horoscopy respectively
    Remembered Nocturnal Benefic and Nocturnal Helios becomes Nocturnal Ascendance and Nocturnal Horoscopy respectively
    Remembered Exalted Benefic and Exalted Helios becomes Exalted Ascendance and Exalted Horoscopy respectively

    These new effects will replace the original effects, make sure to wait until after they have expired before pressing Horoscope again for full value. Using the ability before the shields break or exalted heals expire will trigger Double Cast, the new effects will not trigger Double Cast.

    Double Cast
    Ability -- 15s Recast -- 2 Charges -- Double Cast Ready

    Repeat the previously casted spell with no cast time if you meet the cast requirements

    Yes this CAN be used to increase healing in a pinch with Benefic and Helios, and would even re-enable Double Cast Ready as that's one of their effects, doing so can of course be a potential DPS loss if both stacks are used this way, make sure to plan this carefully.

    The double-casted spell counts as an ability. So while Double Cast Ready can be reproced immediately via double-casted Benefic and Helios, a new spell has to be cast before Double Cast itself can be used again.


    Lightspeed
    Ability -- 60s Recast -- 2 Charges

    Grants 3 stacks of Lightspeed, reducing the cast time of spells by 2.5s

    Lightspeed is on a shorter cooldown with a second charge, but only has up to 3 casts. This should hopefully make it more readily available when it's needed for movement and intense weaving situations.

    Essential Dignity
    Ability -- 40s Recast -- 2 Charges

    Restores target's HP with a potency of 400, potency increases up to 900 as the target's HP decreases, reaching maximum value when the target has 30% HP or less

    Earthly Star
    Ability -- 60s Recast

    Deploy an Earthly Star in the designated area and grants the effect of Earthly Dominance, 10s, changes to Stellar Detonation upon execution
    Executing Stellar Detonation deals unaspected damage with a potency of 200 to all nearby enemies. Also restores own HP and HP of all nearby party members with a potency of 350
    Earthly Dominance changes to Giant Dominance upon expiration, 10s
    Executing Stellar Detonation or effect expiration will deal unaspected damage with a potency of 300 to all nearby enemies. Also restores own HP and HP of all nearby party members with a potency of 500

    Collective Unconscious
    Ability -- 60s Recast

    Creates a celestial ring around the caster, 18s, effect is canceled upon moving or executing another action
    Reduces damage taken by 10%, 5s
    Restores HP with a potency of 100 to self and all party members within the ring, 15s
    Effects are reapplied continuously to self and all party members standing within the celestial ring

    Macrocosmos
    Ability -- 180s Recast

    For the effect's duration, 50% of the damage taken is compiled, changes to Microcosmos upon execution
    Restores HP equal to a cure of 200 potency plus compiled damage when effect expires or upon execution of Microcosmos

    Macrocosmos is no longer a spell, and in turn the damage has been removed. Should still be just as stupidly powerful.

    Healing oGCDs that have remained are largely untouched outside potency tweaks.


    Removed Actions:
    Benefic II - AST gameplay and burst heals revolve more around delayed heals, Benefic I is still kept for those moments where a heal is vital
    Synastry - A skill I would've liked to keep, but button count was too high
    Neutral Sect - Swapping between Nocturnal/Diurnal is now possible in battle, and AST already has stupid high healing, this won't be needed unless I remove Nocturnal
    Exaltation - oGCD to cull
    Celestial Opposition - Another oGCD to cull
    Celestial Intersection - I can't believe it's not another oGCD to cull
    Astrodyne - Good riddance, Divination now has varied effects based on signs
    Draw - Now a trait
    Undraw Why this has survived for so long, I'll never know


    Maybe if I'm bored enough I'll make yet another Dusty MSPaint Flowchart™.
    (4)
    Last edited by TheDustyOne; 06-27-2023 at 09:35 AM. Reason: Minor tweaks to kit

  8. #8
    Player
    ForsakenRoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
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    2,467
    Character
    Samantha Redgrayve
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDustyOne View Post
    Alright, here's what I've got for Astro for my Yet Another Astrologian Rework™, I'm very much open to changes here, especially in regards to card effects and to the use of the old Sects (which are now swappable mid-combat).
    I am very much enjoying the looks of this one, as expected. The only two things that come to mind atm (about to raid) are these:

    Card effects: Since everyone's always harping on about damage > all, I feel like people are still going to complain about all the non-Balance/Spear cards. Yes, the use of the 'utility cards' is required for Divination, but it's akin to having to use two non-damaging GCDs on a DPS in order to unlock their 2min raidbuff. It would just feel odd most likely. Hence, I'd suggest something like (yes I'm self-shilling):

    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe View Post
    Balance: Flat damage boost of X%
    Bole: X% mitigation. If struck, deals damage to the attacking enemy with a potency of Y (idk what number would feel good here)
    Arrow: Increases Autoattack speed by X% (only want to use this on melee/ranged ideally, but there could be interesting moments where a PLD can make use of the extra gauge it'd give (lmao))
    Spear: Crit rate increase by X%
    Spire: X% increased magic damage (want to use this on casters)
    Ewer: MP restoration. If used on a healer, causes the target's spells to echo a second hit for X potency (or X% of the initial hit, whichever), which can't crit or dhit. (best used on healers, but can be thrown on casters in a pinch. casters would only get the MP)

    Basically, bringing back the flavor of the cards, making more distinction of who to play each on, and actually balancing the values so the 'balance or bust' meme stays dead. Part of the problem with Balance that people gloss over now is that it's not just Balance that was the issue, it was specifically AOE Balance. By keeping Royal Road dead and buried, and the cards single target, we can open up room for more varied design. When you're comparing '5% more damage for 30s on everyone' to '10% reduced damage on everyone' of course there's a clear winner. But if they're single target, and you draw, say, Arrow? Is it worth rerolling that card and it's autoattack boost effect, when the result is going to be another singletarget buff with a similar overall RDPS boost? Also, Balance and Spear are role agnostic in this, because I want there to be an 'out' of sorts for if you draw, say, Spire, play it on your BLM, then draw another Spire before the first one falls off. Redraw there would not give you a seal you already have, so it'd be one of physical (arrow)/tank(bole)/healer(ewer)/any(balance).

    Changing some stuff around to make it fit the way the game works now better as well. For example, old Arrow reduced GCD. This would cause drift, and with how important the 2min window is now, misaligning because your GCD changed would be poorly received even if the intentions were good natured. As such, to keep the 'feel' of the card intact, I change it to increased Autoattack speed, something we know is possible due to MNK having a CD that does it. Bole gaining a reflective component adds a damage output to the card that makes it desireable instead of 'this could have been more damage but it isn't so it's trash'. Spire is magic damage because uhh... there's a thunderbolt on the card and that seems kinda magic-y
    I'll let you work out the value for X to balance things

    The other thing was Tempora Fortuna, I assume OGCD heals are also affected by it (eg, making the regen instantly resolve from Collective Unconscious). It has a 60s CD so you'd be able to do this idea every time (unless changed), but I was thinking last night: Wouldn't it be cool if it affected Star, presumably with a longer CD, so it's your instant 'i need healing now' emergency button. You'd 'want' to use HOTs where possible, but if you need to, instantly 'fast forwarding' a Star would be cool I think. Maybe shifting Fortuna up to 2min would make it work better, idk

    edit: while also on the subject of AST, I also had an idea for a different 'complexity' addition, not so much focused on the cards but on the filler GCDs. Basically:

    Nocturnal Sect: returned
    Quicken: New GCD, deals damage (like 25p less than comparable Malefic), accelerates the effect of Combust by 3 seconds, can only be used in Diurnal
    Slow: New GCD, deals damage (like 25p less than comparable Malefic), extends the effect of Combust by 3 seconds, can only be used in Nocturnal

    so you'd have to alternate sects not just for shield/regen purposes, but as part of your damage rotation, and because the DOT naturally ticks as it's effect goes, the amount of times you'd 'extend' the DOT is more than the 'accelerate', so it wouldn't just be 'ok extend 5 times then accel 5 times'
    (0)
    Last edited by ForsakenRoe; 06-19-2023 at 03:46 AM.

  9. #9
    Player
    TheDustyOne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2021
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    660
    Character
    Dusty Two
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe View Post
    I am very much enjoying the looks of this one, as expected. The only two things that come to mind atm (about to raid) are these:

    Card effects: Since everyone's always harping on about damage > all, I feel like people are still going to complain about all the non-Balance/Spear cards. Yes, the use of the 'utility cards' is required for Divination, but it's akin to having to use two non-damaging GCDs on a DPS in order to unlock their 2min raidbuff. It would just feel odd most likely. Hence, I'd suggest something like (yes I'm self-shilling):
    I was thinking of using your buffs early on, since they're creative and sound fun to use. The reason I ended up sticking with non-damage ones being optimal was mostly because I wanted to keep the effects super simple to understand, and Divination is ultimately what ends up making someone not feel guilty for actually using non-damage cards. Having Bole also give damage after being attacked can definitely be fun, but might be a bit overkill.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe View Post
    The other thing was Tempora Fortuna, I assume OGCD heals are also affected by it (eg, making the regen instantly resolve from Collective Unconscious). It has a 60s CD so you'd be able to do this idea every time (unless changed), but I was thinking last night: Wouldn't it be cool if it affected Star, presumably with a longer CD, so it's your instant 'i need healing now' emergency button. You'd 'want' to use HOTs where possible, but if you need to, instantly 'fast forwarding' a Star would be cool I think. Maybe shifting Fortuna up to 2min would make it work better, idk
    Just the GCD heals, Exalted and Diurnal Helios together are about 1500 potency, and the Benefics 2400 potency (assuming fresh regens), even without Star and CU it probably needs nerfing to 2 minutes. New Horoscope also lets you double-dip those same heals, so after a good 15-18s you could have healed 3000 potency on the party, which is pretty insane, even if it costs 2 big cooldowns. Those heal-to-full mechanics won't know what him 'em.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe View Post
    while also on the subject of AST, I also had an idea for a different 'complexity' addition, not so much focused on the cards but on the filler GCDs. Basically:

    Nocturnal Sect: returned
    Quicken: New GCD, deals damage (like 25p less than comparable Malefic), accelerates the effect of Combust by 3 seconds, can only be used in Diurnal
    Slow: New GCD, deals damage (like 25p less than comparable Malefic), extends the effect of Combust by 3 seconds, can only be used in Nocturnal

    so you'd have to alternate sects not just for shield/regen purposes, but as part of your damage rotation, and because the DOT naturally ticks as it's effect goes, the amount of times you'd 'extend' the DOT is more than the 'accelerate', so it wouldn't just be 'ok extend 5 times then accel 5 times'
    That could be fun messing around with the duration of Combust, especially with Temporal Tragedia making it even stronger, certainly a little more interesting, makes even 111 spam feel more meaningful (I'd probably have the Sects alter Malefic itself to do that) and makes the Sects a bit more interactive in the kit. It'd probably have to be more like adding 6 or 9 seconds for each cast instead of 3, since by the time the next GCD rolls around you'd only gain .5 seconds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Post View Post
    I like a lot of what I've seen, particularly the Divination promoting use of non-damaging cards...
    I quite like your idea of Spire being an HP increase, MP however runs into issues, at least with the games current design. Only BLM and DRK would really make full use of that if you can toss it during Umbral Ice / just before Edge spam. If more jobs had better use overall for MP outside healers, and if MP was balanced enough to where it wouldn't matter if you threw it on a BLM or a hypothetical MP using MNK, then I'd definitely have Ewer be more like it used to or have it increase MP total.

    Quote Originally Posted by Post View Post
    I don't see why Celestial Opposition can't just exist as is and have the same effect as your Temporal Fortuna and Tragedia rolled into one. It's even already a 60 second cooldown....
    Like I said with Roe, Fortuna is stupid powerful, and having it tied alongside damage would make even Assize overhealing look meek in comparison. Keeping them separate makes it much easier to balance the two and won't make people feel guilty for saving it for that big heal instead of that near 700 potency burst damage. I was thinking of having CO just be a simple HoT extender, much closer to how it worked in HW/SB, but I cut it because my rework is already at 33 buttons.

    Quote Originally Posted by Post View Post
    Likewise, in the current state of AST, Lightspeed has been turned into a button you use during dps weave crunch time, but that was not its original use...
    Hopefully what I've concocted means there'll be less double-weaving as a whole, but just because it's primary use is movement doesn't mean it also can't be a double-weave generator. Ruin II currently has that as a benefit, same with the DoTs, and since AST has a lot more oGCDs to work with, having a cooldown to make that easier while providing movement makes sense.

    Worst case scenario I can also make Fall Malefic instant cast, but I feel like that's making the job a bit too mobile since Comet every 20s, Combust every 15s and many GCD heals are instant as it is, having only 3 casts on Lightspeed I think is fair for its 60s cooldown. Having lots of instant casts as-is in this rework makes Macrocosmos being a spell feel a bit redundant.
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    Last edited by TheDustyOne; 06-19-2023 at 06:53 AM.

  10. #10
    Player
    Icecylee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    206
    Character
    Rieanna Cohen
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    I like the pitch, even if I'm not sold on some of the particulars. One thing that stood out to me though: if the Stances basically only really effect one extra ST heal and one GT heal... it seems like it might make more sense for them to be 30s cooldowns that share a recast timer (and probably have a stack or two) that you'd use as a modifier on the Exalted versions to change the effect. Shift it from delay to regen/shield without removing access to your direct heal, and lean in a bit more to being ideal to know in advance what you want to do / what you need like most of the rest of kit is doing.

    On the other hand it seems like this might already be a bit saturated with ogcs so maybe not... (though it's not necessarily bad either, could make AST v WHM feel like GNB v WAR). Either way, it seems like a good pitch to keep things similar or similar in flavor, while making the job on a whole more interesting.

    Having the support cards directly lead to aoe +damage effects SEEMS like it'd go a long way to making random draws less frustrating, though encounter design would probably need to step up a bit wrt damage to not make playing them in the moment feel like pointless button pressing if you're not playing with someone that's constantly stepping in bad.
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