Did Zenos ruin Endwalker

[Payotz]

That's why I prefaced it by saying "not that that makes it suddenly a good thing."

I am addressing the part where it's "always been there". Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're implying.
It being always been there isn't really justification that it should always be there.

[Stormpeaks]

That's why I prefaced it by saying "not that that makes it suddenly a good thing."


The Trust system that has existed since Shadowbringers. Which you are treating as an Endwalker ill and a sign that the world is ending now. Lmao.

I am saying that it is very much encouraged now even on a public facebook post, which really is not normal, I'm not sure why you keep trying to reach for gotcha's, but it aint quite working

[EliaStormblade]

I am addressing the part where it's "always been there". Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're implying.
It being always been there isn't really justification that it should always be there.

And I didn't justify it. I said it's always been there so it's not some newfangled ShB/EW problem like a lot of people seem to imply. That's not meant to be justification, just perspective. If it irked me enough to be dealbreaker, I'd have quit in ARR, not Endwalker. Your thoughts on it are your prerogative and completely valid, and I've even agreed that it can get ludicrous at times.

I am saying that it is very much encouraged now even on a public facebook post, which really is not normal, I'm not sure why you keep trying to reach for gotcha's, but it aint quite working

Why isn't it normal? Are they supposed to be hush-hush about a system that has been very much public since its inception? It's not some closely held secret. I'm not "gotcha"-ing you. You're doing that all to yourself by making the most inane and hamfisted posts.

[IckeDerTyp]

As long as we somehow see him again, I'm more than happy with how EW Zenos went :3

[Payotz]

And I didn't justify it. I said it's always been there so it's not some newfangled ShB/EW problem like a lot of people seem to imply. That's not meant to be justification, just perspective. If it irked me enough to be dealbreaker, I'd have quit in ARR, not Endwalker. Your thoughts on it are your prerogative and completely valid, and I've even agreed that it can get ludicrous at times.

Ahh then yeah fair. I've kinda overlooked it just because it didn't really feel that egregious in the previous expansions.
I think it's because the stakes weren't really that high, so I didn't mind it that much, and it made sense in the story.

Like Azys Lla was executed relatively well. It having a shield made sense, and us trying to pierce it regardless made sense.

[Stormpeaks]

And I didn't justify it. I said it's always been there so it's not some newfangled ShB/EW problem like a lot of people seem to imply. That's not meant to be justification, just perspective. If it irked me enough to be dealbreaker, I'd have quit in ARR, not Endwalker. Your thoughts on it are your prerogative and completely valid, and I've even agreed that it can get ludicrous at times.

Why isn't it normal? Are they supposed to be hush-hush about a system that has been very much public since its inception? It's not some closely held secret. I'm not "gotcha"-ing you. You're doing that all to yourself by making the most inane and hamfisted posts.

Not gonna repeat my previous point, if you cant read that's your problem not mine

/shrug

I can read just fine. Maybe what you're saying just isn't an issue.

It's almost like people have different opinions, no way, tell me it aint so

not wasting anymore posts for your pathetic trolling as I'm almost out of them for the day

Thank you for your "great" input lmao

You're welcome! I hope it helped. Get some fresh air.

Dont you worry I am, I am hanging out with my friends in the game, thank you for your concern though ; )

[EliaStormblade]

Not gonna repeat my previous point, if you cant read that's your problem not mine

/shrug

I can read just fine. Maybe what you're saying just isn't an issue.

It's almost like people have different opinions, no way, tell me it aint so

not wasting anymore posts for your pathetic trolling as I'm almost out of them for the day

Thank you for your "great" input lmao

You're welcome! I hope it helped. Get some fresh air.

Ahh then yeah fair. I've kinda overlooked it just because it didn't really feel that egregious in the previous expansions.
I think it's because the stakes weren't really that high, so I didn't mind it that much, and it made sense in the story.

Like Azys Lla was executed relatively well. It having a shield made sense, and us trying to pierce it regardless made sense.

I think it's also to do with the passage of time. Clichéd as it may be to pin it on people's memories, and I'm definitely not going to insist it has to be the case with you or any other individual who takes issue with the game's story as it is, I see a lot of Shadowbringers fellating that very overtly leaves out the multitude of sore spots and pacing errors, only mentioning the highs they experienced.

And that's just one expansion ago. I would postulate that there's something to that, at least for some people.

But yes, the stakes were also less high-- though I would say that they were still pretty high to the point of demanding alacrity, personally. Azys Lla having a shield was fine, the stuff you did there was also not that egregious, but having to go back and chat with Matoya and go into the Great Gubal Library alone to retrieve a tome definitely could've been nixed if they so wanted to trim the fat. That said, I did enjoy the moments with Matoya and the dungeon, so I obviously don't mind that it was there. Just trying to keep my feelings out of it in this situation. There were a few other spots in HW as well, if I recall.

[SassyAssassin]

Because Zenos is pretty and he makes us feel wanted

[SassyAssassin]

Zenos not dying in Stormblood ruined everything he's touched since then.

Finally an explanation for my feels feeling ruined

[Crushnight]

Do I think Zenos ruined EW’s story?, No.

Do I think Zenos was a necessary character for EW’s story?, No.

Zenos is incredibly superfluous to the entire story since his death back in 4.0, it caused glaring issues in the writing. Elidibus in Zenos’s body is only the height of a midlander, Zenos literally asspulled his way out of his 1st death by magically body hoping without ever knowing how to, what some players had to experience for years of seeing Zenos sit on his butt doing nothing, 6.0 deliberately written to make the WoL more battle/fight crazy than any expansion or patch did prior or since all to justify the 1v1 at the end of 6.0

If you took Zenos out of the plot after 4.0, the only thing you would need to get seriously think about is who would kill Varis, everything else can be left as is and nothing of importance would be lost to the narrative.

Zenos never drove the plot forward after 4.0 except for his killing of Varis and for an antagonist that’s is terrible for 2 nearly 3 expansions worth of story

EW story is caused by Amon, Hermes and Meteion as the actual antagonists

Zenos was just there an afterthought until “oh yeah we should do something with him”.