The truth is we need a remastered XI or a follow up

[Vyrerus]

do world boss fights still take... hours? I seem to recall that was a thing as well

Nah. After the Pandemonium Warden debacle, every ??? spawned monster can only stay present for 2 or so hours unless they changed something.

Beyond that though, most all endgame content takes place in instances that have unique entry requirements and party size allowances and time limits.

Dynamis Divergence is kinda like old Dynamis (not quite), and I believe there's time extensions, but even that's only a few hours. And its bosses certainly don't take its whole time length.

Even in the olden days, the bosses like Kirin only took so long because people didn't have gear yet/jobs were weaker/people didn't know what they were doing/accuracy food didn't exist etc.

Round about Treasures of Aht Urhgan time, with the introduction of Corsair and some tweaks and Sushi, people figured out alliance zerg methods, so you could down what once took like 2 to 3 hours in about 2 minutes.

Every major boss nowadays is down to like 20~30 minutes, sometimes longer, but if it is longer, it's always pushing up against an instance timer, for the most part.

Might change if they ever release the lofted, "Valhalla" final battle content that's supposed to be the next thing after Sortie/final thing since the game is in maintenance mode under Fujito now. But people remain skeptical.

[Vyrerus]

Start of 2005

Mwahahaha, I've been a resident of Vana'diel longer than you :P! But also yay. Another FFXI vet <3

[Shougun]

I wanna give some appreciation here - This week I started playing XI for the first time.

I'm blown away - everything about the game is amazing and extremely engaging. I never wanted my hand held in XIV, I never wanted choices made for me, I never wanted my rotations pre-planned, and I sure as hell never wanted a visual novel forcing itself on me for hundreds of hours.

XIV has kinda just felt like a museum of FF, which was OK but difficult to get truly immersed. Mostly feels like I'm watching a movie of FF where they just stole old FF assets and put them in new stories.

XI has challenged me in almost every way possible so far, and it feels like an actual open world Final Fantasy mainline game. It's pulled me directly into a universe of it's own design.

If you've only played XIV like me, but absolutely love FF - Do yourself a favor, push past the initial install/setup woes and experience it. (Use a controller)

May be controversial but... having watched quite a few games and their feedback.. I have a thought..

Gameplay is important sure.. and I did hear this a lot during 1.0 to 2.0 as I am bit of a nut on it (then and now) but pacing, immersion, the concepts that ground you in the world space are perhaps equally important.


Now hear me out, because maybe two people are agreeing and I want to misalign myself more ! I read a lot of players, usually the same, who are asking for things that older MMOs tended to do better, and then usually suggesting things like better combat or complaints on mechanics. Then, maybe a little like yourself, praising a game which frankly has very simplistic content in comparison. FFXIV, WoW, etc, constantly shifting fights to be more and more convoluted (which is fine lol) but, and I'm not saying these are mutually exclusive or you can't be talking about two issues at once, but I swear I get a strong inkling when people are having issues with the game, or other games, that they're not really saying they need harder content, more complicated mechanics, or anything like that...

Honestly.. I feel a lot of times people are feeling like they don't have that magical lost experience and immersion and they're hoping through pain they can get it (certainly you can in ultimate when everything is lining up, or your blood pays out), but like... Look at say Bethesda games, honestly their gameplay is fairly bad and thank god for addons and especially for the modding scene these recent years, but the immersion is some of the best in class anywhere.

My own convoluted post to suggest that a lot of peoples problems that are usually expressed on the harder end of things are looking to be immersed, but expressing it by gameplay because that's all they can think to explain but even if the gameplay did change I doubt it would entirely solve what their soul of the problem is attempting to express. Because again really.. really look at some of the best in immersion, that usually people upset about FFXIV's direction are saying, and compare it to like Skyrim or more parallel example FFXI. FFXI, Skyrim, their gameplay if you lay it out on paper is really basic man.. Sure there is magic burst system which had team work but beyond that.. lol. Okey. (fun fact, FFXIV had something kind of like that in 1.0). Or classic WoW where people are laying on all the praise, honestly most of the gameplay earlier on was fairly simple compared to their later more complicated fight mechanics and classes. And the rate of new content for a lot of these older games was even slower, people just did the same thing over and over lol.

Want to say I'm sure some people are saying more things than one at once, but personally watching some people complaining about certain issues and then seeing what they're praising, and the things the game is doing well or not well- I often feel the core target is feeling grounded and not really difficulty (though time is an important calculation in this). I'm still a self proclaimed filthy casual (was hardercore way back when, like I was a "FFXI" player), but now I wouldn't have it any other way, so I anything I suggest naturally will be bent or at least 'bendable' to that but.. often when I see people have issues, I feel it's due to a loss of grounding, identity, magical word that was a bad word on the forums long ago, and not really needing harder and harder content and the scrubs are ruining everything, etc. My personal thought is it's harder to fix lost magic and easier to add new content, on top of people asking for things that don't actually solve the issues they're having (although the homogenization comments have recently, imo, been calling out that issue as it's extremely apparent these days though I believe that wasn't due to casuals but due to the bean counting of end game content).

Anyway... felt it for years and just felt like posting it since you were calling out the immersive element of FFXI and challenge in FFXIV. Gameplay is important sure but grounding your players in the world is nearly equally important if not actually equal and on top of that a lot of players issues of recent time are ultimately stemming from grounding than simply gameplay (with those above games with 'meh' gameplay still being awesome games). Then just for the Thal of it, two games I feel that have fantastic grounding and gameplay would be Ghost of Tsushima and Elden Ring.

[Elissar]

I would experiment FFXI if i didnt have an IP block issue =p

[Atelier-Bagur]

I wanna give some appreciation here - This week I started playing XI for the first time.

I'm blown away - everything about the game is amazing and extremely engaging. I never wanted my hand held in XIV, I never wanted choices made for me, I never wanted my rotations pre-planned, and I sure as hell never wanted a visual novel forcing itself on me for hundreds of hours.

XIV has kinda just felt like a museum of FF, which was OK but difficult to get truly immersed. Mostly feels like I'm watching a movie of FF where they just stole old FF assets and put them in new stories.

XI has challenged me in almost every way possible so far, and it feels like an actual open world Final Fantasy mainline game. It's pulled me directly into a universe of it's own design.

If you've only played XIV like me, but absolutely love FF - Do yourself a favor, push past the initial install/setup woes and experience it. (Use a controller)

Ok not gonna try to be that guy but its kinda hard to have that awestruck sense of wonder experience in FFXI when you have to follow a leveling and content guide because the game is so archaic than classic WoW in its MMO design.

At least for me, I enjoy the game when I know what to do next. Doesnt help that plot points from other expansions keep interfering when you travel unlike the digestable linearity of FFXIV' design.

I only love FFXI for its gameplay and music since Im a fan of the old school anyway. But I second the game's recommendation, its an interesting world but please follow a guide

[Ransu]

Ok not gonna try to be that guy but its kinda hard to have that awestruck sense of wonder experience in FFXI when you have to follow a leveling and content guide because the game is so archaic than classic WoW in its MMO design.

At least for me, I enjoy the game when I know what to do next. Doesnt help that plot points from other expansions keep interfering when you travel unlike the digestable linearity of FFXIV' design.

I only love FFXI for its gameplay and music since Im a fan of the old school anyway. But I second the game's recommendation, its an interesting world but please follow a guide

lol I have great memories of pissing my dad off because I printed out dozens upon dozens of pages of information because back then the game would not let you alt tab as the game would immediately close and force you to log back in. It was their extreme way to prevent hacking so you had to turn off any kind of instant messenger or anything that would pop up and minimize your screen. Ah the good ole days before the windower addon came about.

[R041]

Ok not gonna try to be that guy but its kinda hard to have that awestruck sense of wonder experience in FFXI when you have to follow a leveling and content guide because the game is so archaic than classic WoW in its MMO design.

At least for me, I enjoy the game when I know what to do next. Doesnt help that plot points from other expansions keep interfering when you travel unlike the digestable linearity of FFXIV' design.

I only love FFXI for its gameplay and music since Im a fan of the old school anyway. But I second the game's recommendation, its an interesting world but please follow a guide

If you can't figure out how to level or do the quests, then I think you need a baby game to hold your hand. I'd still suggest a guide for the super confusing shit though. It puts an emphasis on player interaction, which involves team discussion and deduction.

XI so far is playing more closely to oldschool CRPGs where they tell you to go do a thing, and don't explain shit. So for example, 1 quest you have to look for a suitable partner for the prince. They give you details on the kind of person to look for then just throw you out of the castle to do your thing. (It wants you to find another player)

If that quest were in XIV, they'd give you a wide AOE quest marker with 3 people to find, 1 of them hiding behind a house, and that would be the one.

I kinda prefer the one that makes me use my brain a little bit. If you get frustrated easily, and aren't really a problem solver.. Then yeah I guess I wouldn't suggest XI. lol

[Skivvy]

Okay?

And XIV today is nothing like 2.0, and everyone uses mods for every little QOL. Who cares, I'm explaining that I'm enjoying myself today. I'm playing XI more like a single-player game anyway, Trusts have been amazing.

Also I use the full-size map more to check coords, wouldn't really change much how I play if minimap was disabled.

Funny how you try and shame me for some reason, when I can guarantee you have XIV mods. lol

I feel like it's better now, but it used to be that mentioning anything positive about XI on the forums would usually be met with a lot of backlash and people telling you how much that game sucked, or you're simply viewing it with rose tinted glasses, etc. I take it back. It's still bad. lol.

The game is definitely a breed of its own, and it's not going to be for everyone, but it's always fun to see people new to the game actually enjoying themselves. You do you.

[Atelier-Bagur]

If you can't figure out how to level or do the quests, then I think you need a baby game to hold your hand. I'd still suggest a guide for the super confusing shit though. It puts an emphasis on player interaction, which involves team discussion and deduction.

XI so far is playing more closely to oldschool CRPGs where they tell you to go do a thing, and don't explain shit. So for example, 1 quest you have to look for a suitable partner for the prince. They give you details on the kind of person to look for then just throw you out of the castle to do your thing. (It wants you to find another player)

If that quest were in XIV, they'd give you a wide AOE quest marker with 3 people to find, 1 of them hiding behind a house, and that would be the one.

I kinda prefer the one that makes me use my brain a little bit. If you get frustrated easily, and aren't really a problem solver.. Then yeah I guess I wouldn't suggest XI. lol

Leveling is a no brainer although you still have to do some outside research to understand the gearing systems available to you because a new player coming into the game will not be aware of the sparks system or casting signet or telling you how to warp or how to setup objectives for grinds. The game cares very little in attracting new players because it doesnt care to explain shit when you start or teach you how to play the game.

Like I said, I love playing FFXI, its a fun game once you get over a bunch of "quit" moments but saying you need to be a problem solver to understand exactly what to do is such bs because the game itself doesnt make it obvious enough on how to do the content on your own.

Thats why its a "guide" game.

[R041]

Leveling is a no brainer although you still have to do some outside research to understand the gearing systems available to you because a new player coming into the game will not be aware of the sparks system or casting signet or telling you how to warp or how to setup objectives for grinds. The game cares very little in attracting new players because it doesnt care to explain shit when you start or teach you how to play the game.

Like I said, I love playing FFXI, its a fun game once you get over a bunch of "quit" moments but saying you need to be a problem solver to understand exactly what to do is such bs because the game itself doesnt make it obvious enough on how to do the content on your own.

Thats why its a "guide" game.

I agree - I wouldn't say a guide is 100% necessary. It just means you're slower. At least that's how I've experienced it. Should still read one, and maybe talk to people on Discord. It's a very involved experience.

I didn't figure out Sparks, Unity, Signet.. Until like 10 hours in. I didn't even realize 'Trade' was a whole ass thing for NPCs, and they want/need different things for different reasons and may not even be a part of a quest!

That's why I'm enjoying it - It's not holding my hand for everything, so that also kinda means things are hidden in some ways. In XIV, I get everything and then I'm done with the content within a few hours.

But I'm also just starting, and I bet playing XI for 10 years then playing XIV 6.0 right after, I'd be praising XIV.

It's just a nice breath of fresh air that I REALLY needed. I'm happy I gave it a shot, because it gripped the fuck out of me. lol