Dragoon Rework

[Aco505]

our rotation drifts forward by two GCDs every 2 minutes. That leaves me with 2 GCDs to work with. That said; what if you could power-up DfD using PT?

I wouldn't call it drift per se, it's just that the GCD string takes 25s to do, and all CDs are multiples of 30, thus the burst will always start and end at different GCDs. This isn't really an issue, as the gains you obtain from always getting LC/DS up after a Disembowel (best case scenario) are not that substantial.

The potency increase to PT is probably the biggest boon, as Shurrikhan says. The problem with using PT is that it deals awful damage and causes a delay of the main combo and thus scale generation, which can lead to loss of WWT uses over the fight or drifting them out of buffs.

Another problem of adding GCDs to the rotation (or disconnecting) is that the DoT from CS will fall off several seconds before you can reapply it.

Additionally, Power Surge is usually refreshed when it has around 7s left, so extra GCDs can put us in situations where the buff falls off at a specific crucial GCD that will be followed by specific oGCDs. This could happen in P2S for example because of Kampeos Harma, even if you did two CS combos in a row.

This would be solved by adjusting the timers of the DoT and Power Surge in some way though.


I'm ambivalent about making PT part of the main rotation. I think it's better if its purpose is only to keep the GCD rolling for disconnects but fixed so that it's not that awful. On the other hand, I guess it'd be a bit flavorful since we'll be throwing our spear more?

I'd prefer it if it was our main combo doing the job of powering up stuff as it'd be more integrated and organic to the overall rotation, but perhaps that's just my personal opinion.

[Petite]

Another problem of adding GCDs to the rotation (or disconnecting) is that the DoT from CS will fall off several seconds before you can reapply it.

Additionally, Power Surge is usually refreshed when it has around 7s left, so extra GCDs can put us in situations where the buff falls off at a specific crucial GCD that will be followed by specific oGCDs.
This would be solved by adjusting the timers of the DoT and Power Surge in some way though.

Yup exactly. CS’s dot and Power Surge’s durations would need to be adjusted a bit.

I'm ambivalent about making PT part of the main rotation. I think it's better if its purpose is only to keep the GCD rolling for disconnects but fixed so that it's not that awful. On the other hand, I guess it'd be a bit flavorful since we'll be throwing our spear more?

The way I saw it after reading Shurrikhan’s suggestion, it wouldn’t be about forcing PT into the rotation like I initialy envisionned. If the « 0PT, 1PT, 2PT » routes were to be of similar potencies to one another, the whole system would be utilized as a way to give us more flexibility when disconnected from our targets as well as let us influence where, in our GCD rotation, we’d want our buffs to allign.

Example: I’m at Disembowel and my buffs are coming back up in 2 GCD, I could delay my rotation with two PTs. Using the two PTs by themselves would be a dps loss, but they would later buy-back their uses becasue DfD would have become more powerful from the two PT charges I had generated. That way, no damage loss would occur and we'll have gained a better buff starting point. The potencies would need to be adjusted carefully for that system to work as a « flexibility » option and not as the optimal route to follow.

[Shurrikhan]

Another problem of adding GCDs to the rotation (or disconnecting) is that the DoT from CS will fall off several seconds before you can reapply it.

This would be solved by adjusting the timers of the DoT and Power Surge in some way though.

Yup exactly. CS’s dot and Power Surge’s durations would need to be adjusted a bit.

I feel like CT's DoT duration should be increased (largely for cleave purposes) regardless... at least to PS's duration. Since it's being replaced early anyways, its tick potency wouldn't need to be nerfed regardless. It feels like the duration decrease is there solely to incentivize Skill Speed (in a highly awkward and situational way).

The way I saw it after reading Shurrikhan’s suggestion, it wouldn’t be about forcing PT into the rotation like I initialy envisionned. If the « 0PT, 1PT, 2PT » routes were to be of similar potencies to one another, the whole system would be utilized as a way to give us more flexibility when disconnected from our targets as well as let us influence where, in our GCD rotation, we’d want our buffs to allign.

On that note, I think you may want/need to actually increase the raw potency loss, since you'll be using PT outside of buffs, but the increased DFD damage would occur under buffs, which would already more than offset the raw potency loss.

Since the option is supposed to be situational, you'd want to tune it to fall just short of maximum raid buffs' recuperation, especially given that you'll also have the benefit of better GCD sync, too (which may itself be worth some 20-60 effective potency).

[Aco505]

I feel like CT's DoT duration should be increased (largely for cleave purposes) regardless... at least to PS's duration. Since it's being replaced early anyways, its tick potency wouldn't need to be nerfed regardless. It feels like the duration decrease is there solely to incentivize Skill Speed (in a highly awkward and situational way).

Increasing the duration of the DoT with the current design wouldn't change much, since it falls off 1 second before it has to be reapplied in normal circumstances.

Since DoTs tick every 3 seconds, making it last 27 or 30s wouldn't have any effect, not even in cleave, as you want to switch to the AoE combo the moment you have more than two targets. The only exception could be three targets that are not close and will live long enough but that's extremely niche and possibly doesn't even exist in the game.

[Shurrikhan]

Increasing the duration of the DoT with the current design wouldn't change much, since it falls off 1 second before it has to be reapplied in normal circumstances.

Since DoTs tick every 3 seconds, making it last 27 or 30s wouldn't have any effect, not even in cleave, as you want to switch to the AoE combo the moment you have more than two targets. The only exception could be three targets that are not close and will live long enough but that's extremely niche and possibly doesn't even exist in the game.

True, without TP and with our AoE potency as high as it is now, it wouldn't do much.

My point was more that if downtime value were a/the concern, that'd be an easy place to look, as compared to an elaboration upon PT. Any elaboration on a filler GCD should instead be for adjusting... GCD-sync (much like Yaten-Enpi does for SAM). Otherwise, we probably deserve to be constrained to the same downtime efficiency as other melee (which isn't great, and probably needn't be... because we're melee).