I want to play *This* game

[CStrife912]

They probably also have relic completion data (through achievements or whatever) and may have seen how much or how little players actually engaged with that content - making decisions on how much engagement they are getting vs. the effort to create the content.

I do agree they will have player metrics and if they were low enough they could look at other areas like reddit/forums etc to see the feedback. They have a whole team dedicated to research of other MMOs or what other parties are doing within the genre...it would be foolish to think they don't act on said data. I think if the data shows people are still doing X,Y,Z then the forums and reddit etc merely are a drop in the pond when it comes to vocal concerns.

[Deo14]

They probably also have relic completion data (through achievements or whatever) and may have seen how much or how little players actually engaged with that content - making decisions on how much engagement they are getting vs. the effort to create the content.

Problem with current relics is that the process (if you even want to call it that) is so minimized that getting any meaningful metric is impossible.

People might like it and buy the relics. Other people can hate it but still buy it since they have tomes anyway, might as well get cheap catchup weapon for alt job. I did that too, I bought like 4-5 steps worth of relics in total until I realized how much profit from tomes I'm losing. But if I started to like certain job that I don't have good weapon for? I'll buy another relic, after all why not, it's just here and doesn't require me to do anything else than just regular daily roulettes. Now the metric is filled with plenty of false positives and effectively unusable.

[4clubbedace]

Yes. Why on earth would you expect me to engage in content -

Mate i enjoy pressing buttons. The UCOB weapons are ugly as sin but i still did it to do it.

now there can be an argument for the /replayability/ of content, theres little reason to do variant and criterion after the initial reward, which sucks since i actually enjoyed the content itself.

[ZephyrMenodora]

Problem with current relics is that the process (if you even want to call it that) is so minimized that getting any meaningful metric is impossible.

People might like it and buy the relics. Other people can hate it but still buy it since they have tomes anyway, might as well get cheap catchup weapon for alt job. I did that too, I bought like 4-5 steps worth of relics in total until I realized how much profit from tomes I'm losing. But if I started to like certain job that I don't have good weapon for? I'll buy another relic, after all why not, it's just here and doesn't require me to do anything else than just regular daily roulettes. Now the metric is filled with plenty of false positives and effectively unusable.

I do agree with this - unless someone really doesn't feel like doing Hildebrand there is going to be a very high percentage of people with a relic this expansion. Whether that is a success or not is arguable - but I agree this data would not be as useful as the data around the prior relics since there is almost no barrier to entry.

[Thurmnmurmn]

Yes. Why on earth would you expect me to engage in content that gives terrible rewards? There's underwhelming and then there's straight up "who asked for this" when it comes to the rewards Eureka Orthos gives. It's as if Starbucks advertised they were going to release a new drink and all it had in it is water and food coloring. No wonder people aren't impressed. Incentive for content is just as important as making sure the content doesn't feel awful to play.

But now in Endwalker it feels like we've gotten the worst of both worlds.

And that's where it's up to your taste. So it's not a bad faith attempt as you put it.
Like I personally love the look of the tiger and am now 1 run away from getting it. I am so looking forward to it

[Saraide]

Yes. Why on earth would you expect me to engage in content that gives terrible rewards? There's underwhelming and then there's straight up "who asked for this" when it comes to the rewards Eureka Orthos gives. It's as if Starbucks advertised they were going to release a new drink and all it had in it is water and food coloring. No wonder people aren't impressed. Incentive for content is just as important as making sure the content doesn't feel awful to play.

But now in Endwalker it feels like we've gotten the worst of both worlds.

Ideally you do content because it's fun to play. This seems somewhat of a foreign concept to mmo players though.

[AwesomeJr44]

Yes. Why on earth would you expect me to engage in content that gives terrible rewards?

If a piece of content has terrible rewards, I typically do it once just to do it, and then I never touch it again unless I have friends that want to do it.

For example, I don't really like the mount you get for 4 floor 100 Orthos clears (I used to think it was ok but after seeing it a few times it's just kinda meh) so I cleared it once, bought the framer kit, and then didn't bother past that. If a group of my friends want to try and go for more floor 100 clears, I'll probably tag along, but that's only because playing with my friends is fun, not the content itself.

Although, if the rewards for a piece of content are bad, AND the content itself isn't great, I'm going to be tempted to just skip it.

[SieyaM]

No, you just don't get it, you have to play the other games™ to enjoy this game!!! Take a break, lose your house, your FC, your friends, just so you can enjoy this game better when you come back, don't you get it?!!!!

If your friends only talk to you in game and are going to cease being friends if you fail to log in every day, then they are not your friends they are just people you play a game with.

[SieyaM]

This Saturday I tried to queue for floor 1-10 of Eureka Orthos during peak time (around 6 pm EST) so I could start grinding my Aetherpool levels. I ended up waiting 1 hour and not be able to find 3 other players. I just alt+f4 and play a different game. So it looks like it's just another dead on arrival piece of content Endwalker has to offer. XD the game is in a good state guy!

I queued for floors 21-30 Thursday morning outside of peak hours and got a group in less than 5 minutes, so does that mean the content isn't dead? Or does only your anecdotal evidence count. You can also enter by yourself to complete lower floors and raise your Aetherpool levels.

[Y2K21]

If your friends only talk to you in game and are going to cease being friends if you fail to log in every day, then they are not your friends they are just people you play a game with.

Yea, but Discord is a third party tool so I dont want to get banned for breaking FF14 TOS.