What if they added sub-jobs to ff14

[lolicon09]

[MonsutaMan]

Well, everyone knows I am the verbatim FF guy.....

PLD/DRG

[Mikey_R]

We sort of had subjobs in ARR. If I recall, you needed CNJ to open PLD. Therefore, PLD could equip spells like Stoneskin, Cure and Raise (out of battle only). Warrior got Bloodbath from DRG. And I think MNK got Fracture from WAR. I don't know, it has been a while. But we sort of had subjobs. It was "ok." Some of these abilities had value. Many did not. They ultimately got rid of all of that and just went with role abilities.

You have to remember, every job pulled from 2 classes, the one they used to unlock the job and an additional one. PLD was Conjurer and Marauder as an example. A typical PLD setup used Stoneskin, Mercy Stroke, Bloodbath (yes, it was a marauder action), Fracture and finally, Foresight. Other things they could use were Skull Sunder (useless), Cure (weak) and Raise, which, as you noted couldn't be used in combat.

Ultimately, every job had 4-5 cross class that were actually useful, the rest weren't, meaning, anyone with any sort of sense didn't even need a guide to equip the best stuff, as it was painfully obvious.

There were a couple of issues though. The amount of times you went into an extreme fight and the Warrior didn't have Gladiator levelled for Provoke (you needed level 22 for Provoke) or the DPS missing a massive damage boost from Blood for Blood (34 Lancer) or even not levelling Thaumaturge to level 26 for Swiftcast as a healer.

Part of this was likely due to people not realising that they were missing them, however, there were cases where people didn't want to level a job they did not want to play, just for the cross class actions, which is why they were likely done away with.

[Shurrikhan]

this is wanting the illusion of choice. in this game, the way it is played at high level means that only the most optimal build will be accepted.

Choice of "build" and choice of job have no distinction. They're both just... choices, and still pretty straightforward ones compared to the likes of opener, surrounding composition, stats, etc.

Or, by the same token, the only thing keeping job choice beyond a single job each per role from similarly being a mere "illusion" is just an external gimmick (limit break generation and %stat bonuses) that could as easily be applied to builds.

I don't think sub-jobs would be a worthwhile choice, but that warrant just does not work here without similarly condemning even one's ability to even pick a particular job.

Depending on how they're done, the larger issue with sub-classes is likely to be simply the diminishing returns between time required for building and maintaining those new choices vs. the sort of thematic spread or attractors they produce. Jobs are pretty visually distinct despite the homogeneity between how they play and what they ultimately offer. Sub-jobs would allow one to split hairs in novel ways that could allow for additional balancing challenges without particularly adding to the pool of aesthetics available.

Granted, again, that depends on how those sub-jobs are done. They could instead be mild tweaks that take very little design work while nonetheless significantly changing how the jobs feel to play, such as, say... between two forms of Dragon Kick on Monk that, despite rough overall balance as tight as to any other job, causes one to approach rotation and Lunar Blitzes rather differently. It really depends.

[Aurikai]

I'd rather have talents, or if possible multiple sub specializations like WoW with adjustable talents for each.

[Luluna]

I like sub jobs in FFXI and it works there. Like others have said a long time ago there was more options to choose from but that has long gone. The one thing I would love would be the Merit point system like in FFXI, the amount of wasted exp makes my head hurt! I am unsure if it could be brought in but It would be something I would really enjoy

[Payadopa]

They already don't get the normal jobs and balancing right...i don't want to imagine into what nightmare sub jobs would turn quickly...

So how about we don't balance the fun out if the game since it's anathema to it anyway? Meta slaves will always find the "best" way and be vocal about the rest.

[Payadopa]

this is wanting the illusion of choice. in this game, the way it is played at high level means that only the most optimal build will be accepted. then you have no choice in what to pick for your job or sub-job ability. This is why jobs are "complete" as they are already. the only thing that determines success in gameplay has and always will be - PLAYER SKILL. meaning, you can't rely on some mythical build to help get you through content. the main point to clearing content is to GIT GUD.

And yet I play with my static and eeeeevery person brings the job they like. Optimisation be damned. What an amazing concept, I know. Playing what you like.

Balance has its place but not to the point where we are right now. That's not a good enough reason to make the vast majority of the rest of the game unfulfilling either. And I've yet to see a PF group who shoots down [job] after they've been waiting for 45 minutes. People who always go on about the illusion of choice want the game to be as boring as possible, I swear. lol

[RitsukoSonoda]

And yet I play with my static and eeeeevery person brings the job they like. Optimisation be damned. What an amazing concept, I know. Playing what you like.

Balance has its place but not to the point where we are right now. That's not a good enough reason to make the vast majority of the rest of the game unfulfilling either. And I've yet to see a PF group who shoots down [job] after they've been waiting for 45 minutes. People who always go on about the illusion of choice want the game to be as boring as possible, I swear. lol

Personally I get the most replay value from games that literally throw mountains of options and choices at players and essentially leave the players to figure out what to do with them. However those titles usually try to encourage players to learn the system and look for ways to basically "break" the game lol. I have come across a couple MMO's like that in the past as well.

[Seig345]

Given Yoshi-P's team moved FFXIV away from this (1.0), and the "Role Abilities" we have now, I wouldn't count on this coming back unless they really feel the need to bring down another Dalamud and make Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Re-Reborn, Again, Please-Look-Forward-To-It Edition.