So why are the crafter relics.. bad.

[DixieBellOCE]

Crafted HQ saw:
Craft: +1208
Control: +638
CP: 0
Materia Slots: 5

Relic:
Craft: +1208
Control: +638
CP: +7
Materia Slots: 0

So you just meld.. one CP7 onto your HQ tool and its already 4 slots better than the relic since the 'increases to Quality are 1.75 timers higher than normal when material condition is good' is absolutely useless because everyone macro crafts.

Cmon.

It's just disappointing to see that the 'New' content just gives you downgrades over something that came out 4 months earlier.

Is it such a crime for a 'Relic' to be better than something you buy off the marketboard for 0 effort?

Square Enix can do better.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Um...because they're obviously more steps to it later down the road? We dont get anymore crafting tool updates till 7.0 So by next patch, the relic tools will be better than the indigator tools by stats and bonuses.

Speaking of which, yeah you also do realize the relics themselves have attached bonuses to stuff right?

[DixieBellOCE]

Um...because they're obviously more steps to it later down the road? We dont get anymore crafting tool updates till 7.0 So by next patch, the relic tools will be better than the indigator tools by stats and bonuses.

Speaking of which, yeah you also do realize the relics themselves have attached bonuses to stuff right?

If you are refering to the 'Increases to quality are 1.75 times higher when the material condidition is good' then the bonus is actually a complete waste of time because Macro crafting exists and there is no need to manually craft each step when you can just hit 1 button and afk to get the same result.

The next tier of crafting recipes release with patch 6.4, and will be crafted, sold and outdated LONG BEFORE THE NEXT RELIC STEP even releases.

The relics are literally pointless. And that is a sad thing to see. The Relic should be your BiS item when its required, not 4 months after.

[Atelier-Bagur]

If you are refering to the 'Increases to quality are 1.75 times higher when the material condidition is good' then the bonus is actually a complete waste of time because Macro crafting exists and there is no need to manually craft each step when you can just hit 1 button and afk to get the same result.

The next tier of crafting recipes release with patch 6.4, and will be crafted, sold and outdated LONG BEFORE THE NEXT RELIC STEP even releases.

The relics are literally pointless. And that is a sad thing to see. The Relic should be your BiS item when its required, not 4 months after.

Did you know that there's a little thing called "Expert Recipes" where you actually CANT MACRO them to do since you need to hit the buttons on the fly based on reactions of the item's condition? Looks like somebody didnt look into endgame crafting and just scrapped the surface of it.

How embarrasing.

[DixieBellOCE]

Did you know that there's a little thing called "Expert Recipes" where you actually CANT MACRO them to do since you need to hit the buttons on the fly based on reactions of the item's condition? Looks like somebody didnt look into endgame crafting and just scrapped the surface of it.

How embarrasing.

Well, consider how many expert recipes are currently in the game.

Anything below level 80, from patch 5.55 could just be brute forced through the use of macros using purple script gear. This includes the skysteel tool recipes.

Now how many endwalker expert recipes currently exist? And should a relic be designed around a niche crafting system that is barely used? No.

The relic should provide a perk that is used in every part of crafting, whether its something as simple as 'recipes have a 1% chance to save a material at completion for each step during the craft'

[Atelier-Bagur]

Well, consider how many expert recipes are currently in the game.

Anything below level 80, from patch 5.55 could just be brute forced through the use of macros using purple script gear. This includes the skysteel tool recipes.

Now how many endwalker expert recipes currently exist? And should a relic be designed around a niche crafting system that is barely used? No.

The relic should provide a perk that is used in every part of crafting, whether its something as simple as 'recipes have a 1% chance to save a material at completion for each step during the craft'

You can literally say this just about everything in this game. Do we really need savage gear even though the content is clearable with the bare minimum entry gear you already have? Do we really need to have Ultimates for the small percentage of people that do em?

Also not everyone is going to have indigator tools because A. lack of money B. lack of patience to craft it themselves (or lack the required jobs) and C. Macro crafts only is viable for the people whom pentameld their gear. Not everyone is going to be on the same playing field so the relic is useful for a lot of people than you may think for an easy way to get catch up tools.


Please, actually start using your brain

[DiaDeem]

If you are refering to the 'Increases to quality are 1.75 times higher when the material condidition is good'

No, they'll get higher Control/Crafting/CP stats all around. Indagator is the last crafted set we'll get for Endwalker, just like the Aesthete stuff was the last set we got in Shadowbringers. I didn't finish my Skysteel tools, but just my Skysung Needle has better stats than the Aesthete's Needle, and it's not even the finished version.

Aesthete's Needle HQ (iLv 490)
Craftsmanship: +806
Control: +441
5 Materia Slots

Skysung Needle (iLv 500)
Craftsmanship: +830
Control: +455
CP: +6

Skybuilders' Needle (iLv 510) Complete Relic
Craftsmanship: +854
Control: +468
CP: +6

So not only will we get better stats for sure, we'll also get the bonus on quality steps, which the Skysteel Tools didn't have, if I remember correctly.

[SaltyDaddy]

No, they'll get higher Control/Crafting/CP stats all around. Indagator is the last crafted set we'll get for Endwalker, just like the Aesthete stuff was the last set we got in Shadowbringers. I didn't finish my Skysteel tools, but just my Skysung Needle has better stats than the Aesthete's Needle, and it's not even the finished version.

Aesthete's Needle HQ (iLv 490)
Craftsmanship: +806
Control: +441
5 Materia Slots

Skysung Needle (iLv 500)
Craftsmanship: +830
Control: +455
CP: +6

Skybuilders' Needle (iLv 510) Complete Relic
Craftsmanship: +854
Control: +468
CP: +6

So not only will we get better stats for sure, we'll also get the bonus on quality steps, which the Skysteel Tools didn't have, if I remember correctly.

Thats funny, because I still have my pentamelded 490 gear. I have 485 control +6 CP on my tools, which was much better than finished relic. I never cared about relic, because it would be a downgrade, as you dont care about craftmanship, once you hit a breakpoint you needed for crafting and didnt wanted to remeld my whole gear. So no, "better starts for sure" is bs and just pure lie.

Seriously. Most of the coments here never crafted it seems. Crafter relics are useless even in the last step. And I dont care about the bonus for expert crafts, as I have no problem crafting those even with current crafted gear. Just money and time sink to get a shiny tool you cant even show off.

Stop justifying bad system just because its in your favourite game. I get battle relics not being bis, as they are simple to get and are usually fun (At least back in ShB). But crafter relic is dull and not even worth as "side class upgrade" stuff.

Relics should be grindy and on par, or at least close to pentamelded gear and added proc is cool, but useless.

Oooh, also also. WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT THE RELIC GETTING BETTER LATER? If I pentameld my gear now, I dont need to give a slightless fuck about some relic step getting better in 8 months or so. So no, "it will get better" is a bad argument, when crafted is better now.

[UkcsAlias]

Stop justifying bad system just because its in your favourite game. I get battle relics not being bis, as they are simple to get and are usually fun (At least back in ShB). But crafter relic is dull and not even worth as "side class upgrade" stuff.

The bad system in this case is that crafting can be easily macro'd because too many things have a static limitation.

While for gathering its often similar, it still faces a lot of RNG afterward, and GP management is also a thing (sure, you can spend an additional 300GP for another yield or 2, but you might want to save that for the next node).

I think that crafting HQ for the newest gear needs a big change.
For example (sure, there are flaws here, but its an example):
Instead of being a 0-100% situation on quality. It instead becomes a repeating cycle where you just want to compete as many cycles to increase odds. This means the quality bar is often filled several times.

Each cycle you get 1 stack, and each stack gives a HQ chance based on your craftmanship stat. And this can be translated into a 25% or 50% HQ rate (and we could also give it a point where 100% is possible, but for most of those older recipes i would just put them out of an expert recipe state). This rate is then used in a multiplicative system per stack: each cycle you reduce the chance of it being NQ by that percentage. 3 stacks at 25% is then only about 57%, while for 50% that would have been 87.5%. It keeps all stats relevant.

And yes, the newest gear might result in a lot of 'waste'. But the craft itself can obviously be made cheaper, or we make a new recipe to reuse the NQ part to try to convert it to HQ.

It would instantly negate macros for any recipe based on this system, as you realy want to push it to its limits. And macros wouldnt use the bonusses properly anymore.

[Oldschoolegamer38]

Thats funny, because I still have my pentamelded 490 gear. I have 485 control +6 CP on my tools, which was much better than finished relic. I never cared about relic, because it would be a downgrade, as you dont care about craftmanship, once you hit a breakpoint you needed for crafting and didnt wanted to remeld my whole gear. So no, "better starts for sure" is bs and just pure lie.

Seriously. Most of the coments here never crafted it seems. Crafter relics are useless even in the last step. And I dont care about the bonus for expert crafts, as I have no problem crafting those even with current crafted gear. Just money and time sink to get a shiny tool you cant even show off.

Stop justifying bad system just because its in your favourite game. I get battle relics not being bis, as they are simple to get and are usually fun (At least back in ShB). But crafter relic is dull and not even worth as "side class upgrade" stuff.

Relics should be grindy and on par, or at least close to pentamelded gear and added proc is cool, but useless.

Oooh, also also. WHO THE FUCK CARES ABOUT THE RELIC GETTING BETTER LATER? If I pentameld my gear now, I dont need to give a slightless fuck about some relic step getting better in 8 months or so. So no, "it will get better" is a bad argument, when crafted is better now.

wow flawed logic and troll...